38 replies to this topic

[PinkyAndTheBrain]

Hi, I really like the old mechwarrior mechs llke the shadowhawk, marauder, warhammer and battlemaster. Will we be able to play these mechs in the future? Are there any plans to bring them to MWO?

[ScrapIron Prime]

This has been discussed to death.

Short answer... there are no announcements of plans to do so. there may likely be copyright issues preventing them from using the original designs or anything reasonably graphically close. Redesigned concept art (or re-seen) are also unannounced.

Edited by ScrapIron Prime, 08 August 2012 - 11:49 AM.

[Stickjock]

From the FAQ

Quote

Q. Will the unseen Mechs make it into the game after all?

A. Look forward to a future announcement.

[CompanionCube]

Sorry, i just had too.

the pinky, the pinky and the brain, brain ,brain brain,brain, brain ,brain brain,brain, brain ,brain brain

Love your nick.

[OmegaMinion]

The Maruader MKII is honestly, one of the only 'Mechs I want to see, Besides, there is a scetch of a more Mad Cat like one on Sarna, that looks nothing like a Zentradi Officer Pod.



I mean really, do you think Harmony Gold can pull copyright out of there hat with this for the in-game model?

Edited by OmegaMinion, 08 August 2012 - 12:17 PM.

[Redshift2k5]

When the Mechwarrior 5 trailer was made, many Unseen were Reseen.

That agreement has since expired and they're back to legal limbo; PGI is a small company working very hard to bring MWO, and they don't seem able to bring the money or legal power to bear in order to re-negotiate these rights.

so far, it seems we will have to make due with similar mechs (see:Jagermech instead of Rifleman) until such a time as a new agreement is reached regarding the unseen (which are owned by separate companies with different stances on their IP)

[Hayden]

We'll always have project Phoenix.

[Glitched Naga]

[color=#959595]When the Mechwarrior 5 trailer was made, many Unseen were Reseen.[/color]

acctualy, the mechwarrior 5 trailer only showed 1 mech, which was the Warhammer. just for correction. But yes, the legal issue is a problem in implementing these mechs into the game.

[Mousehold]

The old unseen mechs were borrowed from other fictions such as Macross, where you can find the sources for the Warhammer (Tomahawk) and Marauder (Glaug). I think it's time we forgot about those and let them go. Mechwarrior deserves its own intellectual property. We have plenty of iconic mechs now anyway like the Atlas and Mad Cat, so it's not worth spending so much time and effort just to copy others out of some misplaced nostalgia.

[avatar]

Actually looking at the explanation, the specific Unseen models are still Unseen, except where the involved companies have managed to license them. (Technically, "Unseen" status means "cannot be displayed in North America", but since that's a big market, this means no one gets those.) Reseen are the "re-designed" new models that in the fluff are based on the old models. And then I think there is a "preseen" project which is supposed to show the "primitive" versions of the 'Mechs in question. Admitted, I am currently not even completely certain which company owns the franchise (as opposed to licensing it).

Since there are a few changes on the models, I wouldn't mind a redesign of the Unseen models, either, even if for some it might be "wrong". But if there's an Unseen remodeling, then that work needs to be done with care or we'll see quite a bit of flaming on the forums. So at least right now the devs have more pressing things to do.

...but damn it, I want a Battlemaster.

[Redshift2k5]

avatar, on 08 August 2012 - 12:53 PM, said:

Actually looking at the explanation, the specific Unseen models are still Unseen, except where the involved companies have managed to license them. (Technically, "Unseen" status means "cannot be displayed in North America", but since that's a big market, this means no one gets those.) Reseen are the "re-designed" new models that in the fluff are based on the old models. And then I think there is a "preseen" project which is supposed to show the "primitive" versions of the 'Mechs in question. Admitted, I am currently not even completely certain which company owns the franchise (as opposed to licensing it).

Since there are a few changes on the models, I wouldn't mind a redesign of the Unseen models, either, even if for some it might be "wrong". But if there's an Unseen remodeling, then that work needs to be done with care or we'll see quite a bit of flaming on the forums. So at least right now the devs have more pressing things to do.

...but damn it, I want a Battlemaster.

The problem is, if, for example, I make a new Reseen design and sell it, and after I put it on the market the owner of it's original unseen version decides to take me to court, I still have to pay legal fees to defend it and the judge could easily rule in favour of the owner of the original design. It becomes a judge's decision whether the design is similar or dissimilar enough, and they'll want to side with the originator since I look like i'm trying to rip off the original for financial gain. (how many judges are BT players? how many are game designers?) and then I've got some big legal and financial problems. Even winning the case is costly!

A lot easier to avoid the risk and just release 'safe' mech designs.

[CocoaJin]

not aslong as Macross/Robotech(whatever incarnation it is) still has DVDs, models, toys, etc, etc to make a dollar on. Think about it, maybe they want to be open to a Robotech/Macross Online, similar to MWO. They'd be in a bind if there primary units are tied up/in use in a Mechwarrior game.

Edited by CocoaJin, 08 August 2012 - 01:53 PM.

[JFlash49]

been discussed too much...my answer...i dont know...

[Badgerpants]

Short answer, No!

Long answer, Not in this universe while harmony gold (intentional lowercase) has North American rights to Robotech!

[Mechxican JAKE]

Whenever I see the names Marauder or Warhammer, in the back of my mind I imagine hearing the Mw2 female computer's voice saying it haha.

[Mousehold]

Mechwarrior isn't the only franchise to suffer here. Plenty of stuff from Japan, such as Super Robot Wars, fails to make it to the west in part because of the nightmare that is all of the different license holders in the US for various franchises. It doesn't matter what the original IP holders in Japan think about the Reseen (or SRW) if the American license holders don't want to cooperate.

[Badgerpants]

OmegaMinion, on 08 August 2012 - 12:10 PM, said:

The Maruader MKII is honestly, one of the only 'Mechs I want to see, Besides, there is a scetch of a more Mad Cat like one on Sarna, that looks nothing like a Zentradi Officer Pod.



I mean really, do you think Harmony Gold can pull copyright out of there hat with this for the in-game model?

Dude, that thing is hideous! I'd rather root canal work than to pilot that monstrocity!

[CharlieV]

I tried to google some info about unseen and rights to them. It looks like Harmony gold is aware of price of these rights and thats the reason why they are so stubborn in proclaiming that they have rights to them.

BUT! Japanese court (if we can trust wiki in this case) said that because HG got their license to Macross (and others to make Robotech series) from company Tatsunoko Production, it only have distribution rights, not rights to intellectual property (including mech designs) which are holded by Studio Nue, creators of the serie.

Main problem is, like Redshift2k5 said, untill some american court says "You DONT HAVE rights to Macross intellectual property, only distrubution rights." there still will be problems with rights to unseen mechs. And that trial wont be cheap one, cause Harmony Gold smells money. FASA did not have intention to protect rights to unseen, they didnt have any in their days of glory, nor now, in state of clinic death, and Catalyst Game labs probably dont wanna spend unnecesary money to some cause with maybe guaranteed result, but costly result.

Only way to succeed is in my opinion some form of pressure from Japan. HG spend large money to make new enhanced version (thank you Sephlock for info ) and Japanese maybe arent pleased with their stubbornes on rights they actually dont own. So depending on agreement they have with HG they can make some pressure to "soften" management and make them if not give up the right, then to sell them for reasonable amount of money.

Or maybe there can be other way: make your MWO server on toher country and simly add proclamation "Im not from united states" to registration. If you confirm this, you can add Unseen to your mechbay. Every player can have them, everything perfectly legal, and who will check all these IP adresses, if theyre american or for example Spanish or Russian? Similar method was used by many players of Battlefield 3 for earlier acces to game - first release was in South Korea, so they make thei IP south korean. In extreme, we all can be Japanese so good bye HG XD

[SMDMadCow]

Project Phoenix.

Next please.

[GeneralArmchair]

OmegaMinion, on 08 August 2012 - 12:10 PM, said:

The Maruader MKII is honestly, one of the only 'Mechs I want to see, Besides, there is a scetch of a more Mad Cat like one on Sarna, that looks nothing like a Zentradi Officer Pod.



I mean really, do you think Harmony Gold can pull copyright out of there hat with this for the in-game model?

Good god that looks horrible. I hope they never use that monstrosity. That torso weapon isn't even centered over the cockpit.

Flying Debris' design is MUCH better.