69 replies to this topic

[Blackdog]

MW3 mechlab was sucks because of the frankenstein teory of mechs.
This may be not so bad. But it isn't mechwarrior. It's like some kind of anime mecha that you could customize from up to arse. But for balance of the MMO it will be very bad. It will kill all the spirit of Battletech.
But I believe that our developers will hadle it and make more canon than MW3

[Stormeris]

I liked MW4 excuse for mechlab, :/

[John Clavell]

I think we've had confirmation that the MechLab is not going to be the same as previous incarnations. The 'Slot' and 'Module' system, which is equipment added to the Mech in addition to its total tonnage is certainly a signal that this is not 'business as usual' for MechWarrior or the MechLab.

Edited by John Clavell, 05 February 2012 - 01:18 AM.

[trycksh0t]

If I may interject;

Paul Inouye, on 04 February 2012 - 10:45 PM, said:

Now to the OP:

This one is for you buds...

Spoiler

The information you're seeking is part of Mech Warfare month. Sorry to make you wait but you're gonna get hit with a storm of information when we talk about Mech Warfare which includes how and what gets customized as well as how combat is going to play out on the battlefield.

We'll know more. Hopefully soon. Very soon.

[Habokku]

John Clavell, on 05 February 2012 - 01:17 AM, said:

I think we've had confirmation that the MechLab is not going to be the same as previous incarnations. The 'Slot' and 'Module' system, which is equipment added to the Mech in addition to its total tonnage is certainly a signal that this is not 'business as usual' for MechWarrior or the MechLab.

Precisely John.

I'm eagerly anticipating how exactly PGI does the 'mechlab. I trust them to have an eye towards balance of this purely PvP game while still granting us the ability to tweak and let the tech-oriented folks tinker and play with their designs.

There is a golden mean, and I have a feeling they'll find it without too much issue.

<S>

-Havoc
A.K.A. Habokku

[sadamle]

Mech3 turned every 'mech into an Omni 'mech.

[Judas Ebon Michaels]

A MW4 style mechlab wouldn't be so bad if it more accurately depicted the critical slots the weapons and ammo take up. One problem I had with MW4 mech customization is that you could put an AC 20 in a center torso; where's the engine supposed to go?

[Sidney]

sadamle, on 05 February 2012 - 01:44 AM, said:

Mech3 turned every 'mech into an Omni 'mech.

It did far more than that.

An Omnimech has a set amount of tonnage that allows you to configure as you see fit. If you have 20 tons of 'pod space' you can fit weapons and heatsinks on it up to 20 tons...provided you had them on hand and the pods.

Mechwarrior3 allowed you to change 'fixed' equipment as well- engines, internal structure, armour etc. All of which not only requires significant time, skill and facilities... but reprogramming the gyro.

Omnimech or not, you can't change out the internal structure of a 'mech on the frontlines. Or simply swap out the engine for a smaller size like you could in MW3. On the other hand, for multiplayer...it could be a bit fun at times- allowing you to design your own 'mech with the exception of the tonnage.

While I love Battletech, I did prefer Mechwarrior's 4 take on things rather than Mechwarrior3. Considering MWO is supposed to be, well, more of an MMO...I hope they took a more restrictive approach. Not every mercenary or house unit has the money and resources to overhaul their entire 'mech between skirmishes afterall.

[Maximilian Thorn]

I liked the mechlab in MW4.

The Upside to MW4 Mechlab
It made you really think about weapon loadouts for that particular Mech. Yellow hardpoints for ballistics, orange hardpoints for energy weapons, green hardpoints for missiles. It gave a version of "realism" for a particular Mech design (with the exception of the OmniMech's "all-purpose" gray hardpoints).

The Downside to MW4 Mechlab
If you didn't like a certain's Mech's hardpoints...you tended not to use it. For example, I thought the Fafnir looked awesome. It allowed two Heavy Gauss Rifles to be mounted in the torso; however, it had no missile hard points...at all. If you enjoyed using SRMs and LRMS...then this was not the Mech for you. I know people have mixed feelings on this. Some say, "Why have a laser boat Catapult, when it was originally designed to carry LRMs?" Good question; however, some fans would answer, "Because I like the look of a Catapult, but not its original loadout."

On a side note: As I have noted in an earlier thread, having fellow human teammates will allow me to not solely rely on myself. I can actually have good ballistic or missile weapons and not be afraid to use them due to ammo limitations.

With the urban setup of the maps (i.e. lots of buildings to move around or hide behind or take cover), I think using lasers exclusively will be unnecessary. Will some still do it? Yes, of course. Lasers are cool after all...but then again, so are Gauss Rifles, Autocannons, LRMs, SRMS and so on.

Edited by Maximilian Thorn, 05 February 2012 - 03:51 AM.

[Nik Van Rhijn]

The only thing we do know is that the Mechlab will have "dropdowns". It could be that when you hover your mouse over the mech name/designation you will get a list ov the variant packs that you can apply (with cost and time). Do the same over a weapon and you can get the option to remove or what you can swap it for. If you have removed items and freed up weight then hovering over an empty slot will give tou a list of weapons/equipment/armour you can add etc. We should remember that this is a re-boot and PGI have shown so far that they want to do a change from what hs been done before. The one thing we can therefore be sure about is that Mechlab wont be what we have seen so far.

[Mason Grimm]

Jacob posted on MechSpecs.com the following and I think it's probably pretty sound logic.

Quote

They are slowly releasing a little more information at a time. I wonder if they will have limited customization. Weapon hardpoint types would be okay I guess? In order to change those hardpoint types you would have to buy a variant/refit kit?

For instance in the MAD-4S Marauder II right torso you could put an LBX-10 since that is what it comes with but if you wanted to change those to rockets you would have to buy the MAD-4H variant/refit kit. Then you are now able to put rockets, missiles whatever in that slot.

That would allow for a lot of customization without allowing for total laser boating fails

That would be pretty new and "out of the box" thinking?

I think it would help prevent boats as well as allow much more versatility in terms of actual load-out without allowing for a "Archer in a Warhammers body" kinda thing.

FYI: I merged MechLab and "Talk about Mech Armament is suspiciously absent..." because they are essentially covering the same thing.

Edited by Mason Grimm, 05 February 2012 - 05:50 AM.

[Liam]

Judas Ebon Michaels, on 05 February 2012 - 02:15 AM, said:

A MW4 style mechlab wouldn't be so bad if it more accurately depicted the critical slots the weapons and ammo take up. One problem I had with MW4 mech customization is that you could put an AC 20 in a center torso; where's the engine supposed to go?

A mix of both labs could be the best solution for customization.
With two layers (that share limited critical space):
MW3 Equipment layer: Ammo, JJ,Heat sinks etc.
MW4 Weapon slot layer: weapons

[Durant Carlyle]

Mason Grimm, on 04 February 2012 - 02:27 PM, said:

Reduce that number being that we are limited by tech in the timeline?

Of course. Plus, they should limit the 'initial' variants even within the number that are available according to the timeline. In the Locust's case, six would be available at game start. Maybe limit that initially to three?

[Aegis Kleais]

If you do not have the ability from the ground up to enter a sandbox mode, which would allow you to create any Mech you wanted, customize them any way possible and pit them against customized Mechs (even if there is no AI attached to them), then the idea of skill trees resetting or being maintained for every variant you create would result in a massive amount of frustration as you lose all your experience as you're finding just what kind of loadout works best for you.

[Unclecid]

Aegis Kleais™, on 04 February 2012 - 11:09 AM, said:

PAUL'S FRENCH!?!?! ... .. .

no..worse...he is

french Canadian

[Star Ranger]

I think that this debate would be better solved on the feild with mechs than words but does make for good reading

[Brakkyn]

I think the only thing these posts really do is show how diversified people are with their opinions. It's tough to find two people who agree 100% on anything. Some are more accepting than others on different things; others are adamant about one system or another.

Regardless of all the talk, it would seem 'Mech Warfare month will answer a few, many, or all of our questions and end much speculation--and start alot of grieving.

[zverofaust]

Paul Inouye, on 04 February 2012 - 10:45 PM, said:

Now to the OP:

This one is for you buds...

Spoiler

The information you're seeking is part of Mech Warfare month. Sorry to make you wait but you're gonna get hit with a storm of information when we talk about Mech Warfare which includes how and what gets customized as well as how combat is going to play out on the battlefield.

And when is Mech Warfare month going to be!??! Next month!? Oh god it's only the 5th...

[Aegis Kleais]

Unclecid, on 05 February 2012 - 06:51 AM, said:

no..worse...he is

french Canadian

*head 'splodes*

[Solis Obscuri]

Maximilian Thorn, on 05 February 2012 - 03:31 AM, said:

I liked the mechlab in MW4.

The Upside to MW4 Mechlab
It made you really think about weapon loadouts for that particular Mech. Yellow hardpoints for ballistics, orange hardpoints for energy weapons, green hardpoints for missiles. It gave a version of "realism" for a particular Mech design (with the exception of the OmniMech's "all-purpose" gray hardpoints).

The Downside to MW4 Mechlab
If you didn't like a certain's Mech's hardpoints...you tended not to use it. For example, I thought the Fafnir looked awesome. It allowed two Heavy Gauss Rifles to be mounted in the torso; however, it had no missile hard points...at all. If you enjoyed using SRMs and LRMS...then this was not the Mech for you. I know people have mixed feelings on this. Some say, "Why have a laser boat Catapult, when it was originally designed to carry LRMs?" Good question; however, some fans would answer, "Because I like the look of a Catapult, but not its original loadout."

The limitations on what you could put where in MW4 didn't bother me, either, I liked that part of the system.

With "variants" on a chassis, I could see it being either

• Variants with set design loadouts that can't be customized, besides our "module" loadouts
  
• Variants that change the performance of the chassis (e.g. engine power, armor quantity, jump jets/no jump jets) but allow us flexible usage of pod space for weapons, but little else.
  
• Variants shift around what type of pod space is available a la MW4, but the base chassis performance remains the same.
  
• Some combination of 2 and 3.

Maximilian Thorn, on 05 February 2012 - 03:31 AM, said:

On a side note: As I have noted in an earlier thread, having fellow human teammates will allow me to not solely rely on myself. I can actually have good ballistic or missile weapons and not be afraid to use them due to ammo limitations.

With the urban setup of the maps (i.e. lots of buildings to move around or hide behind or take cover), I think using lasers exclusively will be unnecessary. Will some still do it? Yes, of course. Lasers are cool after all...but then again, so are Gauss Rifles, Autocannons, LRMs, SRMS and so on.

I think this will be the case, so long as the weapons are balanced correctly respective to each other in terms of accuracy, cycle time, heat build-up, etc. and factors like heat build-up and dissipation rates have a significant impact on gameplay.