6 replies to this topic

[PaintedWolf]

I notice a lot in game, and came to the conclusion indendently that boats work. Especially lots of Brawler Boats in Big Numbers on a Single-Objective. It really sucks to be on the receiving end of that.

So I made a group very Inferno and Jump Jet capable, that way they can directly drop on a target and Inferno. With 90% of structures that's zero way to defend right?

Quote

Shikoku-Forums

Mass: 85 tons
Tech Base: Inner Sphere
Chassis Config: Biped
Rules Level: Experimental Tech
Era: Dark Ages
Tech Rating/Era Availability: E/X-X-F
Production Year: 3132
Cost: 22,578,633 C-Bills
Battle Value: 1,863

Chassis: Unknown Endo-Steel
Power Plant: Unknown 340 Fusion XL Engine
Walking Speed: 43.2 km/h
Maximum Speed: 64.8 km/h
Jump Jets: Unknown
Jump Capacity: 150 meters
Armor: Unknown Standard Armor
Armament:
3 Streak SRM-6s
3 SRM-6s
1 C3 Computer (Slave)
Manufacturer: Unknown
Primary Factory: Unknown
Communications System: Unknown
Targeting and Tracking System: Unknown

================================================================================
Equipment Type Rating Mass
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Internal Structure: Endo-Steel 130 points 4.50
Internal Locations: 5 LT, 5 RT, 2 LL, 2 RL
Engine: XL Fusion Engine 340 13.50
Walking MP: 4
Running MP: 6
Jumping MP: 5 Improved
Jump Jet Locations: 1 CT, 2 LT, 2 RT 10.00
Heat Sinks: Double Heat Sink 13(26) 3.00
Gyro: Standard 4.00
Cockpit: Standard 3.00
Actuators: L: SH+UA R: SH+UA
Armor: Standard Armor AV - 248 15.50
CASE II Locations: 1 LA, 1 RA 2.00

Internal Armor
Structure Factor
Head 3 9
Center Torso 27 39
Center Torso (rear) 10
L/R Torso 18 27
L/R Torso (rear) 9
L/R Arm 14 26
L/R Leg 18 33

================================================================================
Equipment Location Heat Critical Mass
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
3 SRM-6s RA 12 6 9.00
3 Streak SRM-6s LA 12 6 13.50
C3 Computer (Slave) HD 0 1 1.00
@SRM-6 (30) RA - 2 2.00
@SRM-6 (Inferno) (15) RA - 1 1.00
@Streak SRM-6 (45) LA - 3 3.00
Free Critical Slots: 0

BattleForce Statistics
MV S (+0) M (+2) L (+4) E (+6) Wt. Ov Armor: 8 Points: 19
4/5j 4 4 0 0 4 0 Structure: 4
Special Abilities: C3S, CASEII, SRCH, ES, SEAL, SOA, SRM 2/2/0

So I really, really like CASE 2. Near most useful thing in the world sometimes.

C3 always a good idea. Wish I could fit in ECM but cannot without removing CASE 2. Streak-Missiles are for direct engagement against Battlemechs. Infernos a little low in ammo imo but enough to get a job done.

So how many ways would there be to counter, say, 12 of these dropping down directly on a building or complex and using Infernos? I mean they would run out of ammo in 50 seconds, but 15 hexes would be on fire by then. I dunno I would do it.

Edit 1- XL Engine- in TT this means a lot more because there are zero module or hardpoint restrictions. So yeah JJs can go on a Stalker-equivalent. And Infernos are pretty effective in TT. And can you just imagine what 2+ Streak SRM-6s do? And the Mech has Improved Jump Jets, so it can jump like a Jenner, and drop 18 Streak SRMs and 18 SRMs and burn buildings down in seconds? And CASE 2 helps protect XL Engines. Yes XL is expensive, but in TT Mechs die from a LOT of things other then Engines.

Battlemech Leading Causes of Death:

Number 1- Ammo Explosions- 2 Pilot Damage, everything else dead pretty much. Mech downed most likely or very crippled.

Number 2- Gyro/Leg Stuff- Okay your Mech is not dead. You can still get that AC/10 in the back. But I count these as dead on my side (if not on my side I like a good TSM-Myomer Assault Quad for that ol' 40 point kick. ) (Technically 80 point Mule Kick )

Number 3- Generally blown up.

Number 4- Legged, This last has serious implications on TT. The Mech is effectively out of the game. It is being legged and falling over every 30-60 meters. And falling over can destroy your Mech (have had that happen. )

Don't get me wrong, engine hits are a leading cause of death. But XLs increase options by a lot more and are a lot less a leading cause of death in TT then in a game with Focus Fire.

So my questions are:

1- How would you defend against this? Say a Company just dropped on your Supply Depot, or Ammo Depot, or Factory or Aerospace Bay? (I would like to take out an Aerospace Bay if I could).

2- Could Dropship help Reinforce after the fact? Would this work with Battle Armor Reinforcements?

3- Could this work in Open Terrain- Skirmish under any circumstances?

4- How badly do Infernos PLUS Infantry need to be added to MWO just so you can Inferno Infantry?

Edited by PaintedWolf, 06 January 2013 - 01:34 AM.

[PaintedWolf]

Also Infernos create smoke, and fires spread. So I got the idea from how a heavily fortified world of the Lyrans was taken by a Clan Elemental Drop under the evil Steiner in the FedCom Civil War or around that time, with Adam Steiner noting all the Long Tom Artillery Cannons had been used before and not worked as a tactic or "he'd seen similar tactics." and the Clans got offended and just dropped Toads into the enemy base. Now Battle Armor with Infernos being added to the Mech Composition I would not be against. But Elementals can be Inferno-killed far more easily then a Battlemech. A Battlemech has a much better chance at getting out alive or hitting auxiliary targets. Also the Streak SRM is essential for precise attacks in an Urban Environment, where Civilian Opinion will matter.

Fact of the matter is, a barrage of Infernos kills everything in Battletech, except, pretty much a Battlemech or Dropship or Jump Ship. Also Mechs drop really fast, and are harder to kill then Battle Armor in my opinion.

Are Mechs harder to kill then Battle Armor?

Okay after taking base, Star Captain comes up and notes to Smoke Jaguar Galaxy Commander "We Skirmished them to death, after they burned down our factory." 3-2-1

Okay the Building could be Hardened. But that is a big Alpha. Agree or Disagree- Do Infernos Work?

Edited by PaintedWolf, 06 January 2013 - 01:47 AM.

[PaintedWolf]

[Kobold]

You're paying 1800 bv for something that moves 4/6/5 and has no weapons longer than 9 hexes? What do you plan on running in its lance? Right now I'm pretty underwhelmed. In a campaign setting, you're paying 22 million c-bills too.

PaintedWolf, on 06 January 2013 - 01:17 AM, said:

1- How would you defend against this? Say a Company just dropped on your Supply Depot, or Ammo Depot, or Factory or Aerospace Bay? (I would like to take out an Aerospace Bay if I could).

2- Could Dropship help Reinforce after the fact? Would this work with Battle Armor Reinforcements?

3- Could this work in Open Terrain- Skirmish under any circumstances?

4- How badly do Infernos PLUS Infantry need to be added to MWO just so you can Inferno Infantry?

1+2) I am lumping these together, because both deal with attacking a fixed location.

You're stacking the deck in your favor here. A company of assaults "dropping on my [ defensive objective ]" means I'm screwed, generally speaking, if my objective is to prevent that objective's destruction.

If I am defending something that would be worth dropping a company of assaults (expensive, high tech assaults at that) on with dropship support, odds are I have significant layered defenses. Between aerospace assets and surface to air weapons, my goal would to be make it extremely difficult for you to get your assaults into range in the first place.

Once you're in range, of course you do a ton of damage. Duh.

3) This is your real problem though. You have 22 million C-bill short range brawlers that can be taken apart by 5 million C-bill GRF-1N Griffins or any other similar mediums that have decent speed and at least one longer range weapon. If the target in question 1 and 2 has the anti-air assets to force you to land farther out and walk in, you're going to be significantly damaged by harrassing forces before you ever close with your target. Even something as mundane as a Manticore or Bulldog could drive away from you (barring bad terrain) and keep plinking at medium/long range while you're powerless to stop it.

4) Infernos are excellent for killing infantry, but frankly I prefer using them on smaller, faster vees to shut down opposing assaults.

-------------------

General Summary:

You made a super specialist. That is generally fine, there are plenty of specialists. However you are now advocating using an attack force of ONLY specialists, and only ONE KIND of specialist. Unless you have complete strategic domination (meaning you have complete control over when and where you fight) you will be taking significant damage from anyone using more mixed forces.

[Chas]

Kobold, on 06 January 2013 - 02:33 PM, said:

You're paying 1800 bv for something that moves 4/6/5 and has no weapons longer than 9 hexes? What do you plan on running in its lance? Right now I'm pretty underwhelmed. In a campaign setting, you're paying 22 million c-bills too.

A high-tonnage Urbanmech?

[dal10]

here is an ultra specialist that arguably can go it solo. when you are running a mech with only 9 hex weapons you need to either A) have the speed to close into range, or terrain that limits engagement ranges to ones that favor you. your mech would not do well in an assault, however has a city defense unit (provided you remove the infernos) you could probably take down several mechs per unit, as your firepower would chew them up.


gonzales

Mass: 50 tons
Tech Base: Clan
Chassis Config: Biped
Rules Level: Tournament Legal
Era: Clan Invasion
Tech Rating/Era Availability: F/X-X-D
Production Year: 3070
Cost: 11,003,875 C-Bills
Battle Value: 1,785

Chassis: Unknown Endo-Steel
Power Plant: Unknown 350 Fusion XL Engine
Walking Speed: 75.6 km/h
Maximum Speed: 118.8 km/h
Jump Jets: None
Jump Capacity: 0 meters
Armor: Unknown Ferro-Fibrous
Armament:
1 Ultra AC/20
1 ER Small Laser
Manufacturer: Unknown
Primary Factory: Unknown
Communications System: Unknown
Targeting and Tracking System: Unknown

================================================================================
Equipment Type Rating Mass
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Internal Structure: Endo-Steel 83 points 2.50
Internal Locations: 1 HD, 1 CT, 1 LT, 1 RT, 1 RA, 1 LL, 1 RL
Engine: XL Fusion Engine 350 15.00
Walking MP: 7
Running MP: 11
Jumping MP: 0
Heat Sinks: Double Heat Sink 10(20) 0.00
Gyro: Standard 4.00
Cockpit: Standard 3.00
Actuators: L: SH+UA+LA+H R: SH+UA+LA+H
Armor: Ferro-Fibrous AV - 169 9.00
Armor Locations: 1 CT, 2 LT, 1 RT, 1 RA, 1 LL, 1 RL
CASE Locations: LT, RT, RA 0.00

Internal Armor
Structure Factor
Head 3 9
Center Torso 16 24
Center Torso (rear) 8
L/R Torso 12 18
L/R Torso (rear) 6
L/R Arm 8 16
L/R Leg 12 24

================================================================================
Equipment Location Heat Critical Mass
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
ER Small Laser RA 2 1 0.50
Ultra AC/20 LA 7 8 12.00
@Ultra AC/20 (5) RT - 1 1.00
@Ultra AC/20 (10) LT - 2 2.00
@Ultra AC/20 (5) RA - 1 1.00
Free Critical Slots: 16

BattleForce Statistics
MV S (+0) M (+2) L (+4) E (+6) Wt. Ov Armor: 6 Points: 18
7 4 4 0 0 2 0 Structure: 3
Special Abilities: CASE, SRCH, ES, SEAL, SOA

[Escef]

Oh. Dear. Gods.

It's Dermezel. Still tinkering around with slow, short range specialists I see.