47 replies to this topic

[Vernius Ix]

LakeDaemon, on 28 February 2012 - 11:21 AM, said:

There is discussion, there is remembrance, there is teaching to never repeat the horrors of the past. This is not it. This is simple and graphic exploitation. So.. the aim of this snip is to make this webseries look gritty and edgy and to make people subscribe. (nearly %50 of it just say subscribe to see chapter 2).

Imo, Tyr chose poorly, naively, and then tried to make himself look noble by saying it was his mission to raise awareness of some kind.

Just because you scream the sky is falling, doesn't mean it actually is.

[Mr MEAN]

LakeDaemon, on 28 February 2012 - 09:59 AM, said:

I find it deeply offensive that you'd choose to use actual holocaust footage of real people who were starved to death for your fictitious venture. I don't think you are callous but probably just naive or desensitized to what you are showing.

The first person who says. "Aw lighten up." Is welcome to present this short film in a synagogue or to people who still have prison camp numbers tattooed on their forearms.

This is fiction. There no need to insult the memories of those who died in reality just to make your film look edgy and gritty.

So images of "not real" people are ok?
What about images of victims of the crusades?, or the Gulag or Japanese War prisons, They suffered as well.
Or maybe just "No pictures of those who suffered" are allowed.
Besides, who are you to say that anyone but you are offended.
Really, how many actual holocaust victims do you think will watch a mechwarrior video?
Any Holocaust image that repulses people works to remind and educate people against real Tyranny and thus is a good thing, regardless of what video it is embedded in.
The prison camp numbers were the punch-card reference numbers from a subsidiarity company of IBM , should we not put references to IBM in the video ?
I don't say "Lighten up", I say that you seem to what to project your naive view into the world to censor it to conform to your vision of what is appropriate.
A thoughtful and open minded person needs no one to tell them how to view this.
Maybe don't worry about what others may find offensive, just worry about yourself.


See you on the field.

Mr.MEAN

Edited by Mr MEAN, 28 February 2012 - 11:44 AM.

[Ephisus]

Hello all,

I'm the director of this project, I thought I'd chime in.

Firstly,

Quote

Speaking as a Jew, the footage combined with the dialgoue running over gives context to the images and reinforces the horrible nature of what is shown. It is not offensve. Its powerful.

Thank you so much for this, it really gladdens me to see that people are really capable of withstanding emotionally intense media, and walk away with their *mind* spoken to at the same instant.

Wrt the negative feedback.

In order to suggest that putting historical tragedy into a piece of fiction categorically "trivializes" the event, regardless of what's being expressed, is to suggest that fiction is trivial on it's face.

I put it to the onlookers here to examine for themselves if they believe that fiction is categorically trivial... or, in it's purest form, if it is meant to be meaningful.

Ultimately, it's Apsis Motion Picture's goal and desire to express meaningful things through film. History begs for such "exploitation".

Edited by Ephisus, 28 February 2012 - 11:48 AM.

[Sug]

Very impressive

Have you considered doing a Robot Jox remake

[The Echo Inside]

Looks potentially interesting, will keep an eye on it.

And would say, your BTS is rather clear on your intentions and usage. Drawing parallels or evoking emotions from the past or present to relate to, or to simply set the mood, for fiction or otherwise, is as old as writing, or theatre, etc, etc. To get criticised for it, when the objective itself is to create a more personal/human connection is an oddity.

Wondering if you're running into another well worn path, that of: "your art, isn't 'real' art".

Anyway, good luck with the project.

[Tannhauser Gate]

@ Ephisus. Actually, I said (or meant to say) using that using the footage in advertising was trivializing it. Fiction has its limits too but as long as the fiction treats it with pause and respect this its fine. We know lots of examples as that. Tyr's clip here is purely for advertising purposes which, imo, didnt need to show multiple scenes of people suffering and dying in real life. It was a poor choice imo.

I like how people will post en masse on this forum to express their condolences for fallen comrades and friends who have passed but suddenly its cool to use footage people who were tortured and killed for advertising.

[Ephisus]

You're mistaken. This is the first chapter of the series that I'm directing.

It's your disrespect, sir, to attempt to invalidate the memory and reflection of their history on account of your offense.

[Kilroy]

Excellent work!

[Tannhauser Gate]

Ephisus, on 28 February 2012 - 12:20 PM, said:

You're mistaken. This is the first chapter of the series that I'm directing.

It's your disrespect, sir, to attempt to invalidate the memory and reflection of their history on account of your offense.

lol what? It's my disrespect to attempt to invalidate the memory and reflection of their history on account of my offense? Clearly I have no respect or feel the need to hold sacred the memories of those who died so awfully that I would *not* use starved and dead victims to advertise for my web flicks. What was I thinking.

In my opinion....its disgusting and thoughtless. There is no moral high ground by claiming you are using it out of respect and remembrance. Thats a lie masked as artistic license. You simply used it to create gritty context and to advertise your film without thinking that people might be offended. Most people probably wont care, especially younger people, but I will give my opinion whether its agreed with or not.

At the risk of sounding hypocritical though, the animation is very good and I wish you guys luck... with less holocaust footage.

Edited by LakeDaemon, 28 February 2012 - 12:58 PM.

[Ephisus]

And I'll be here to bear true witness against such opinions.

You don't respect anyone's memory by trying to guilt others from publicly acknowledging and commenting on the evil that was done to them.

That's the opposite of respect; and the one thing we haven't seen in this thread, is a lack of care or thought from the people whom have spoken in support of our project.

Your contribution has been to provide contrast to that piety and honest reflection, by rejecting it out of hand.

Edited by Ephisus, 28 February 2012 - 01:08 PM.

[Kaemon]

Let's re-rail this thread back to the vid or it'll get locked.

Ephisus can you give an overview of your web series in broad strokes, are you adhering to Battle Tech or your own mech 'universe'
?

[Ephisus]

This is an original universe that Tyr and I concepted together, with three prominent factions founded on distinct worldviews.

The main character will start off as a skilled labourer, a mechanic, and as a hapless victim of circumstance, will experience all three systems that will pull him in different directions.

[Kaemon]

Are you guys open to any other projects?

If we get the green light (and tools) to do some player driven stuff here, there's been an ask for some Faction vids that might be very interesting, especially the Merc Corp and Lone Wolf playtypes.

[Ephisus]

We certainly are. It's hard to find good folks to collaborate with, always.

[Charles Martel]

The hardest part of futuristic sci-fi is to build a convincing future. By necessity, the best way to build a convincing future is to start by studying the past.

I look forward to seeing further episodes.

[Leetskeet]

LakeDaemon, on 28 February 2012 - 12:57 PM, said:

Bullshit

And ITT : We have the typical maniac blowing things out of proportion and raving about how offended he is and how we should cater to his needs. Fortunately for us, this is a perfectly legitimate use of small historical clips, as it's portrayed in a way to lead up to the future that they're presenting. It was a brief overview of our past, and then a brief look into our future.

If you haven't realized, you're acting like one of those undesirables who freaks out and acts offended at the slightest of instances purely for the fact that they can and that they feel that they deserve the attention. This just in. We don't care.

[guardian wolf]

Seriously, do you guys have a website or is this on Youtube?

[Alan Grant]

Ephisus, on 28 February 2012 - 01:21 PM, said:

... with three prominent factions founded on distinct worldviews.

Can you elaborate on these factions, a brief overview as it were, or will we just have to wait and see once you add more videos to your series?

Anyway, looking quite nice so far. Looking forward to more.

[Evil Ash]

This is well done. very well done. (Insert positive adjective here) done.

Edited by Evil Ash, 18 March 2012 - 03:56 PM.

[Ephisus]

For now, Youtube is our sole aggregation site, for all the content we produce. We may or may not change that in the coming year based on need.

Quote

Can you elaborate on these factions, a brief overview as it were, or will we just have to wait and see once you add more videos to your series?

I can tell you that the three distinct worldviews deal explicitly with the nature of authority in each system: Based on physical force, Social Contract, or Natural Law.