101 replies to this topic

[Polymorphyne]

Oh, the Liao are there, they are all just disguised as mercs/lone wolves/ other houses, awaiting the moment to plunge the dagger in from behind.

I fully support Steiner-Davion relations. It is to be expected for Davion mechwarrior numbers to be greater- we are the greater military power and have less of a focus on assault mechs, so can field more mechs. However, our Steiner allies make up for their lesser numbers by fielding a great many Assault mechs, and far more importantly- They provide supremely good financial backing for it all. The mercs and loners outnumber all of the houses put together, so having Steiner allies makes me feel much more comfortable, knowing that our allies should be able to procure the services of alot of those mercenaries for us.

The best bit about it is- Together, we can kill a hell of alot of Kuritans and Capellans! Down with the dragon and the snake! Sword, Fist and Sunburst forever!

Edited by Longsword, 15 March 2012 - 05:10 AM.

[Adridos]

Longsword, on 15 March 2012 - 05:09 AM, said:

Blah, blah, blah... only reason we stick with them - They provide supremely good financial backing for it all.

Don't even try to tell them you're using them for something else. Only Steiner in the lore before Civil War could believe that, but they know what will happen very well to get blinded by some marriage.

Longsword, on 15 March 2012 - 05:09 AM, said:

The best bit about it is- Together, we can kill a hell of alot of Kuritans and Capellans! Down with the dragon and the snake! Sword, Fist and Sunburst forever!

I should call Dihm. People often misunderstand the symbol of FRR for a snake, but it is a dragon, as he would tell you.

[Petroff Northrup]

Duncan Jr Fischer, on 15 March 2012 - 04:39 AM, said:

Surprisingly, so little Liao.. There were always plenty of them back at MMNet..

This place has a lot more people than MMNet and people there are a bit more into the lore, a lot of people on this site so do not even seem to have cracked a source book and have gotten most of what they know from games, fortunatly many of them are learning and more and more I see people asking for how to really break into the lore so when the game launches the numbers may change a bit

[Dihm]

Adridos, on 15 March 2012 - 06:45 AM, said:

I should call Dihm. People often misunderstand the symbol of FRR for a snake, but it is a dragon, as he would tell you.

Don't go putting words in my mouth now.

Dragon, or linnormr, is NOT the word I'd use for it, as they are wingless and bipedal in Norse mythology. I've never seen it actually defined, but to me it has always been some sort of sea serpent. One possiblity being Jǫrmungandr/Jörmungandr/Jormungand, the Midgard or World Serpent. Oddly, that's not a very "heroic" figure, but it sure makes a pretty flag.

Which all adds confusion when we use the term "Snakes" as a derogetory for Dracos. But whatever, everyone's a hypocrite.

Also, I've never heard Cappies called "snakes" before.

More on topic: Having our roots as we do in the Tyr resistence movement, I'm quite a fan of the Lyrans. Though, I would like to have a few private words with the Duke of Tamar. You won't miss him when he's gone will you?

Edited by Dihm, 15 March 2012 - 09:07 AM.

[Adridos]

Dihm, on 15 March 2012 - 09:05 AM, said:

Also, I've never heard Cappies called "snakes" before.

That's the point. He probably meant you, because Fed Com simply loves "liberating" small states, which will eventually turn out to be stronger than them later (Sun-Tzu Confederation and Ghost Bear Dominion, respectively) and you'll end up pretty exhausted from Clan Wars.

[Naughtyboy]

Adridos, on 15 March 2012 - 09:09 AM, said:

That's the point. He probably meant you, because Fed Com simply loves "liberating" small states, which will eventually turn out to be stronger than them later (Sun-Tzu Confederation and Ghost Bear Dominion, respectively) and you'll end up pretty exhausted from Clan Wars.

reminds me of old CCCP aka sovjet union ....look at them now...on da brink of civil war...wich brings the North "liberation" of the south in the american civil war back in the 1860s come to mind.


Davion and Federated Suns rule!!!

[Adridos]

Naughtyboy, on 15 March 2012 - 09:17 AM, said:

Reminds me of old CCCP aka sovjet union ....look at them now...on da brink of civil war...

Yeah, the problem is, you're the CCCP (or USSR in English).

They too "liberated" part of central and eastern Europe from "Capitalism a system where you have poor and rich, where the money decides and where people kill themselves for it!". Ideals, good - execution, unacceptable.

[Dihm]

Adridos, on 15 March 2012 - 09:09 AM, said:

That's the point. He probably meant you, because Fed Com simply loves "liberating" small states, which will eventually turn out to be stronger than them later (Sun-Tzu Confederation and Ghost Bear Dominion, respectively) and you'll end up pretty exhausted from Clan Wars.

I think that's a stretch, given the context clues, I'm betting he meant the CapCon.

[Adridos]

Dihm, on 15 March 2012 - 09:44 AM, said:

I think that's a stretch, given the context clues, I'm betting he meant the CapCon.

That's probably just the mead flowing through your veins.

[Kanil]

nubnub, on 15 March 2012 - 04:16 AM, said:

Please forgive the words of Kanil as he does not fully appreciate the support Davions play in our shared prosperity, nor does his view reflect that of other house members. From the inception of MWO we've maintained the strongest alliance ever and we have worked and grown almost equally together at even rates - a point which I can make quite clear through our control in the commonwealth:

Kanil, as much as we are here to destroy our enemies we are also here to strengthen ourselves and our allies. Don't forget this.

How do you sleep at night?

Bah!

[Dihm]

Adridos, on 15 March 2012 - 09:56 AM, said:

That's probably just the mead flowing through your veins.

Your eyeballs must get tired from the constant rolling they do.

So, Lyrans, got any contracts you wanna throw our way against the Cappies? I know Davion has a better angle of attack, but we'll take anything.

[Althix]

Don't be afraid my little Steiner friend. Generous and Kind House Davion will not abandon you in the times of need, as always.

Edited by Althix, 15 March 2012 - 10:12 AM.

[Strum Wealh]

Dihm, on 15 March 2012 - 09:44 AM, said:

I think that's a stretch, given the context clues, I'm betting he meant the CapCon.

Indeed - I would think that Longsword may have been using "snake(s)" in the common colloquial of "a treacherous, deceitful, and generally untrustworthy individual or group".

As for the serpentine entity on the FRR's crest, could it be an allusion to Veles?

Quote

A unifying characteristic of all Indo-European mythologies is a story about a battle between a god of thunder and a huge serpent or a dragon. In the Slavic version of the myth, Perun is a god of thunder, whilst Veles acts as a dragon who opposes him, consistent with the Vala etymology; He is also similar to the Etruscan Underworld-monster Vetha and to the dragon Illuyankas, enemy of the storm god of Hittite mythology.

-----

The reason of enmity between the two gods is Veles' theft of Perun's son, wife or, usually, cattle. It is also an act of challenge: Veles, in the form of a huge serpent, slithers from the caves of the Underworld and coils upwards the Slavic world tree towards Perun's heavenly domain. Perun retaliates and attacks Veles with his lightning bolts. Veles flees, hiding or transforming himself into trees, animals or people. In the end he is killed by Perun, and in this ritual death, whatever Veles stole is released from his battered body in form of rain falling from the skies.

-----

The death of Veles was never permanent; he would reform himself as a serpent who would shed its old skin and would be reborn in a new body. Although in this particular myth he plays the negative role as bringer of chaos, Veles was not seen as an evil god by ancient Slavs. In fact, in many of the Russian folk tales, Veles, appearing under the Christian guise of St. Nicholas, saves the poor farmer and his cattle from the furious and destructive St. Elias the Thunderer, who, of course, represents the old Perun.

An tenacious immortal of many patronages (including autumn, western lands, underworld, earth, waters, fertility, cattle, pasture, snakes, wolves, medicine and magic) reborn through the metaphor of the serpent (representing a "Long live Rasalhague!" aspect) and taking on the role of defender of the people (the farmer) from the fury and destruction (an allusion to a storm) of an outside force (symbolizing (mainly) the Draconis Combine and the Combine's relationship with the people and culture of Rasalhague) and one who would challenge the "greater powers", and a throw-back to the ancient origins of the Rasalhagians' Slavic ancestors... sounds like as good a symbol to rally around as any, right?

[Dihm]

Sounds like Veles and Jormungand are one and the same actually, or at least have some startling similarities. I don't know of any Slavic influence though, so I'd have to go with Jormungand.

And yes, I also though of the "coniving person" definition of "snakes" as well, but we'll need Longsword to confirm.

Adridos just likes poking the World Serpent.

Edited by Dihm, 15 March 2012 - 10:54 AM.

[God of War]

Omfg! The lyrian & capellan Crybabies see the beating of their Life coming up on the horizon!
Made my day!

[Polymorphyne]

I was refering to the Cappies- what term could better be used to describe something green, slimey and deceitful that crawls along the ground on its belly than snake?

[Adridos]

Longsword, on 16 March 2012 - 11:55 PM, said:

I was refering to the Cappies

You didn't get the joke.

[nubnub]

God of War, on 15 March 2012 - 11:08 AM, said:

Omfg! The lyrian & capellan Crybabies see the beating of their Life coming up on the horizon!
Made my day!

On the contrary, our alliance is the strongest known. The Steiner/Davion alliance occupies the most planets in the Inner Sphere by over double any other house. And these are well defended too - the relative house members per planet we own is second only to the FRR (which is only because their entire house occupies less than 3% of the Inner Sphere).

It is your choice to join us, or yield before us...

[Strum Wealh]

nubnub, on 17 March 2012 - 06:48 AM, said:

On the contrary, our alliance is the strongest known. The Steiner/Davion alliance occupies the most planets in the Inner Sphere by over double any other house. And these are well defended too - the relative house members per planet we own is second only to the FRR (which is only because their entire house occupies less than 3% of the Inner Sphere).

It is your choice to join us, or yield before us...

Hmmm...
Federated Suns: "500+" star systems
Draconis Combine: "approx. 350" star systems
Capellan Confederation: "ca. 217" star systems
Free Worlds League: "330+" star systems
Lyran Commonwealth: "over 300" star systems
Free Rasalhague Republic: "80+" star systems

Total: ~1,777 star systems
Though...

Quote

The Inner Sphere is a region of interstellar space surrounding Earth to a radius of roughly 450 - 550 light-years, generally demarcated by the outer borders of the "Great Houses." Within this region of about 2 million stars, there are approximately 2000 inhabited planets.

It seems like the number "1,777" above may be an indication of the number of inhabited star systems (assuming an average of one or two habitable planets per star system) rather than the total number of star systems (including stars with no habitable planets, stars with no planets, and so on).

Even so:
Federated Suns: 500/1,777 = 0.281 -> 28.173% of the IS
Draconis Combine: 350/1,777 = 0.197 -> 19.696% of the IS
Capellan Confederation: 217/1,777 = 0.122 -> 12.212% of the IS
Free Worlds League: 330/1,777 = 0.186 -> 18.571% of the IS
Lyran Commonwealth: 300/1,777 = 0.169 -> 16.882% of the IS
Free Rasalhague Republic: 80/1,777 = 0.045 -> 4.502% of the IS

I think the Steiner-Davion section of that chart should be larger (45.02%, or slightly less than half of the total pie; perhaps with an additional segment to show the proportion of worlds on each side of the alliance) and that the Capellan segment should be noticeably smaller than those of the Combine and the League (~2/3 of the size) and that the Republic should be smaller still (just over 1/3 of the size of the Confederation).

Also, the title for figure 2 would be somewhat more accurate if it read "Strength (House Members per Occupied Planet)".
But, that might just be me being a bit pedantic.

Your thoughts?

P.S.: The font and coloring, along with the border art and the progression ("MWO Statistics > Part 1 > Planet Ownership > Inner Sphere") at the top would seem to indicate that the image is, in fact, a screen shot... which would mean that "MWO Statistics" is part of the MWO website (similar border art, font and coloring, and progression styling) or a separate application... it seems that you have some most interesting contacts and sources.

Edited by Strum Wealh, 17 March 2012 - 09:14 AM.

[Damocles]

agreed with Strum Wealh, I think that Liao slice is taking up too much room.