19 replies to this topic

[Riordan Lionheart]

Just to get a sense of each house, what are the defining characteristics of the armed forces of each faction? As in compositions, tech, specialties, strengths and weaknesses, etc.

For example, here's what I have determined thus far, please correct me if I'm wrong on any of these

Federated Suns: Quality light and medium mechs and aerospace assets, higher quality generals and officers, capable political leadership

Lyran Commonwealth: Large industrial base, vast material resources, high quantity and quality of heavy and assault mechs

Capellan Confederation: Well disciplined troops, utilizes more advanced and experimental tech (i.e. stealth, masc), intelligence services

Draconis Combine: Quality heavy mechs and solid industrial base, resilient, large amount of energy weapon based mechs/ more independent units

Free Worlds League: Also has solid industrial base and high tech, higher than average combined arms unit effectiveness, quality early BA and conventional tanks

Sarna didn't have much as far as strengths and weaknesses so I was hoping you guys could fill-in those blanks for me, thanks

[Damocles]

Riordan Lionheart, on 19 March 2012 - 09:40 AM, said:

Capellan Confederation: Well disciplined troops

Ok maybe the Warrior Houses and Death Commandos...but every other CCAF unit? And the advanced and experimental tech focus ain't gonna be for another decade+. I'd say they utilize lots of irregulars and insurgents. Boobytraps and terror attacks.

[Kenyon Burguess]

everyone uses everything by house. its by unit that the differences and specialties appear. exmple:

9th marik militia : the hospitilars regular level of quality mechwarriors, reliable loyalty rating.
specialties lie not in the command but in the excellent technical support staff. the regiment uses a wide variety of mech designs

[Adridos]

Capellans have the best trained conventional army in the IS. We lack resources, so our equipment is not top-notch, but we make up for it with talent and self-initiative, which is highly supported by the leadership. I do not know about the discipline, though.

[Riordan Lionheart]

Yeah I was unsure about alot of that stuff, that's why I wanted some feedback cause I figured I had gotten a lot of that wrong.

Any Info is much appreciated

[Maris]

Damocles, on 19 March 2012 - 09:45 AM, said:

Ok maybe the Warrior Houses and Death Commandos...but every other CCAF unit? And the advanced and experimental tech focus ain't gonna be for another decade+. I'd say they utilize lots of irregulars and insurgents. Boobytraps and terror attacks.

Actually, the average CCAF troops are generally very well trained, if not better than the other regular House units. Dont mistake the plot armor that most of its enemies possess when fighting the caf in the novels, which are very biased towards the more...¨westernised" houses. They are certainly not lacking in quality units.

But dont take my word for it, feel free to read up on the CCAF field manual.

Interestingly, the ccaf was the first military to actually develop combined arms units.

[Riordan Lionheart]

Basically I just want to know what each house military is known for

for example I know that the Lyrans are known for poor aptitude due to social generals and they compensate with a quantity over quality approach. And tons of assaults and heavies...

[Dlardrageth]

If it weren't for a slight *ahem* tendency to infighting, the FWL would probably have rolled over the CC long ago. And don'T leave Comstar out of the equation. After all, they have enough power to secure Terra for a looong time and ultimately stop the Clans almost single-handedly (at a price, though).

Edited by Dlardrageth, 19 March 2012 - 10:31 AM.

[Gigaton]

FWL: Superior quality political infighting.
LC: Superior quality upper class twit officers.
FS: Good at charging numerically inferior enemies with waves of 'mechs and perhaps even getting a pyrrhic victory. Nobles and officers are selfish and dishonorable. Common soldiers are lazy (especially mentally) and cowardly.
CC: They have good infantry and secret services I hear.
DC: Superior quality 'mechs and best 'mechwarriors in Inner Sphere. Honorable and brave to the last breath. Holds the largest 'mechwarrior academy in Inner Sphere (compare to FS, where most "mechwarriors" are press ganged from bars and prisons).

On more serious note though, most of that is actually true. I may have altered the FedSun part a bit. But DC does have the largest 'mechwarrior academy (Sun Zhang). On the other hand, DCMS is in reality overtly rigid and conservative, but the future (in-game timline) Coordinator current Gunji-no-Kanrei Theodore Kurita is changing that.

Edited by Gigaton, 19 March 2012 - 11:08 AM.

[Adridos]

Dlardrageth, on 19 March 2012 - 10:31 AM, said:

If it weren't for a slight *ahem* tendency to infighting, the FWL would probably have rolled over the CC long ago. And don'T leave Comstar out of the equation. After all, they have enough power to secure Terra for a looong time and ultimately stop the Clans almost single-handedly (at a price, though).

If it were not for Davions, we would rule IS now.

If it were not for crazy leaders, we would be feared elitist state right now.

The list goes on...

[SeDevri]

Adridos, on 19 March 2012 - 10:02 AM, said:

Capellans have the best trained conventional army in the IS. We lack resources, so our equipment is not top-notch, but we make up for it with talent and self-initiative, which is highly supported by the leadership. I do not know about the discipline, though.

I'm sorry but nothing i have read in any of the books leads me to the same conclusion as you. From what I've read the CC sees "self-initiative" as a threat to the CC's security, their warrior houses maybe talented but are a minority in the CCAF's, and as to your statement about "highly supported by the leadership"....i suppose taking someones family hostage, or threatening them with death for failure is a type of support?

[Dihm]

Not sure about Romano, but old Max used to kill people who questioned his orders. I guess that's highly supportive.

[sheradin]

if you going to look at strengths and weaknesses you need to remove personal loyity
davions are know fow useing combine arms units
up till sun zeu the capplens really didnt have stable leadership the leaders were nuts and peranoid and were prone to fequant purges wich has a tendcey to get rid of compent officers
the dc are very honnorable but thier tatics are for most point perdictable up till the clans invade and are forced to adapt
free league world are stable under marik and is rapidly coming up

[Adridos]

Traditionally the CCAF forces usually employ a strong aerospace fighter contingent, with the strategy that by removing an invasion before at landing has occurred. All Liao-designed 'Mechs (especially early designs) have proven over and over again to be thoroughly well-designed and capable, as well as cheap and easy to build. As proof that quality over quantity is preferred the average Liao Troops tend to be more skilled than their counterparts from other Houses, and the CCAF in general learns more practical skills to make the best of their situation; this is thank to an emphasis on providing excellent training and equipment to the military, making the CCAF one of the best trained militaries in the Inner Sphere. Even though most Liao units were general smaller than most other House units following large military campaigns Liao units are usually forced into smaller sizes to accommodate loss of supplies while maintaining the same number of units.

SeDevri, on 19 March 2012 - 10:44 AM, said:

I'm sorry but nothing i have read in any of the books leads me to the same conclusion as you. From what I've read the CC sees "self-initiative" as a threat to the CC's security, their warrior houses maybe talented but are a minority in the CCAF's, and as to your statement about "highly supported by the leadership"....i suppose taking someones family hostage, or threatening them with death for failure is a type of support?

The military of the Capellan Confederation is known as the Capellan Confederation Armed Forces (CCAF). The CCAF is unique in that it places more power in the hands of the commander at the regiment level and less at higher levels than do most other militaries.

[Solis Obscuri]

I'd expect the Cappellans to have excellent troop discipline, based on the way their society is structured. Duty to their society would be a overriding concern. However, in the timeline of this game, morale would probably be below normal, due to insane leadership and a long string of defeats agains the FedCom. Likewise, I'd expect the Kuritans to be very disciplined, based on their conceptualization of the warrior ethos. The FWL has such a mish-mash of units and factions that cohesion is potentially a serious issue in large-scale operations. Political appointments of military leaders within the Lyran Commonwealth would tend to adversely affect morale, and the Suns look to have highly competent units with somewhat cavilier attitudes.

In terms of elite training, there are several noteworthy warrior houses within the Cappellan Confederation which produce high-grade troops, and they have some excellent military academies. The Draconis Combine is also notable for several excellent military academies, particularly notable for training in individual combat skills (this was even the case when their ronins faced off against SLDF troops, leading to the Gunslinger program.) The Federated Suns/FedCom are probably most notable for the NAIS, which would give graduates a strong focus on tactical and strategic leadership, as well as exploration of "unconventional" tactics.

The FWL and Lyrans have the best production facilities, hands down. The Combine and FedCom have the best technology (thanks to Comstar and the Helm Core, respectively), though the Cappellans are doing some innovative work with sensor and electronic warfare capabilities.

In terms of composition, I'd expect the Lyrans and Kuritans to be the most 'mech-centric, the Lyrans having the deepest reserves of heavy armor. The Federated Suns would use a mix of 'mechs and mechanized units, and are notable for having very effective infantry. Their command structure appears fairly hierarchical, though, and possibly cumbersome. The FWL is relatively light on 'mechs, in terms of overall unit composition, also emphasizes combined-arms tactics, and has many more capital ships comparative to other houses. The Cappellans sport a blend of unit types, are notable for the strength of their aerospace assets, and make extensive use of mercenary units to bolster their forces. Regimental-level commands are granted more independence in the CCAF than most other successor states, allowing for better operational flexibility and initiative.

In terms of overall "strength" circa 3049, the FedCom and Draconis Combine are far and away in the best positions overall, with the FedCom having an edge in production capacity. The most significant strategic benefits that the FWL and Cappellan Confederation have is their locations, which place them conveniently far from the path of the Clan invasion.

[Thorgar Wulfson]

General break down in easy to understand terms (hopefully ) Now this is mainly from 3025 as thats the time period i remember best. alot has changed BUT this still holds well in generalities.

House Davion

• Cultural theme ; America
  
• Tech: overall highest tech level AVERAGE for general populace and military. They may not have super top of the line, but all of their troops have above average tech.
  
• Spec Ops: whole units of rapid response teams (thiink Navy Seals with and without mechs)
  
• Troop Quality: really high standards of training, but not always experience
  
• Government: really corrupt capatilism but mainly democratic
  
• Mechs: production facilities for medium and heavy models, only a few light models but can mass produce, limited assault production.

House Stiener

• Cultural theme: Middle ages Europe
  
• Tech: Oddball here, general populace: average/below Military :average/slightly above
  
• Spec Ops: Think armored knights with mecha with a few SAS styled units
  
• Troop Quality: Good training but FANATICAL loyalty to the House (not necesarrily the leaders)
  
• Government: fuedal with hereditary ranks in the military
  
• Mecha: limited light and medium production capacity, easily able to mass produce heavies and assaults

House Kurita

• Cultural theme: Fuedal Japan
  
• Tech: general populace :can range from 1960's to 1700's in tech. Military: average unit gets salvaged and rebuilt units, prestigous or old units get top of the line.
  
• Spec Ops: no reall mecha level spec ops, however can you say future tech ninjas? knew ya could
  
• Troop Quality: Varies greatly from unit to unit, but Loyalty to the Combine Coordinator is absolute, most would sepiku for failure.
  
• Government: fuedal shogunate states
  
• Mechs: each has become something akin to a Katana to be passed from father to son. lots of light and mediums, good amount of lower end heavies, a few assault types

House Liao

• Cultural Them: China
  
• tech: general poplulace poor, ruling class above average, military above average.
  
• Spec Ops: death squads.. lots and lots and lots of death squads
  
• Troop Quality: good to excellent troops, nut job leaders with the tactical sense of a parapalegic monkey, on speed during a seizure at the command and control console for your team.
  
• Government: divine right empire
  
• Mechs: produced unique new mecha after the first succession war such as the Vindicator. able to produce a few medium and heavy mechs along with a smattering of other unique Cappellan designs

House Marik

• Cultural Theme: Russian/Indian
  
• Tech: overall above average, but varies greatly
  
• Spec ops: sadly i cant remember any that stand out.
  
• Troop Quality: good, Leadership is wracked with red tape and political manuevering.
  
• Government: bizzare amalgamation of Communism and Democracy, more buerocrats than actual decision makers
  
• Mechs: above average production facilities for all types. sadly not enough recources or manpower to use it.

Edited by Thorgar Wulfson, 19 March 2012 - 03:23 PM.

[Demi-Precentor Konev]

Thorgar Wulfson, on 19 March 2012 - 03:21 PM, said:

House Davion

• Cultural theme ; America

The Federated Suns are much more in line with the pre-WWI Franco-British Empires. I don't like attributing "America In Space" to any of the Houses, but the Free Worlds League could be compared to early America where states rights and the federal government were constantly conflicting with one another.

[Seabear]

I disagree with a couple fo things in the above dipiction of the houses. First the structure and outlook of the Fedsuns seems more British than American to me with the focus on the royal house. No house really seems to reflect a modern American attiude and approach to government. To me the closest is the FWL as an analog to the US before the unpleasantness of 1861-1865. It is still a racous bubbling kettle of various levels of democracy despite the fact that it is the oldest nation extent in the BT universe.

[Stovebolt]

Thorgar Wulfson, on 19 March 2012 - 03:21 PM, said:

House Marik

• Cultural Theme: Russian/Indian
  
• Tech: overall above average, but varies greatly
  
• Spec ops: sadly i cant remember any that stand out.
  
• Troop Quality: good, Leadership is wracked with red tape and political manuevering.
  
• Government: bizzare amalgamation of Communism and Democracy, more buerocrats than actual decision makers
  
• Mechs: above average production facilities for all types. sadly not enough recources or manpower to use it.

I'd like to add, according to the sourcebooks, House Marik has a laissez-faire economy, and protects civil (negative) liberties to the greatest extent out of the houses. So not even close to Communism. In fact, you might call it Libertarian. (Probably why I'm drawn to them)

The government seems to be a decentralized yet bureaucratic mess, probably with the more powerful factions being able to ignore laws from the central government, and the weaker League members may or may not have been relegated to a second class status.

Honestly, not very effective offensively. Most constituent states of the FWL invoke their Home Defense laws to avoid going to war for Marik - although they'll certainly do it for themselves (War of Andurien secession....funny how in the books no one EVER tries to secede from FedSuns. The problem with Designated Good Guys is that they always end up being too good). Defensively just fine though. They'll fight tooth and nail against invaders.

FWL has dozens of different provincial militaries with their own traditions and uniforms...and probably even tactics and composition. It's hard to tell, because I get the impression no authors cared to flesh them out.

Edited by Stovebolt, 20 March 2012 - 07:21 AM.

[Petroff Northrup]

How i have always seen them and how they used to be described in the older source books, not sure where the laser-orientedness came from for the Dracs, that has always been FWL territory.

Draconis Combine - for deades held the undisputed spot as having the most elite fighting force in the Inner Sphere and before the 2nd SW boasted the largest as well. The warriors of DC would often fight rather blindly though despite their skill and would attack too ferociously and their officers would put honor before military doctrine leading to most of their defeats. The mechs of DC vary in speciality by timeline though usually favor faster harder hitting designs.

Federated Suns - After the SLDF left the FedSuns fielded the second largest military behind the Dracs and over time kept their second place spot but now behind Lyran, their technology base is very solid and for a time was second only to the FWL who managed to capture many technology heavy worlds from the former TH. On average they boast very solid line units and good militia units with their armed forces seperated out to work within the Marches of FS which allow them to have local government be more military oriented or domestically oriented which helped to bring out many competent officers who regularly reveal the weaknesses of their closest enemies. They relay heavily on their intelligence networks to give them a leg up on their enemies and are oriented heavily towards the use of ACs and durable units capable of engaging the enemy at the range of their choosing and surviving contact.

Capellan Confederation - Capellan line units are above average and the CC elite units are almost without equal though the entire CCAF is and always has been undermanned though during the 1st SW and post-clan invasion they held a noticeable technological advantage for a time, however, Capellan miltias are notoriously undergunned and equipped so they are usually unable to relieve line units like those of the other houses resulting in the line units taking drasitcally higher casualties and in the event of a breakthrough the militias are often swept aside forcing CC to usually rely almost entirely on guerrilla warfare, ambushes, and delaying tactics to bring the warrior houses and Death Commandoes into play. CC forces usually favor cheap and somewhat expendable units that can be thrown into the fray to cause disorder or be used en masse to hold a line against superior opposition.

Free World's League - the units of the FWL show the biggest variety in quality and equipment, for the most part they have held a technological advantage of some kind over their enemies thanks to taking many TH worlds and retaining a great deal of lostech to some extent. Their units, especially the premier ones are very laser oriented allowing them to act for prolonged amounts of time against their enemies which aids them in fighting the Steiners who they can more easily whittle down and the CC who cannot afford to break from contact with an enemy force. The elite units of the FWL are generally of a lower quality when compared to most elite units of their counterparts with the sole exception of their Knights who often prove equal or superior to other elite formations. FWL militias are among the best when defending their homes though FWL line units and militia often do somewhat poorly in offensive actions.

Lyran Alliance - Notorious for their heavy uses of assault and powerful heavy mechs the LCAf is rather straight forward, they minimize the use of militias and rather lack in truly elite formations but since the early SWs they have grown out of the restrictions the Star league placed on their military size and are now easily the largest and able to easily replace any losses. The LCAF is slow to move but is a juggernaught once it gets going Lyran lines units are powerful forces and can compare easily to to those of any other successor state with their only true weakness being the lack of maneuverability or true longevity holding them back from making the true massive offenses they might be capable of given the might of their armies. The LCAF is also well known for 'Social Generals' men and women who made their way up the ranks based solely on family ties or wealth, these people have tarnished the entire LCAF due to a handful of well placed incompetents but for the most part the LCAF officer corps are actually highly competent and thanks to one of the premier military acadamies in the inner Sphere many LCAF officers could shine brightly in any other state in the Inner Sphere if not for the stigma of the social generals.


Wow i got long winded there.