29 replies to this topic

[Skylarr]

The Phalanx CIWS systems on todays ships are for point defenseonly. They are the last line of defense. The only fires at missiles which have penetrated the outer Defense Sytem. A phalanx on a Battleship will not cover the Cruiser next to it.

You also need to take into account that the technology needed to do something like this has been lost. The Inner Shphere has beaten each other into a pre-80s Tech lvl. The Mech Factories run on their own. They can fix some parts and might be able to change some configs. But only after many years of reworking existing systems.

Last point. If this was introduced. Who would volunteer to pilot the mech that can only fire at incoming missiles?

[CCC Dober]

Skylarr, on 05 April 2012 - 05:07 AM, said:

The Phalanx CIWS systems on todays ships are for point defenseonly. They are the last line of defense. The only fires at missiles which have penetrated the outer Defense Sytem. A phalanx on a Battleship will not cover the Cruiser next to it.

You also need to take into account that the technology needed to do something like this has been lost. The Inner Shphere has beaten each other into a pre-80s Tech lvl. The Mech Factories run on their own. They can fix some parts and might be able to change some configs. But only after many years of reworking existing systems.

Last point. If this was introduced. Who would volunteer to pilot the mech that can only fire at incoming missiles?

I'd see it more as an option for an existig Mech. Let's say you sacrifice a Gauss Rifle or PPC (including heat sinks) and mount an 'aegis' system instead. That said, I'd not only bid one, but 2 of these on as many Mechs to have some kind of redundancy in case one of them is neutrallized. The strategic value is incredibly high IMO. Easily on par with electronic countermeasures.

[Aegis Kleais]

Here's to hoping AMS systems cannot be stacked. I think it's utter garbage to have the ability to fully nullify 1 particular weapon type. Partial with 1 AMS is fine, especially if LRMs pack a decent punch.

[Scar]

I'm almost positive for the AMS boats for collective anti-missile defence. This will add another aspect('dimension') and benefit for a well coordinated teamwork.

BTW, i think the topic-starter should start the poll on this discussion.

Edited by Scar, 05 April 2012 - 05:52 AM.

[Psydotek]

I think it would be interesting to have a module that would allow your AMS to cover an area instead of just your 'mech though.

If i'm remembering correctly, AMS doesn't destroy entire missile salvos but rather reduces the size of the salvo thus reducing potential damage.

[Wyzak]

In MW2 Mercenaries, the AMS engaged all hostile missiles including those targeting your lance mates. And it could chew through the entire base ton of ammo in less then 30 seconds, which seems to me an effective deterrent against people who "boat" them to nullify all incoming missile fire. AMS was inefficient and used a lot of ammo to take out only a portion of incoming missiles, but it would target any missile without your IFF code. In a long fight, you would need many tons of AMS ammo to respond to an opposing team with 1 LRM boat or two half-boats.

[firestorm119]

[EDMW CSN]

Wyzak, on 06 April 2012 - 12:26 AM, said:

In MW2 Mercenaries, the AMS engaged all hostile missiles including those targeting your lance mates. And it could chew through the entire base ton of ammo in less then 30 seconds, which seems to me an effective deterrent against people who "boat" them to nullify all incoming missile fire. AMS was inefficient and used a lot of ammo to take out only a portion of incoming missiles, but it would target any missile without your IFF code. In a long fight, you would need many tons of AMS ammo to respond to an opposing team with 1 LRM boat or two half-boats.

Bingo, I remember carrying 3 tons of ammo for decent protection. Anyhow if the guy wants to boat AMS and AMS let him.
2.5 tons for 5 AMS with another 2 tons of ammo per AMS (10 tons of ammo) will eat into their offensive capability.

Edited by [EDMW]CSN, 06 April 2012 - 01:13 AM.

[BerryChunks]

Skylarr, on 05 April 2012 - 05:07 AM, said:

The Phalanx CIWS systems on todays ships are for point defenseonly. They are the last line of defense. The only fires at missiles which have penetrated the outer Defense Sytem. A phalanx on a Battleship will not cover the Cruiser next to it.

You also need to take into account that the technology needed to do something like this has been lost. The Inner Shphere has beaten each other into a pre-80s Tech lvl. The Mech Factories run on their own. They can fix some parts and might be able to change some configs. But only after many years of reworking existing systems.

Last point. If this was introduced. Who would volunteer to pilot the mech that can only fire at incoming missiles?

It's the "heal bot" mech, in a gimp form. Next will be a mech that can make repairs to other mechs but doesn't wear weapons.

Wyzak, on 06 April 2012 - 12:26 AM, said:

In MW2 Mercenaries, the AMS engaged all hostile missiles including those targeting your lance mates. And it could chew through the entire base ton of ammo in less then 30 seconds, which seems to me an effective deterrent against people who "boat" them to nullify all incoming missile fire. AMS was inefficient and used a lot of ammo to take out only a portion of incoming missiles, but it would target any missile without your IFF code. In a long fight, you would need many tons of AMS ammo to respond to an opposing team with 1 LRM boat or two half-boats.

I like the concept of having guns to fire back at them instead.

Edited by BerryChunks, 06 April 2012 - 01:31 AM.

[Tuhalu]

Current TT rules on AMS are significantly different to the old ones.

In the old system, an AMS system would engage the first flight of missiles shot in its direction (whether it would hit or not!), taking out a flat 1d6 for IS or 2d6 for clan missiles for the cost of 1d6x2 bits of ammunition. It tended to shoot down anything short of an LRM10 or 20 outright, but it could be gamed by shooting with a missile launcher that you didn't expect to hit first...

In the current system, the AMS only activates on the first missile flight that actually hits, applying a -4 modifier on the cluster hit table and costing only 1 bit of ammo. This makes it much more sustainably useful, but less powerful on individual flights of missiles.

Assuming that they are going to be using the current rules, you don't really need more than 1 ton of AMS ammo per launcher and you'd hardly ever need more than 2 launchers.