15 replies to this topic

[Skyfaller]

Trials Vs Trials only.
Pugs Vs Pugs only.
Premades Vs. Premades only.


You dont need to have a matchmaker juggle these three very distinct player pools. Have the system split them into their categories and use the standard matchmaker within each category.

Allow the trial player to enable or disable his availability to be added into the Pug pool.

Similarly, allow the Pug player to enable or disable his availability to be added to the premade pool.

PROBLEM SOLVED.

No more pugstomping by premades full of atlases/lrm boats facing pugs composed mostly of medium trial mechs.

No more trial mech players getting stomped by everyone else due to the idiotic heat issue.

No more premades on easymode cash generation as they will be facing other premades.

[Stickjock]

What's to stop a very experienced player... who knows how to handle a Trial Mech and has no problem with their heat management... from dropping into Trial Mech battles and still stomping them??

[Korobug]

They are implementing a premade vs premade in the next update.

[Solis Obscuri]

Maybe we should just make a little game called "IWinWarrior" and everyone can drop solo into their own little instance, fire their guns in the air, and the computer will tell them they're a winner...

[Vorex]

the easier way:

1) match people by their win/loss ratio and mech weight
2) trial mechs have their weight reduced by 15% in matchmaking
3) a premade of 2-4 friends grouped up have +10% to their matchmaking weight
4) increase team size to 12
5) allow only 1 preformed lance maximum per team

job done.

[Aegis Kleais]

This problem is much more complex than the OP is giving it credit for. And coming off as if what you proposed is the end-all solution makes you seem more than condescending.

There is no formula out there which registers a person's skill. Choosing to work with others should never be an feature that results in penalization or segregation. You're basically slapping the hand of people who strategically choose to invoke tactics. If a player chooses to not coordinate with a team, that is a tactically lacking choice, and to lose to a team would be expected.

[Krivvan]

If all that was needed to make this happen was to just declare "Pugs versus pugs and premades versus premades!" then it would've happened months ago. The reality is, it takes time to implement it and frankly involves a complete overhaul (or rather making in the first place) of the matchmaker.

[Skyfaller]

Stickjock, on 31 October 2012 - 10:36 AM, said:

What's to stop a very experienced player... who knows how to handle a Trial Mech and has no problem with their heat management... from dropping into Trial Mech battles and still stomping them??

And this is worse than an experienced player in a non-trial mech, usually a heavily armed atlas and stomping a trial every single time?

[Darklord]

Just have a choice for players
Pugs vs pugs
groups of 2 or more vs each other with pugs that want to join in the group missions to help fill out the teams.

[Skyfaller]

Aegis Kleais, on 31 October 2012 - 10:49 AM, said:

This problem is much more complex than the OP is giving it credit for. And coming off as if what you proposed is the end-all solution makes you seem more than condescending.

There is no formula out there which registers a person's skill. Choosing to work with others should never be an feature that results in penalization or segregation. You're basically slapping the hand of people who strategically choose to invoke tactics. If a player chooses to not coordinate with a team, that is a tactically lacking choice, and to lose to a team would be expected.

Skill has NOTHING to do with it. It is moronic to even attempt to make a matchmaker based on skill. Look at world of tanks and how they keep failing miserably at it year after year.

There is no segregation either. Pug and Trial players can willingly choose to be added to pug/premade pools. Premades by their very nature cannot be put against a PUG because the matchmaking code simply cannot, EVER, reliably match pugs and premades.

Put 4 atlases as a premade group and see what the matchmaker tosses against them. you will notice it will be a very high number of maps where the other side barely has one assault mech. The matchmaker cannot do premade vs premade matching just like it cannot do skill matching. The variables are too many and the pool of opponents (available when the premade clicks 'launch') is too limited.

On the other hand, if the premades are allowed to only face premades the matchmaker then only has to find two teams of same premade # of mechs (no need for it to match weight classes because premade mech type setup is up to the players involved) and any missing slots can be filled with pug players that are willing to be put into premade games.

And please, listen to yourself. "slapping the hand of people who strategically choose to invoke tactics. If a player chooses to not coordinate with a team, that is a tactically lacking choice, and to lose to a team would be expected."

'strategically choose to involve tactics'. what a bunch of self serving & self aggrandizing bull. Let me translate that into reality: 'I want to keep stomping teams that hardly pose a challenge to me and make tons of cbills in the process'.

If you TRULY think that being part of a premade is about tactics and coordination.. congratulations! How about fighting a group of players that has also CHOSEN to do the same rather than face players that did not CHOOSE that mode of play. What? Is that TOO FAIR for you?

"If a player chooses to not coordinate with a team, that is a tactically lacking choice, and to lose to a team would be expected."

Oh wait that tells me that would not be too fair for you. In one hand you say premades are being punished because the pugs they stomp didnt chooose to be premades... but that ending sentence states that if the other team chose not to be premade then they should be stomped and expect to be stomped. Well I got news for you: My solution guarantees your holier than thou premade team ends up fighting those who did choose to be fighting a premade. Imagine that!

[Gideon Hawk]

To me it seems the biggest difference between PUGs and Pre-Mades is preparation. the pre-mades obviously have coordinated over voice chat or forums to determine roles and how to efficiently communicate outside of the match. PUGs get 30-15 seconds to try getting people to even say hello at times. I am sad to see nobody trying to champion a pre-match prep/chat/ready room where PUGs can at least get some extra time to form lances and devise a course of action to give them a chance in a team oriented game.

In future iterations of this ready room may even allow PUG players to choose their mechs right before the drop in case they want to try adjusting their strategy based on what the other Team members brought to the match. To prevent a whole team of assaults and heavies have a weight limit for the drop. This works in universe since a drop ship can only carry so much weight. I would also disable MechLab while in the ready room, that could become a time sink and delay the drop.

[Aegis Kleais]

Skyfaller, on 31 October 2012 - 11:13 AM, said:

Skill has NOTHING to do with it. It is moronic to even attempt to make a matchmaker based on skill. Look at world of tanks and how they keep failing miserably at it year after year.

There is no segregation either. Pug and Trial players can willingly choose to be added to pug/premade pools. Premades by their very nature cannot be put against a PUG because the matchmaking code simply cannot, EVER, reliably match pugs and premades.

Put 4 atlases as a premade group and see what the matchmaker tosses against them. you will notice it will be a very high number of maps where the other side barely has one assault mech. The matchmaker cannot do premade vs premade matching just like it cannot do skill matching. The variables are too many and the pool of opponents (available when the premade clicks 'launch') is too limited.

On the other hand, if the premades are allowed to only face premades the matchmaker then only has to find two teams of same premade # of mechs (no need for it to match weight classes because premade mech type setup is up to the players involved) and any missing slots can be filled with pug players that are willing to be put into premade games.

And please, listen to yourself. "slapping the hand of people who strategically choose to invoke tactics. If a player chooses to not coordinate with a team, that is a tactically lacking choice, and to lose to a team would be expected."

'strategically choose to involve tactics'. what a bunch of self serving & self aggrandizing bull. Let me translate that into reality: 'I want to keep stomping teams that hardly pose a challenge to me and make tons of cbills in the process'.

If you TRULY think that being part of a premade is about tactics and coordination.. congratulations! How about fighting a group of players that has also CHOSEN to do the same rather than face players that did not CHOOSE that mode of play. What? Is that TOO FAIR for you?

"If a player chooses to not coordinate with a team, that is a tactically lacking choice, and to lose to a team would be expected."

Oh wait that tells me that would not be too fair for you. In one hand you say premades are being punished because the pugs they stomp didnt chooose to be premades... but that ending sentence states that if the other team chose not to be premade then they should be stomped and expect to be stomped. Well I got news for you: My solution guarantees your holier than thou premade team ends up fighting those who did choose to be fighting a premade. Imagine that!

You're a joke. You're pissed off and just angry at anyone who opposes your view of the problem; then on top of it, you think calling people's alternate view and ideas names like a child. If you're going to be so dismissive of everyone else's input, then your post is nothing more than a rant, and you're seeking whatever therapeutic effect you can get by having others become complacent mindless yes-men and aren't really looking for solutions. It would have been great if you declared this at the start.

[arghmace]

I just had a 6 vs 8 battle.

2 possible conclusions:
1. Opponent had a premade team of 8 and there weren't 2 solo players waiting to join our team. Question: Why not just wait a bit more before starting the battle? This makes absolutely no sense fighting like this.
2. Opponent wasn't a premade team and the match maker is completely insane for not moving one player to the other team.

Either way, this game is complete bollocks until match maker ensures fair battles. Frak off, PGI, to be honest, I'm so pissed right now.

[Zyllos]

There is also another problem. Players who come in way late (say about a year from now) might not have any Trial Mech players to play against, thus can never drop.

[Psykosis]

Quote

I just had a 6 vs 8 battle.

2 possible conclusions:

actually, there's a 3rd more probable solution; 2 players clients crashed while dropping. Used to happen quite frequently, now thankfully alot less but it still happens. The current system can't place players on a map and say "ooh! 2 clients disco'd, lets pull more randoms to fill the spots!", so yer left with one team having 2 open spots....

[Aidan Malchor]

Well OP, feel free to code all this up, while your at it why don't you just do up the community warfare coding, fix all the bugs, implement the clans, read some whine threads, build up more maps, add more mechs, and ensure all the balancing is done. Since you seem to have it all under control we can expect this done by what, EOB friday?

yeah, I'm gonna need you to come in Saturday to, mmkay?

Oh, and we've just let some people go so your going to need to come in on Sunday as well. We need to play catch up, mmkay?