52 replies to this topic

[Vsai]

With ARTEMIS coming this is only going to get worse. AMS is a joke and ECM doesn't work; good thing TAG is in! There is no mechanic in the game that is addressing this serious issue. LRM's deal so much damage that I'm now seeing half the mechs doing nothing but LRM spam. I've been playing in beta everyday since well before the LRM change. I seen the changes and watch the flood of players dropping to LRM's and in turn making LRM boats themselves. At present piloting no longer matters unless you're in a Jenner because even if you avoid 1 mech's LRM's using the environment there is 3+ more on his team firing away from different angles. There is no armor thick enough and no weapon strong enough to outlast an LRM boat. You must realize how broken LRM's are. I don't believe for a second all the players rocking LRM boats slipped under your radar. Please address this situation.

[Tickdoff Tank]

LRMs do not dominate every match. They are not hard to counter.

[Vsai]

Tickdoff Tank, on 02 November 2012 - 10:18 PM, said:

LRMs do not dominate every match.  They are not hard to counter.

I agree, with Fast Light mechs with good pilots or LRM's...Take the last game I played for example, first mech I see is a raven, I start circling around to avoid making myself an easy target for LRM's. Four mechs at the enemy base get an assisted target through the Raven and my mech went from undamaged to Orange in the 4 seconds it took for me to get under an overhang to avoid the missiles. (Using a 300XL engine in a 65 ton mech) I'm now out of the fight completely waiting for the LRM gang to find a new target. A Catapult and a Raven close into my position, and I killed the catapult in a 2v1 battle, then the LRM's started up again from the same location and I got my torso taken out. I did everything that could realistically be expected to avoid LRM death and 90% of the damage I took was from LRM's. That is unbalanced to say the least.

[RFMarine]

once I was in a commando and I saw a LRM boat catapult raining LRM's. I just ran at him and circle strafed him, forcing him to stop

[Sean von Steinike]

LRMs are an annoyance and deadly, but so is just about every other weapon system. They are not that hard to defeat.

[Tachikoma101]

I kind of agree, over the last few days of playing I have noticed more and more people playing missile boats for this exact reason. Sure you can sometime use the environment to avoid them, if you manage to get behind something within the 4 seconds it takes for them to kill you.

I'm getting over this game because of this problem, so many matches just end with the team of LRM spamming mechs, sitting up on high points and raining down the missiles. I don't understand why so many people do it, seems like such a boring way to play, just sit on a hill and press the big red fire button. The game rewards the play style that requires no skill what so ever.

[Sean von Steinike]

Tachikoma101, on 02 November 2012 - 11:09 PM, said:

I kind of agree, over the last few days of playing I have noticed more and more people playing missile boats for this exact reason. Sure you can sometime use the environment to avoid them, if you manage to get behind something within the 4 seconds it takes for them to kill you.

I'm getting over this game because of this problem, so many matches just end with the team of LRM spamming mechs, sitting up on high points and raining down the missiles. I don't understand why so many people do it, seems like such a boring way to play, just sit on a hill and press the big red fire button. The game rewards the play style that requires no skill what so ever.

So go kill them. Missile boats are not that hard to counter.

[Tachikoma101]

obviously they are since there is such a large portion of the community being annoyed by them. You can't kill them if they can destroy you before you can get anywhere near them. They need a nerf, that is obvious, more delay between firing, less damage and no more of this guided by the hand of god accuracy.

[DegeneratePervert]

One excellent indicator of a weapon's "OP-Ness" is to see how many players are using the weapon. Every match I'm in, the sky is filled with massive clouds of LRMs. LRM boats dominate the scoreboards with 600+ damage constantly. They sit back, way back, and let a fast running mech behind a lag shield tag their enemies, and then they pound them into the dirt. They are indeed difficult to counter, and anyone who says otherwise has obviously never come across a well organized team with 3+ boats and a scout.

[Tyronica]

Atm there is a counter yeah its hard to pull off in a pug, more of a premade thing.

Get 8 AMS or more depending on your mech setup, atleast 2 tons of ammo, if there is a missle boat squad, stand near each other and stay near each other trying to nuke there scout thats running around tagging you. all this while waiting for the rain.
You should be able to survive alot better because 8 AMS+ take out a lot of missles.

ofc that doesnt mean i dont think the AMS needs to be buffed these LRM boats were a problem to deal with in CB but they are and will remain the pug stomper wep of choise.

[Mick Mars]

As a guy that runs lrm boats alot, I would say that lrm's should be nerfed back to 1 dmg/missile. They are just way too op right now, it is the ultimate "I win" button. I was one that couldnt beat them, so I joined them. I really do prefer to use my Atlas as it was intended( direct fire as opposed to fire support), but I get so tired of getting trashed down to orange within 4-6 salvos hitting me. At 1 dmg/missile, they really are more survivable, even with three boats firing at you.

[nektu]

DegeneratePervert, on 02 November 2012 - 11:32 PM, said:

One excellent indicator of a weapon's "OP-Ness" is to see how many players are using the weapon. Every match I'm in, the sky is filled with massive clouds of LRMs. LRM boats dominate the scoreboards with 600+ damage constantly. They sit back, way back, and let a fast running mech behind a lag shield tag their enemies, and then they pound them into the dirt. They are indeed difficult to counter, and anyone who says otherwise has obviously never come across a well organized team with 3+ boats and a scout.

You are aware that most of the trial mechs have LRMs? The founder catapult too. At the moment, many people dont really have a choice - they have to use LRMs.

Once they see the rearm costs for the first time, that will probably change

[StainlessSR]

Unfortunitly, no, cost to rearm will not keep these builds from being mainstreamed in play as they are too effective. I have played LRM boats since I got into closed beta, at first they were killers, then they nerfed tracking and attack angle, this brought them into line with what they should be. Until, they tightened grouping (so missles didn't hit the ground around the mech also, making for practically all missiles hitting the target) and raised damage. With this combination of changes LRM boating is the way to go. With DHS being nerfed, this or a guassapult are the only viable nonlight builds. Put 3 on a team and watch the enemy melt. If damage isn't reduced then reload times should be increased (maybe even doubled). Fast hunchies used to be the going counter for LRM boats as they had the speed/armor/firepower to kill them, but they got nerfed, lights can try but a properly deployed lrm team can focus 2 lrm mechs on the light that is attacking the third, quickly bringing it down.

edit: Spelling

Edited by StainlessSR, 03 November 2012 - 02:16 AM.

[Sean von Steinike]

Tachikoma101, on 02 November 2012 - 11:21 PM, said:

obviously they are since there is such a large portion of the community being annoyed by them. You can't kill them if they can destroy you before you can get anywhere near them. They need a nerf, that is obvious, more delay between firing, less damage and no more of this guided by the hand of god accuracy.

I take them on all the time and rarely die from LRMs. Pilot a light and tear into them. That one of the jobs a light should be doing.

[Dorkselot]

I think the best solution is to increase the arming range....

so any LRM does nothin unless you are 950~1050 range...thisway all you gotta do is close the distance and they will have to use MRMs and SRMs...thus making them have less punch my having them to spread on different range missle types...

thats all theory i have not played the game that much so i dont rly know what are the eff ranges right now...

i dont know if you can turn off your active scanner and try getting to them on a curve unnoticed...are there systems like in MW4 that increase lock time for enemy missles...can you have more than one AMS...what types of AMS are there...

are there any other weps that rivle LRM on range...i doubt that there areany lasers...but what about cannons?

why dont they make it possible for you to redirect your fire onto the upcoming LRMs and try taking them with your wep systems...from what i understand LRMs have collision programed onto them if you can hide behind a building why not make them a little more real and let you shoot them down from the sky

[Raidho]

DegeneratePervert, on 02 November 2012 - 11:32 PM, said:

... LRM boats dominate the scoreboards with 600+ damage constantly. They sit back, way back, and let a fast running mech behind a lag shield tag their enemies, and then they pound them into the dirt. They are indeed difficult to counter, and anyone who says otherwise has obviously never come across a well organized team with 3+ boats and a scout.

dealing much damage does not mean it was efficient. if you rip off the complete armor from an atlas, you dealt much damage but it is still walking around and can shoot

of course it is annoying when it´s raining but like said before: close combat, and most lram boat can´t defend themselves.

[Taemien]

The problem isn't the missile boats. They're pretty helpless.

Its the little scout mech running around. Some of them are downright sneaky enough to not even fire at you, content to just get the spotting xp.

Destroy the little bug and the missiles will stop. This has been my counter to them and in the last dozen games, I haven't been killed by the missile boats.

Missile boats require alot of variables in their favor to work right. They need a target, they need to lock on said target, and then need to hold the lock. This normally requires a buddy. Some of the nastier ones are capable of wading in themselves. When running my C1, I can do this. Usually softening up armor with the lasers before letting the missiles get in some juicy hits on internals.

Right now I'm running a K2 and missile boats just get their ears shot off by my ER Large Lasers. I can engage at the same range they can (with slightly reduced damage), but I don't need a lock. The majority of their missiles are impacting cover and I know its gotta be making them rage a bit.

People say get close, you don't need to. Just get a long range weapon and snipe at them. Again watching for the little scouts at your back. Without them, the missiles are easy to avoid. There is a slight lag shield for fast movers, but just aim ahead of them by a mech length and you'll connect.

Knowing how missiles work helps to avoid them. Assume that they have a lock if they fired. If you can break the lock, the missiles will sail over. Keep note that the missiles will track the last location of the lock when it dropped so don't stay near there. Also keep in mind that a lock can be re-established so keep cover until the missiles impact.

Do all that and you'll do substantially more damage to them then they are doing to you.

AMS isn't even needed. But it does help in case you get caught with your pants down.

Quote

They are indeed difficult to counter, and anyone who says otherwise has obviously never come across a well organized team with 3+ boats and a scout.

This is called a 4man+ premade. If they had Gauss, Large Lasers, or PPCs instead, you'd be instagibbed. I know, I've ran such a premade.

Edited by Taemien, 03 November 2012 - 04:13 AM.

[Captain Wolfsburg]

Sean von Steinike, on 02 November 2012 - 11:11 PM, said:

So go kill them. Missile boats are not that hard to counter.

Sean von Steinike, on 03 November 2012 - 02:53 AM, said:

I take them on all the time and rarely die from LRMs. Pilot a light and tear into them. That one of the jobs a light should be doing.

Okay, first, don't just say they're easy to counter and not provide anything constructive to backup your point. LRMs are OP, LRM boats are too common, and great points to support this have been made. Your comment = useless.

Secondly, If every match boils down to "Take a LRM boat" or "Pilot a fast light" That defeats the purpose of a game that's supposed to promote balance and use of combined arms and tactics to achieve a common objective. People like you who support this style of game play are missing the point of battletech and mechwarrior entirely and it's really frustrating how large a portion of the players of this game folks like you make up.

The fact is, if this problem isn't solved, a lot (and I mean a LOT) of people are going to get bored and leave, because nobody likes a black and white game with absolutely no variation in matches or play style.

Do you get what I'm trying to get at here?

[JudgeDeathCZ]

I play LRM cat-c4 and actualy the worst thing is one dragon supprising me with AC/2,light mech circing me and get hammered by enemy LRMs bcuz they have lock on me.Thats the counter and its not so hard.Some ppl need to l2p before they start to cry on forums

[Orion ji]

*** sigh** the video game industry forums are always full of whiners who would rather QQ endlessly about a specific feature than actually learn to play. Meaning, how to counter or enhance said feature.

The 1st thing you do is hit the forums and QQ endlessly because it in no way could be your lack of ability to adapt. Oh no, it must be the games' fault that you suck.