83 replies to this topic

[Renthrak]

With the latest patch, I would characterize changes to hit detection as 'different' rather than an 'improvement'. Sometimes, hit detection is spot-on, even against moving targets. Other times, hit detection is very far off, even against stationary or overheated targets.

Firing at a Commando that overheated in the Caustic Valley caldera, direct hits to the 'Mech produce glowing armor spots, but no damage. Spraying lasers to either side of the 'Mech causes some damage, but not consistently enough to determine where to shoot precisely.

Piloting a Trial Raven, following an enemy Trial Raven, matched speed, less than 50m distance. Full alpha strike, lasers and short range missiles. All shots hit on the screen, zero damage registered on paper doll.

Circling an enemy Catapult, firing short range missiles. Shots impact on the screen, missiles explode against enemy 'Mech, no hits registered.

PING between 50 and 100 during all of the above.

Of all the frustrations in a game, hit detection is the most discouraging. It is not acceptable for the game to show every effect of hitting your target, from sound to visual effects, and fail to apply any damage to the target.

If this can't be remedied, the client-side prediction should be removed. I would rather have lag and a delay on registering input if I can actually see where people are. If a round-trip to the server and back is necessary for what's on the screen to be right, I don't see any other option.

[Shlkt]

Renthrak, on 29 October 2012 - 04:26 PM, said:

If this can't be remedied, the client-side prediction should be removed. I would rather have lag and a delay on registering input if I can actually see where people are. If a round-trip to the server and back is necessary for what's on the screen to be right, I don't see any other option.

Ditto here... prediction is nice when it works, but if lag is unavoidable then I'd much rather see it. I can't compensate for black box network code.

[GaussDragon]

Renthrak, on 29 October 2012 - 04:26 PM, said:

Of all the frustrations in a game, hit detection is the most discouraging. It is not acceptable for the game to show every effect of hitting your target, from sound to visual effects, and fail to apply any damage to the target.

I agree 100%.

[TerebNeerg]

Yep. I made a post about it linking numerous videos and some beta forum threads...

http://mwomercs.com/...osition-desync/

Some videos pointing out the bad hit detection:
http://www.youtube.c...d&v=EqUVUG54L7Y (Glory)
http://www.youtube.c...d&v=sAaIoC1Re0o (Dale)
http://www.youtube.c...d&v=Z7iRscA8Vzc (zverofaust)
http://www.youtube.c...d&v=hoJ3nHACy2U (Norris J Packard)


Threads from beta forums:
http://mwomercs.com/...es/page__st__20
http://mwomercs.com/...th-video-proof/

It has been theorized that the really bad hit detection (hits not registering on stationary & shutdown targets) is caused by a position mismatch following a collision. I think that this is highly likely.
Is it possible that the standing up animation (complete with its incorrect position + teleport) was fixing this issue and now that collisions & knockdown animations have been removed, the problem is visible?

Edited by TerebNeerg, 29 October 2012 - 09:02 PM.

[zverofaust]

Hit detection isn't just inadequate, it's down-right unacceptable. My very first shot of my very first game in Open Beta, I plugged a Jenner in the face with a Large Laser, saw his Mech light up bright orange as his armour melted under the heat, but not a single shred of damage was done. He was absolutely unblemished on the info readout. When you have to lead LASERS to get them to hit, you know things are bad. Very bad. Back in pre-September people were complaining about Jenners having "lag shields". Now Atlases have lag shields.

[Alymbic]

I'm not having any real problems, and this is coming from someone who has ~270-300ms ping on a good day. Maybe I simply havent noticed it over my normal latency issues.

[DoRkcHoPs]

its pretty bad... i would say worse than before the last patch.

[Th3 Ron1n]

Alymbic, on 29 October 2012 - 08:19 PM, said:

I'm not having any real problems, and this is coming from someone who has ~270-300ms ping on a good day. Maybe I simply havent noticed it over my normal latency issues.

start watching the target info of a person when u shoot at them. primarily the light mechs seems to be the biggest offenders but ive seen it on atlas's aswell. it becomes extremely noticeable when u pilot a fast mech.

[Matthew Ace]

It's said that collision might have something to do with this somehow as well.

[IceGryphon]

Can't take it, happened multiple times.
Dropping MWO. This game is ***. Adios bros.

[Hayashi]

I usually have between 280 to 370 ping, and I've noticed severe lag shielding problems with lasers. Not with Atlases, but with Medium or below targets.

Outfitting my Jenner with Streaks seems to be the only way to guarantee damage, since apparently the Streaks' targeting is dependent on the target's actual location, and not the apparent location on my HUD. I've lit up CTs with zero damage registered several times, and my Streaks have appeared to miss entirely before, only to actually register a hit in the paper doll.

[TerebNeerg]

Updated my post w/ links to videos showing this.

[Spider Monkeylord]

I too am having severe problems with it detection. Significantly worse than in the past.

Along with crashes, visual bugs, heat bugs... stuff for other threads. But overall this game is getting less and less fun. I still like it but geez... fix it quickly. This is patch number who knows what where they've continued to fiddle with the economy and the only changes to the actual gameplay have been mostly negative.

[smithmule]

with an aussie ping of 250 - 290ms .. i cant hit anything

[D34K]

UK ping of around 90-105 and I'd rate the hit detection issue as chronic. It's much worse on faster mechs. Having to lead lasers isn't right.

[superbob]

IMO hit detection is the greatest and most important issue in MWO and PGI has to deal with ASAP. As long as it's impossible to hit your targets without tricks (like leading with lasers or knowing ballistics fire with up to 500ms lag), the game simply cannot represent itself properly.

All the team and weapon balancing will amount to nothing if the only weapons that hit are LRMs and SSRMs.

I'd like to say that the bug is marginalized or usually isn't that bad, but that's definitely far from the truth. It happens in every game and usually to an extent that makes it impossible to hit anything that moves faster then 50kph. Well, not exactly impossible, once you start to lead your targets and shoot at air, you can do some damage. And even if it's only off by a bit and hits register in different locations, it's a horrible bug as well - I really want to be able to target specific areas on enemy mechs, right now I'm lucky just to hit them.

Hit detection is as basic to a game like MWO as being able to steer your mech left and right. This and other bugs is like comparing a car missing a wheel and missing third gear. You can drive it either way, but you'd need a some skill and a lot of concentration to get far on just three wheels. Third gear is just a feature you need to get to average speed, it's tedious but you can get where you want to without it. Neither car would be fit for the road, but the one without a wheel looks like a wreck at first sight. Which, sadly, is the case with MWO.

[Purplefluffybunny]

If you take a look at this site you will see that they have an advert up for network programmers. So, I expect a proper fix won't be along until they have the skill sets in place to fix it.

[Crimson Fenris]

Hit detection is really a major issue, the most important up to date IMO.

Never had hit detection issues before the last patch, running in a laser + SMR jenner with a consistant 130-150 ms ping. Not one time before, even against other lights during "circles of death"...

Now, I experienced very very bad hit detection, from having to fire off a fast moving target to damage him, to the inability to alpha strike a powered-down commando, no mention some assault mechs also getting the benefits of the lagshield...

I seriously dont know what have been broken during the process, but before, for an average european player with an acceptable ping, it was perfectly playable.
Now it became totally off trails. Please, fix it ASAP, or it will badly ruin the new players' experience...

[Purplefluffybunny]

Crimson Fenris, on 30 October 2012 - 04:28 AM, said:

Hit detection is really a major issue, the most important up to date IMO.

Never had hit detection issues before the last patch, running in a laser + SMR jenner with a consistant 130-150 ms ping. Not one time before, even against other lights during "circles of death"...

Now, I experienced very very bad hit detection, from having to fire off a fast moving target to damage him, to the inability to alpha strike a powered-down commando, no mention some assault mechs also getting the benefits of the lagshield...

I seriously dont know what have been broken during the process, but before, for an average european player with an acceptable ping, it was perfectly playable.
Now it became totally off trails. Please, fix it ASAP, or it will badly ruin the new players' experience...

Some have suggested that the removal of the knockdown mechanic is to blame. I believe the argument was that a knockdown and small warp effect matches the server back up with the client more fully.

[DaZur]

Food for thought... and sadly this can only qualified by the devs via a a damage audit or some seriously coordinated in-game testing methodology.
'
Right now everyone is pointing to damage not registering on the target mech. Is it possible it's the other way around? I.e... The damage is actually registering on the target mech but the paper doll indicator is not syncing with the actual damage inflicted.

I say this because I cored an assault mech last night with a AC20 hit that as far as the paper doll was concerned, on a completely fresh / undamaged CT.

Edited by DaZur, 30 October 2012 - 05:09 AM.