449 replies to this topic

[DirePhoenix]

Artemis, ECM, TAG, Narc... How is it that this game already has "power creep" before it has even launched?!?

Oh right... we're starting this timeline at the same time that the boardgame pretty much established the term.

...Another reason a 3015 era would've been better starting point.

[TheUnderking]

Bashars, on 08 November 2012 - 04:26 PM, said:

I had that problem a few patches back. I run a Nvidia card and I found if you turn the Anti-Aliasing to off it helps... if I leave it set to PostAA I get alot of motion blur. Not sure how or why it works but it works for me.

Thanks for the info, I gave it a whirl but it didn't help me. I'd have to restart the game after every match. I'm using a Nvidia card myself.

[Holcane]

Awesome! Thanks devs.

[Falconheart]

DirePhoenix, on 08 November 2012 - 05:22 PM, said:

Artemis, ECM, TAG, Narc... How is it that this game already has "power creep" before it has even launched?!?

Oh right... we're starting this timeline at the same time that the boardgame pretty much established the term.

...Another reason a 3015 era would've been better starting point.

There is power creep in the game here. However, I will bet that they will install options for timeline games at some point where only Tier 1 gear can be used and then Tier 2, etc. Might even see matches where canon only mechs are allowed. They are still doing a form of testing with this open beta so there will be growing pains as with all games.

[Captain Commander]

Thank you for this! Finally!

[Terrorizer]

This patch sounds like a great idea. I'm looking forward to seeing how they tweaked the arc of LRMs. I bet that's why most of the boaters in this thread are crying.

[Dirus Nigh]

Paul Inouye, on 07 November 2012 - 06:05 PM, said:

Let me clarify this post for you all:

1) LRM damage is being decreased *slightly*
2) The LRM trajectory has been fixed. It was a bug that cause the 90-degree drops on the top of your Mech.
3) The Artemis isn't LOSING the group tightening, it's just not going to be as tight. How much is it being reduced by? 5%.
4) It's not a 3rd person cockpit. It's the 1st person cockpit that gets drawn around your pilot. It would shift out of destroyed Mech when you spectate them in 3rd person.

Thank you Garth and Paul for the update and your responses.

This was a must needed fix however the artemis iv system still needs adjustment.

As Prosperity Park as stated earlier artemis iv needs to be an LOS system only with no effect when firing indirectly. After all this is how the system works in TT. If indirect fire is being used then LRMs should switch bonuses given by NARC, or TAG or none as the case my be. Please implement this and see how it plays out.

I also want to assume that TAG, NARC, and artemis iv do not stack. Or if they do in very limited ways.

edit.
Question. Has the flight trajectory of the LRMs been changed as a whole or just when artemis iv is being used? Have the flight trajectory been rolled back to before the patch on the sixth or a new trajectory?

Edited by Dirus Nigh, 08 November 2012 - 07:10 PM.

[SamizdatCowboy]

Thanks a lot guys, the fact that you listened to player feedback and provided a timely fix really does mean a lot and definitely builds trust/faith/loyalty for new players like me who just aren't that familiar with Piranha.

Happy to see MW is in pro hands.

[Y0g1]

Thank you guys! fantastic hotfix! things havent been this balanced in a while.

[JP]

they have taken LRMs out of the game currently.

[Thanos]

I honestly don't think the LRM issue would have been an issue at all IF the ECM suites had been implemented accordingly at the same time (ie all or nothing). As it stands we they made LRM's and to a smaller degree SRM's OP in lieu of making them lighter on the damage tables while they figure a fix to make the playing field equivalent. The angle was definitely required you should be able to duck and cover missle fire as a light. One thing they seem to have missed is the FPS loss due to all the fracking LRM's in the air. While this will help a bit it's a netcode issue they do need to address, especially if they plan to implement more full on warfare with an increasing number of units on the field (which it appears they still intend to do at some point).

[AceTimberwolf]

I see what happened... What happened was people got used to the OP LRMs that making them the way they are supposed to act confuses people. 400-700 DMG with non stop LRM is about right. They aren't suppose to dominate the battlefield. Now with the Balance people now have ART launchers to look forward too.

[JeepStuff]

Justin Xang Allard, on 08 November 2012 - 05:17 PM, said:

It was a massive nerf. Previous to the artemis patch i ran around 800-1000 damage in a group that supported missiles. now its 300-500 max. makes missiles as effective as large pulse lasers that cant fire close in........ i would rather they removed artemis and put the missile pathing back the way it was before the artemis patch. Now missile mechs are worthless as i score as much or more in my non missile mechs.

See, I read this as an argument for why the nerf was needed for balance. I'd rather not have you (or anyone) out there doing 800-1000 damage on a regular basis. One build shouldn't be able to consistently do 2x or 3x the damage as all the other builds. That's the very definition of overpowered, right? When you say that after the patch your missile mech works about as well as the non-missile mechs -- to me that says "balance achieved" and the patch is doing exactly what it's supposed to do.

[gunslinger31]

AceTimberwolf, on 08 November 2012 - 09:31 PM, said:

I see what happened... What happened was people got used to the OP LRMs that making them the way they are supposed to act confuses people. 400-700 DMG with non stop LRM is about right. They aren't suppose to dominate the battlefield. Now with the Balance people now have ART launchers to look forward too.

Yes, 400-700 DMG with non stop LRM is about right. Problem is you get maybe 400, if you lucky, almost never miss, have Artemis and 1000+ rounds of ammo. Which is not fine.

EJT, on 08 November 2012 - 09:41 PM, said:

See, I read this as an argument for why the nerf was needed for balance. I'd rather not have you (or anyone) out there doing 800-1000 damage on a regular basis. One build shouldn't be able to consistently do 2x or 3x the damage as all the other builds. That's the very definition of overpowered, right? When you say that after the patch your missile mech works about as well as the non-missile mechs -- to me that says "balance achieved" and the patch is doing exactly what it's supposed to do.

After the patch non-LRM mech works much more fine then any LRM boat. Tried some fights, emptied 1080 rounds of Artemis LRMs with direct LOS, got 250 dmg and no "component destroyed". Switched to SRM cat A1, and died fast in the first fight, only difference that i did 300 dmg with maybe 100 rounds. Do you think thats exactly as it supposed to go?


Another problem (and big one) is no shaking. When you got shot by missiles, your cockpit and crosshair was jerking, which made missiles very useful weapon even though they couldnt kill - at least your opponent couldnt fire at you with full efficiency.
So, tell me again, whats the point of LRMs now? Support? Little to no damage, no hampering, and big ammo cost... You'd better off with K2 and twin AC/2's - at least they shake the enemy when hit.

Edited by gunslinger31, 08 November 2012 - 10:06 PM.

[Ronin Starwalker]

good

[Vassago Rain]

Currentl LRMs, even with artemis, are underwhelming, while old LRMs, pre-artemis and this latest patch, were good and useful.

I predicted this.

[AceTimberwolf]

gunslinger31, on 08 November 2012 - 09:57 PM, said:

Yes, 400-700 DMG with non stop LRM is about right. Problem is you get maybe 400, if you lucky, almost never miss, have Artemis and 1000+ rounds of ammo. Which is not fine.


After the patch non-LRM mech works much more fine then any LRM boat. Tried some fights, emptied 1080 rounds of Artemis LRMs with direct LOS, got 250 dmg and no "component destroyed". Switched to SRM cat A1, and died fast in the first fight, only difference that i did 300 dmg with maybe 100 rounds. Do you think thats exactly as it supposed to go?


Another problem (and big one) is no shaking. When you got shot by missiles, your cockpit and crosshair was jerking, which made missiles very useful weapon even though they couldnt kill - at least your opponent couldnt fire at you with full efficiency.
So, tell me again, whats the point of LRMs now? Support? Little to no damage, no hampering, and big ammo cost... You'd better off with K2 and twin AC/2's - at least they shake the enemy when hit.

Shake doesn't do anything. Its just fluff it doesn't change your reticule position so if ur used to it it didn't affect u at all. LRMs are suppose to miss. And its hard to confirm how many of your LRMs are solid hits. Again LRM boating in a Team setting is fine but if you are trying to main LRM boat then you need to find a better main.

[JeepStuff]

gunslinger31, on 08 November 2012 - 09:57 PM, said:

After the patch non-LRM mech works much more fine then any LRM boat. Tried some fights, emptied 1080 rounds of Artemis LRMs with direct LOS, got 250 dmg and no "component destroyed". Switched to SRM cat A1, and died fast in the first fight, only difference that i did 300 dmg with maybe 100 rounds. Do you think thats exactly as it supposed to go?
.

Regarding the LRMs, it depends on what the battle looked like. If you were shooting at a mech with AMS in the midde of a firefight where some of his buddies also had AMS, then yes, getting 250 damage with 1000 rounds sounds about right, in my opinion. Or if he was a jenner or commando running at full speed, then yes, that also sounds about right in my opinion. If he was some chucklehead all by himself in the middle of a clearing with no AMS, picking flowers and checking out the stars, then no, that doesn't sound right.

Regarding SRM's, AMS doesn't help the other mech, and it depends on how close you were and how many of your missiles connected. But I don't see any inherent problem with SRM's doing more damage than LRM's depending on the battle conditions.

[gunslinger31]

Vassago Rain, on 08 November 2012 - 10:09 PM, said:

Currentl LRMs, even with artemis, are underwhelming, while old LRMs, pre-artemis and this latest patch, were good and useful.

Agree with this.

AceTimberwolf, on 08 November 2012 - 10:10 PM, said:

Shake doesn't do anything. Its just fluff it doesn't change your reticule position so if ur used to it it didn't affect u at all. LRMs are suppose to miss. And its hard to confirm how many of your LRMs are solid hits. Again LRM boating in a Team setting is fine but if you are trying to main LRM boat then you need to find a better main.

Maybe shaking doesnt affect mech technically, but at least it gives you a warning that you're being rained with missiles.
I dont try to "main" LRM boat. I dont even play it often - i'm just saying latest fix made LRM boats useless even in team setting!

EJT, on 08 November 2012 - 10:32 PM, said:

Regarding the LRMs, it depends on what the battle looked like. If you were shooting at a mech with AMS in the midde of a firefight where some of his buddies also had AMS, then yes, getting 250 damage with 1000 rounds sounds about right, in my opinion. Or if he was a jenner or commando running at full speed, then yes, that also sounds about right in my opinion. If he was some chucklehead all by himself in the middle of a clearing with no AMS, picking flowers and checking out the stars, then no, that doesn't sound right.

I know how to play with LRMs and how to do decent damage.
So yeah, i dont try to shoot fast lights or throwing missiles in the middle of the enemy group, where most of it will be shot down by AMSs.
And still, even with Artemis i only do so much dmg as pre-patch LRM boat, and sometimes not even this much.

Which brings me back to the original point: dmg reduction was too much, it made LRMs useless.

EJT, on 08 November 2012 - 10:32 PM, said:

Regarding SRM's, AMS doesn't help the other mech, and it depends on how close you were and how many of your missiles connected. But I don't see any inherent problem with SRM's doing more damage than LRM's depending on the battle conditions.

Me neither. SRM cat was used just as an example to show that any other weapons do much more dmg then LRMs. I could've used twin gauss K2 or Yen-lo-wang as an example - no difference.

[crymeafingriver]

Please address the uneven team balance like one side gets 8 kills other side maybe 1 or 2 !!. This is really getting old!.