27 replies to this topic

[Crunk Prime]

As it stands its basically useless. It has the same firing delay as the other AC weapons making it hard to aim and make hits connect with. And to top it off, each pellet only does 1 damage, making your damage spread out all over a mech. So:

-close range weapon only
-hard to hit enemies with
-low damage spread out all over when you do manage to hit with it

What do you do with close range weapons that are supposed to hit hard? You make them hit hard and fast enough to scare people out of wanting to get close to you, with the drawbacks being its close range and ammo consumption.

What would you all say if the LBX/10 became a giant automatic shotgun?

-keep the damage the same
-alter the pellet spread a little
-increase ammo per ton a tad
-give it a much faster reload time

See an atlas with dual LBX/10s and 2 SRM6s? Stay out of range unless you enjoy every part of your mech being damaged at once.

Edited by Crunk Prime, 10 November 2012 - 04:05 PM.

[Kauhava]

Wish it had a faster ROF too. Right now it is no better than the AC/10 in close combat while being worse everywhere else. The extra ammo to go with that to ensure spammability in brawling situations or for peppering would help as well.

[Random Numbers]

Since we don't have knock down atm. I would suggest increasing the pellet damage of the AC to 1.7 like LRMS and see how that works.
Once we have knock down ability again I would move the damage to 1.5 and see about giving it a chance to knock down mechs from 20 to 50 ton range.

[LogicSol]

Just wait.
The LBX has the capability to fire AC/10 rounds, however the subsystem needed to allow this in game hasn't been coded yet.

[xenoglyph]

I think lowering the reload time of AC/10, AC/20, and LBX/10 would be a good way of balancing the Gauss rifle too.

[Cmdr Harabec]

It should have a much tighter spread and the damage per pellet increased to 1.5~1.7 area. Probably twice as tight a spread as it has now.

The Gauss rifle should have a longer reload time, the 10/20/10X's reload time is about right to me though they could stand to be a little shorter. It's mostly just that the spread on it's terrible. If you want to use a shotgun right now you're better off with SRMs by a longshot, and an AC/10 is almost universally better than the LB-10X as well due to no more than one pellet impacting one component in most ranges.

[Sawa963]

I like it the way it is. I don't want an automatic shotgun.

I thought I wanted dual AC/2s for close range brawling in my YLW. Yeah, the DPS is better, but in circle strafing fights it's really ******* hard to keep your targets focused for long periods while also leading them. Try it.

If it really needs to be differentiated from the AC/10 (more than taking up fewer slots, weighing less, and generating less heat -- which everyone seems to ignore), then I'd just want it to throw the enemy's vision around more or something. If not that, then I suppose a very slight cooldown decrease might be nice. Like 2.5 -> 2.2.

[Col Forbin]

I say... bring on the LBX/20!

[Skyfaller]

LBX10 needs to fire a promixity fuse shotgun shell.

Fire it...

when round is near a mech (~20m) it bursts into a forward cone spread.

[Damocles 1]

they've pretty much come out and said eliminating trigger lag is'nt an option due to they're cheat prevention methodology, the server needs that time to ping back and forth on the hit detection to ensure you're not using some clever tricks. its an infighters weapon only, and although its canon, it simply does'nt mesh with the style of play they're creating for now

[Ashnod]

I like my LB10 ..

[ltwally]

Col Forbin, on 10 November 2012 - 06:28 PM, said:

I say... bring on the LBX/20!

Still a few years away in timeline, if I recall.

(Unless you're a clanner.)

[Crunk Prime]

Damocles 1, on 10 November 2012 - 07:09 PM, said:

they've pretty much come out and said eliminating trigger lag is'nt an option due to they're cheat prevention methodology, the server needs that time to ping back and forth on the hit detection to ensure you're not using some clever tricks. its an infighters weapon only, and although its canon, it simply does'nt mesh with the style of play they're creating for now

So why are some weapons able to fire instantly, like lasers, flamers and machine guns?

[Sawa963]

Damocles 1, on 10 November 2012 - 07:09 PM, said:

they've pretty much come out and said eliminating trigger lag is'nt an option due to they're cheat prevention methodology, the server needs that time to ping back and forth on the hit detection to ensure you're not using some clever tricks. its an infighters weapon only, and although its canon, it simply does'nt mesh with the style of play they're creating for now

You know, I don't mind the trigger lag. I've adjusted to it. It doesn't feel strange for a massive ballistic weapon to have a windup time.

The problem is that when combined with the random-*** convergence and desync issues, trying to hit targets while moving becomes unacceptably random. Everything is just so inconsistent. Yeah, there is trigger lag, but most of the time when the bullets finally exit your gun, they travel towards the location you were aiming when you first clicked -- not where you're currently aiming. And sometime during that, you factor in convergence. How does that work? I have no ******* idea.

There are just too many factors working against accuracy. They need to fix convergence before they worry about the trigger delay.

[Elizander]

Well, one glaring issue is that the LB 10-X costs about half as much as a Commando.

[Damocles 1]

Crunk Prime, on 10 November 2012 - 07:36 PM, said:

So why are some weapons able to fire instantly, like lasers, flamers and machine guns?

this is due to the travel time of projectiles vs the instant contact of energy and area effect weapons

[Nostram]

I am happy with this weapon the way it is.

[Asmudius Heng]

What is this weapons ROLE. Lets talk about that before we talk about fixes.

To me it is the debate about being a shotgun or a explosive shell that detonates on proximity.

At the moment it is a shotgun and I kind of doubt that is going to change now so lets go with that.

Why a scattershot shotgun? Makes it hard to miss at close range and has deadly Damage up close but gets less as you get further out as the bullet spread become very wide.

The simplest fix would then to increase the damage of each pellet so that at close range it WILL hurt and will still do a bit at longer range.

Now this might make it too overpowered but some damage adjustment i feel is needed.

Using the emchanics of BT to inform the fluff, pellet shot and multiple location hitters were great at cit seeking in the TT game. Since we can aim this is not as needed. However increasing the damage that such weapons do to intenrals would be a way to simulate this and give the mech a role as a crit seeker as well.

These are the two things that would give a role to the gun and make it viable in its current implementation IMO

[Dibster]

I would like the LBX10 to do more damage from close range than the AC10 to give it purpose and character. Probably by increasing the rate of fire and compensating by increasing the spread.

[Oppresor]

Col Forbin, on 10 November 2012 - 06:28 PM, said:

I say... bring on the LBX/20!

Yes I totally agree with this one. I really like my LBX10 Scattershot; its by far the best thing I have ever fitted to the Atlas, sounds great and is backed up by the MG Array for CIWS work. However, if we were to get the LBX20 this would be a real improvement, especially when used in the last ditch CIWS role.