804 replies to this topic

[ASC]

I expected the end result would be something like this given how much they are trying to preserve the origional timeline.

The house-merc associations which have a signficant part to play have to be preserved, but corps under new names can be made into whatever their members want them to be.

I think a merc company without any pre-existing history are more interesting anyway, as it lets them become whatever their memebers want them to be. Want a certain reputation? play the way that matches that till everyone else acknowledges you for it.

[Arturus]

Carl Wrede, on 03 May 2012 - 02:22 PM, said:

Wrong, the name without a space was just for the webpage list. You can not have it ingame.
If you absolutely need to belong to that unit you have to become a house affiliated mechwarrior and work yourselves up to the point were you can join that house unit.

Awefully sure there, aren't ya? LOL

Not sure I read the dev explanations that way...If we want to make a unit call "SR" or "S-R" or "SkyeRangers" as a merc corp name even...what's stopping us? If we can't even pick that, what's the point of affiliating with a unit...any unit? I have been playing SR since the mid 80s TT version of BT...don't even tell me we can't play that unit...I don't want to "own" it, but I am certainly intending on being affiliated via a guild/unit name...somehow...Also, the footnote on the merc corp/unit webpage listing page states: "PS. If you're curious why some canon names look odd, please read Paul's explanation: "Merc Corp names are registered names. Once it’s taken, it’s gone. As for canon protected faction/unit names, we will be locking out some of the key players in the BT timeline." This seems to indicate if I want to be simply a merc unit I can use "SkyeRangers" (no space)...perhaps that is our simplest solution...Skye was always separatist anyway

[wwiiogre]

Private and Carl that is exactly what we expected. Since NWH is not part of the important part of canon or lore for this timeframe and do not get that way until 3058 and they said some of the important ones would be unavailable, not all. Also we knew and posted we knew we would not be THE NWH but part of the NWH the same way in MW4 you were a small part of a contracted group for the NWH, WD, GDL or KH. But the fact you weren't that unit. Just associated with it. Now we hear, if you want to be associated with a Clan or House Faction good, come sit here, have some cake. But if you want to be associated with the Merc units that involve most of the fiction and lore of BT then well sorry we don't serve your kind here, go make a name up and make sure you don't associate in any way with the story/fiction/canon that made you want to play this game in the first place.

This website even has mercs in its url, mwomercs, not mwohouse, not mwoclan, but mwomercs. So I am sorry if I got the wrong impression and now not only have I been told no, but don't bother.

Bryan has since stated that perhaps one day some Merc units will be factions.

Oh well

still waiting for the response, because it has been obvious that PGI does not talk internally and does not share what one hand does with the other for the last six months. Granted you guys have been liberal with this is all in flux. I understand that. Just was wishing for more clarity of purpose and following of an overall arc. Did not realize that one person had ideas different than others.

Hope it is all cleared up much better in the future. This is not a deal breaker for me but it will be for some. The fiction of known Merc units draw people to this IP and when you have Mercs in your url, you are pushing an image. Just saying.

Chris

Edited by wwiiogre, 03 May 2012 - 02:50 PM.

[Roken]

I don't see why some sort of compromise can't be reached. In MW4 Mercs, you basically chose a major Merc corps to sponsor you. I don't see why a similar solution can't be used by providing (significantly) more choices as far as Merc corps. Then you could essentially use them in place of the Houses. After choosing a Merc corp to sponsor your unit in the game, you ought then be able to form your own outfit with your own unit name. This way no one really loses out; you keep the same flexibility as the players that chose to align with the Houses but you can still be a part of your favorite Merc company, be it Wolf's Dragoon, Kell Hounds or whoever! The only real difference then would the fact that you aren't running the whole of the Merc company (which in terms of story would be absurd anyway) and the fact that you'd have to make your own name instead of using someone else's reputation.

[Thorqemada]

I am very ok with the decision not to allow the claiming of canon merc units but offer a career in them like in the house units, this is very reasonable.

[Firefly]

Bryan Ekman, on 03 May 2012 - 01:56 PM, said:

Free hugs for this guy! I can be a heart breaker sometimes.. My apologies. Hopefully you caught some of my replies. We are considering adding some of the canon merc units into the faction rule system. These would not be player run organizations.

The vast majority of my players will adapt and will play. We are not the canon Black Widow Company, it was mere coincidence and we make no attempt to RP or even claim that particular intent as some units may have done. I understand that this is a game not of our making, in an IP not of our creation, with a history defined by hundreds of writers - and I agree with the policy. We will attempt to play with a similar name (as I mentioned earlier), but we will play nonetheless.

[Salesninja]

Arturus, on 03 May 2012 - 02:18 PM, said:

So...if I got this right...our Lyran-affiliated unit would be designated (in game) as "SkyeRangers" (no space) as opposed to "Skye Rangers" (w/ a space)? Our small group of 'Mechwarriors identifies strongly with this unit and our website is built around the Skye Brigade, but we don't claim to 'own it'; just affiliated. So it appears as if we will be creating an in game "guild (unit)" named "SkyeRangers" (no space), signing up with House Steiner, winning some prestige (or infamy) and working our way up.

I can live with that. Seems reasonable.

Pretty sure this is wrong, and hence the bummer. THe only way I could see it work is all of your unit members affiliate with House Steiner, and look for a "Skye Rangers" house unit to become a part of(assuming that will be available)

That would allow another "unit who maybe wanted to be the Skye rangers to do the same thing. On some level you could maybe represent diffrent regiments or batalions or whatever, and hoever the game mechanics impliment this, you can influence faction specific decisions. Basicly anyone that puts the work in can be a part of the Rangers (or whomever)

Pulling this out or my reactor pipe here, but I think that sounds right.

And when I say right, I mean right according to the new info yet. I am still kinda undecided on how much this personally bums me out.

Edited by Salesninja, 03 May 2012 - 03:40 PM.

[Riin Suul]

jimsolo, on 03 May 2012 - 01:38 PM, said:

I by no means speak for my Outfit but I have no intention of playing the game with this rule in place.

Denying use of Merc Names is wrong. Period.
Major houses I can understand but at the very least a player created outfit should be able to play as:

1) Sub-units of the Major Houses with House logo's/colors.
2) Battletech Lore Merc Units or at minimum Sub-units there of.
Preventing copies is the only rule that need be in place.

If I cannot play under the "Black Widow Company" AND her current logo's then I wont play at all.

END OF STORY

"The Customer is ALWAYS right"

if you actually expected to be able to run a merc corp which exists in canon and is as prestigious as the black widow company, you are insane.

There is no WAY that the devs could run this game according to canon if they just allowed people to grab famous people and organizations and claim them as their own. These units have there place in the overarching backstory of this universe, and as such must be controlled by the storytellers.

[Jake Sorren]

jimsolo, on 03 May 2012 - 01:38 PM, said:

I by no means speak for my Outfit but I have no intention of playing the game with this rule in place.

Denying use of Merc Names is wrong. Period.
Major houses I can understand but at the very least a player created outfit should be able to play as:

1) Sub-units of the Major Houses with House logo's/colors.
2) Battletech Lore Merc Units or at minimum Sub-units there of.
Preventing copies is the only rule that need be in place.

If I cannot play under the "Black Widow Company" AND her current logo's then I wont play at all.

END OF STORY

"The Customer is ALWAYS right"

Unless you can claim the identity of the leader of a unit and act in character, then NO you are never going to be able to claim the unit.

By all means play as a PART of it.

[Firefly]

Jake Sorren, on 03 May 2012 - 02:46 PM, said:

Unless you can claim the identity of the leader of a unit and act in character, then NO you are never going to be able to claim the unit.

By all means play as a PART of it.

What my battle buddy is talking about is the fact that our particular Black Widow Company Widows shares exactly one thing in common with the canon unit - a name. His intent, which is his personal opinion only, is to say that we are not like (for example) Gray Death Legion or Clan Wolf.When we created the unit back in 2002, none of us knew anything about BattleTech. It wasn't until about 2009 that someone asked if we chose the name based on the canon merc unit.

At any rate, I am the unit CO. My decision is that we adapt and overcome. If we can name ourselves something similar that in no way ties ourselves in-game to Wolf's Dragoons, then that is what we will do.

Edited by Firefly, 03 May 2012 - 02:52 PM.

[Arturus]

SalesNinja,

Points taken...

Or we just create the "SkyeRangers" (or "SR" or "S-R") Merc Unit and go about our merry way ... either way we alreadyy have the Skye Rangers website which incoporates Steiner canon ranks, mechs, etc etc., which I launched way back c. 2000, way before this game was even someone's dream at PGI I would much prefer our unit to be House Steiner affiliated right from the get go, but if we have to create a "merc guild/unit" to accomplish this, then that is what we will do.

Why can't PGI just allow people to name their own units/guilds anyway they like, on a first come basis, like all other online games do...? (ie, player named units would have NO impact on gameplay or in game canon/events, etc.).

Guess we will have to see how they do this at launch but it seems to be a big 'non-problem' in need of no solution.

[Carl Wrede]

Oh well.. you can twist the devs words back and forth to keep your dream alive but you will find out when the game goes live.

[Fresh Meat]

Whoop, great new

[Threat Doc]

jimsolo, on 03 May 2012 - 01:38 PM, said:

If I cannot play under the "Black Widow Company" AND her current logo's then I wont play at all.

I'm calling your bluff, Jim. You'll be here, and you're full of crap otherwise.

[Insidious Johnson]

Hi! I'm Stephan Amaris! I'm nuking this thread!

Well, it is what it is. Looks like the houseboiz and clanboiz will both pretty much be stooges of NPCs and suffering from cattle call recruiting with little or no means of filtering out bad apples. Pickins is looking GOOD. Mercs will be the best run units and the places vets (who aren't emo-tied to something else) will want to go for the most "pew,pew,pew". At least until they do to Mercs what they did to houses. Bottom line, if your unit is not player run by a competant leader, its peon anarchy soup.

[MostlyHarmless]

Bryan Ekman, on 03 May 2012 - 12:44 PM, said:

It's under consideration yes. Our long term goal is to slowly introduction a way for players to run the NPC factions as well (hugely ambitious and highly risky).

Bryan,
As much as I think that would be an awesome thing, but you do realize how heated the debate is going to be that first week of power? Does the FRR invade the Clan home worlds or the rest of the IS first before going after the other? Somethings are just best left locked up for everyone's sake.
I understand the frustration that must be felt by a lot of players but I also understand that you all (PGI) have a responsibility to all Battletech fans to protect and best use the IP. As fans we should be supporting you when you do work to protect it even if it is from ourselves at times. I for one am interested to see what other merc group histories everyone comes up with, there is no shortage of creative people in this community.

[Arturus]

Carl Wrede, on 03 May 2012 - 02:54 PM, said:

Oh well.. you can twist the devs words back and forth to keep your dream alive but you will find out when the game goes live.

not twisting anything...We just don't have clear guidelines here...and the most recent dev response is seemingly even more cryptic. I am not adverse to creating a merc guild to use the names and medals/ranks we want to (via our website)...but this just seems kind of a silly way to launch the game with so many built-in naming restrictions on PLAYER GUILD naming right from the get go...what's the problem with 3 different Clan this's or that's or five diferent 12 Vegan or 4th Skye Rangers units...as long as the player selected names don't violate profanity rules or something, or affect in game events, wth is the problem???

[wwiiogre]

I never want nor do I ever want fan controlled House/Merc/Clan, would however like to be a merc unit that is part of the Larger Merc Canon unit so we can work together, launch together and play the MWO game with people we know and trust. People we choose ourselves, people who could approach us, we could help them learn the game and all play together. Because some of us like specific merc units the way some like specific clan units the way some like specific houses. The Clan guys get to play for the clan they choose, the House guys get to play for the House they want. The merc guys, oh well, tough luck. Just thinking this could have been handled way better. Sub units, whatever, dev run, anything but what was chosen is better other than allowing unknown person to completely run the entire Wolf's Dragoon unit. I am not ok with that, never have, never will be. But for someone to say they are a contracted small merc company working for Wolf's Dragoon. I am ok with that.

But, oh well, The cow is out of the barn, the house has burned down, the milk is spilt. The house can be rebuilt, the milk can be licked off the floor and if nothing happens to the cow while its out, you can bring it back to the barn.

Chris

[Pvt Dancer]

Firefly, on 03 May 2012 - 02:51 PM, said:

What my battle buddy is talking about is the fact that our particular Black Widow Company Widows shares exactly one thing in common with the canon unit - a name. His intent, which is his personal opinion only, is to say that we are not like (for example) Gray Death Legion or Clan Wolf.When we created the unit back in 2002, none of us knew anything about BattleTech. It wasn't until about 2009 that someone asked if we chose the name based on the canon merc unit.

At any rate, I am the unit CO. My decision is that we adapt and overcome. If we can name ourselves something similar that in no way ties ourselves in-game to Wolf's Dragoons, then that is what we will do.

As for your battle buddy, if he is not here to play the game, then he shouldn't be here and he sure as heck shouldn't be asked to be a beta tester.

I understand you want to try very hard to keep your clan name for this game, as I can just guess you guys probably play BF3 and MW3. I was in the same boat with a clan that existed since Day of Defeat and still sorta exists (so 10-15 years). But the simple fact is that this pre-dates your clan by 25 years and to play here, you /will/ have to change your name. There are to many people who either know to much about the universe and will assume your a rip-off of the BWC or know so little of the game and know they want to join that 'Spider merc group cuz they R kool' that they mistake you for them. It sucks, I know... but your fighting a battle you can't win.

[Paul Inouye]

jimsolo, on 03 May 2012 - 01:38 PM, said:

"The Customer is ALWAYS right"

Wicked.. I'm putting Dinosaurs in the game and Gundams!! WOO!!