33 replies to this topic

[Teralitha]

So your a good pilot, you know how to soak up damage on your arms and torsos by turning your torso from side to side to hide the CT. Your getting pressured, and you start to lose limbs... then componants, and weapons, but still you survive and your team finally comes to rescue you, or you manage to kill all your opponants. Yay you win and survive. Or you dont win but go down in a blaze of glory.


Then you see the repair bill. Ouch. I survived the match and won but... damn
_______________________________________________________________________

So your a bad pilot, who doesnt know how to hide from incoming damage very well, doesnt use cover, or stands still when getting shot in the face and your cockpit gets taken out, while youve barely contributed any damage to the enemy because your... still a noob.

Then you get the repair bill. Oh look, only a few k cbills lost to replace the cockpit, and I still made a profit even though I lost how awesome.


So it seems that good players that know how to spread damage and survive a long time, or survive til the match is won are the ones paying the biggest repair bills.

Is this fair?

Edited by Teralitha, 15 November 2012 - 04:16 PM.

[OpCentar]

It is because a good pilot will do more damage the longer he survives or just create a diversion enabling his lance to gain the advantage.

The downside is he will pay more for repairs.


Inexperienced pilots die fast and remove 1/8 of their teams capability, defensive and offensive.

I do agree that it should be balanced more by increasing C-Bill gain for damage done. The finer points are always up for debate.

[Teralitha]

Perhaps they should start tracking those stats for data. How many times does a player take heavy damage, and survive, or how many times he takes heavy damage, but dies and team still win. The length of time they survived. how much damage they dish out compared to how much is taken when it is alot, and perhaps some other variables.

[OpCentar]

Too complicated for my taste.

Simply buff C-Bill damage done gain coefficient from x10 to x100.

Split the profits if you had a scout relaying target data to you, or take all if you did that much damage alone on the front.


It can be further tweaked by adjusting it in regards to the players mech class.

[Asmudius Heng]

They need more awards at the end of matches to promote peoples teamwork efforts.

Spotter award - extra XP or cbills for the person with the most spots (they already get in game spot rewards so might not be needed)

Bullet sponge award - the player who took the most damage in relation to this mechs weight.

Damage award - whoever does the most damage in relations his mechs weight

Base defence awards - for stopping capping (probably in game like spotting) or getting an enemy kill or component loss on enemies in the red square.

Psycho award - those that take a huge amount of damage but also put out a massive amount of damage as well!

Assist award for the person with the most assist POINTS not just numbers. If i get 1 assist point for randome shots but against 8 enemies its not really helping.



Some ideas ... more end of round or in game awards to promote good work, good teamwork, and make the game a little more exciting

[Xyberviri]

Or maybe they should make it so you dont pay for damage done to your mech by trial mechs

[Solis Obscuri]

So you're saying a good pilot who stays alive, gets CB bonuses for a bunch of kills, damage, spotting, and assists and has to pay for armor repairs after the end of the round, has less money than the guy who gets jack **** for bonuses and has to pay to repair a bunch of slagged components, destroyed ammo and a cored engine?

Edited by Solis Obscuri, 15 November 2012 - 04:41 PM.

[Teralitha]

OpCentar, on 15 November 2012 - 04:29 PM, said:

Too complicated for my taste.

Simply buff C-Bill damage done gain coefficient from x10 to x100.

Split the profits if you had a scout relaying target data to you, or take all if you did that much damage alone on the front.


It can be further tweaked by adjusting it in regards to the players mech class.

Oh that would be interesting... split the profits evenly between your team.... and also split the repair bill. It is after all a team game right.

Solis Obscuri, on 15 November 2012 - 04:40 PM, said:

So you're saying a good pilot who stays alive, gets CB bonuses for a bunch of kills, damage, spotting, and assists and has to pay for armor repairs after the end of the round, has less money than the guy who gets jack **** for bonuses and has to pay to repair a bunch of slagged components, destroyed ammo and a cored engine?

I said exactly what I meant to say in the OP

Edited by Teralitha, 15 November 2012 - 04:47 PM.

[damonvile]

to be fair bad players will lose more, so it only seems like they get more when they're on the winning team. Life time they'll earn credits and xp far slower.

I think the ones who really benefit the most from the win/loss reward system are the 2 extremes. People who ( or may as well ) afk earn more than they would if it was more damage/performance based, and the ones who team and have very high win rates earn more than they would if it was based on what they alone actually do.

It does seem somewhat broken when you have those awesome matches with top damage and xp and you make less than the ones where you got cored right off the bat, because of the repairs where so much more on the better game.

[Aedensin]

Teralitha, on 15 November 2012 - 04:21 PM, said:

Perhaps they should start tracking those stats for data. How many times does a player take heavy damage, and survive, or how many times he takes heavy damage, but dies and team still win. The length of time they survived. how much damage they dish out compared to how much is taken when it is alot, and perhaps some other variables.

Its difficult to base helpfulness on damage done since you can do over 600 damage and never get a kill, or you can cockpit kill everyone and get a total of less than 300.

[Asmudius Heng]

Aedensin, on 15 November 2012 - 04:50 PM, said:

Its difficult to base helpfulness on damage done since you can do over 600 damage and never get a kill, or you can cockpit kill everyone and get a total of less than 300.

Except you get more kills so you get bonuses and kudos for that.

Oh a new award!

Sharpshooter/killstealer - for people that do very little damage but get a high number of kills

[NovaFury]

Perhaps more seriously, 'Headhunter': Killed the most mechs via cockpit destruction. (Minimum 1)

[Asmudius Heng]

NovaFury, on 15 November 2012 - 05:04 PM, said:

Perhaps more seriously, 'Headhunter': Killed the most mechs via cockpit destruction. (Minimum 1)

Can have both, one for headshot kills, one for being a good shot, or being a nasty kill stealing *****

Edit:

On a serious note, see BF3 for how they do this. I think its a little OVERDONE in BF3 but its nice to see some rewards at the end of a match to see how you did. Especially with things like head shots as sometimes i have no idea if they died that way.

For more teamwork related rewards it is good to instil in new players that teamwork is rewarded. If you are on comms your team can let you know how awesome a bullet sponge you were but it feels like a thankless task if you are not.

We need these carrots in the game - just as we need the 'stick' of repair bills and possible no money gain or negative gain from very poor performance.

Edited by Asmudius Heng, 15 November 2012 - 05:12 PM.

[Kaijin]

5k per minute per mech in the match for the first 10 minutes goes to the victors? You survive 8 minutes and your team wins, you get a 40k bonus.

[ArmyOfWon]

http://mwomercs.com/...y-as-it-stands/

Hmmm... I believe my model would account for those being bad. Those that take more damage and do more team progress get rewarded more than those that take the fall for the profit.

Asmudius Heng, on 15 November 2012 - 05:05 PM, said:

Can have both, one for headshot kills, one for being a good shot, or being a nasty kill stealing *****

I didn't mean to kill that Awesome with my 2 Small Lasers, I swear!

[Asmudius Heng]

ArmyOfWon, on 15 November 2012 - 05:13 PM, said:

http://mwomercs.com/...y-as-it-stands/
I didn't mean to kill that Awesome with my 2 Small Lasers, I swear!

It wuz you!!

Team game my *** i wanted that kill graaaar!!

[ArmyOfWon]

Asmudius Heng, on 15 November 2012 - 05:16 PM, said:

It wuz you!!

Team game my *** i wanted that kill graaaar!!

On a more serious note, at the time I was running a test platform for Laser heat. My first (and only shot) into a damaged Awesome in mid-battle was 2 small lasers. That's all I ever hit it with, and I just happened to get the kill. I didn't want the kill, just some assist points! >.<

[Czardread]

agree with OpCentar, increasing the reward for damage done would be the best way to solve this matter, that and a 10% decrease in cost for lost parts except CT and cockpits.

[zmeul]

I agree, proper playing is not rewarding
so I put the cover over my Atlas and I'm back playing trial mechs - and I play them like a lunatic because no matter how the match ends, I still get a lot more bills than playing properly with my Atlas

the current reward system, copied from WoT, needs to go and replaced with something else


if you compare the earnings from the trial Atlas AS-7K and a owned AS-7K it does not add up!
as a owner you have to pay repair and rearm bills that the trials do not - this is not OK

Edited by zmeul, 15 November 2012 - 05:48 PM.

[SD 47]

Honestly I think there is probably too much variance between matches for this to be easily balanced. Especially when ammo is taken into account. I have talked to a few people who have built mechs with enough ammo that they don't feel the need to reload between matches, saving them a significant amount of money. The same can be said of the largely irrelevant arms on a GaussCat.

Also I do not agree with some of the previous posters who are pointing out that the trial mechs do not suffer from these penalties. Trial mechs are designed to allow users to try a mech, and for new players to earn their first duckets. They may not suffer from the penalty of a repair bill, but the downsides (no experience, no pilot skills, no customization) are such a large penalty that they really encourage people to buy new mechs.

The only solution that comes to mind for this one would be some sort of repair curve designed to soften the blow when the bill gets to its most extreme. Maybe a cap of some kind, make it so that your repair can never cost more than 75% of what you made in the match? Neither of these are good solutions though, imo.