25 replies to this topic

[ProfessorD]

I'd particularly like to hear from people I've PUGged with at some point. You would know me by my usual greeting.
"Good evening [or morning, or night, or whatever] everyone."
"Plans or strategies for this round?"

Most typical responses all sound something like
"stay together"
"kill the enemy"
"don't die"

I get no response at all about 1/3 of the time.

I will follow up about half of the time, depending on how many of the kinds of responses above I see, with a suggestion for a firing position for missile launchers, a location for fast scouts to focus on, and a choke point for brawlers to watch. People proceed, the vast majority of the time, to run around randomly as if no communication had just happened.

So, my question is: How do we get PUGs to communicate and follow a strategy? Is it even possible?

Related suggestion: Team voice chat should built into the game. God help me when this actually happens and MWO turns into X-Box Live, but I think it would be an improvement over the essentially random behavior we currently see in a game that (mostly) does reward good team play.

[Minsc]

Pug communication is really hit or miss. I've had some *GREAT* pugs that communicated well, gave suggestions and took orders. Lead to some great games. I've had some that didn't know there was typed communication in the game.

As for in game voip, its a work in progress by C3 right now. Currently it is a 3rd party overlay. However there are plans to use it as integrated voip in the client itself.

[Mu]

1. FOLLOW DA WARBOSS
2. WHO IZ DA WARBOSS?
3. DA WARBOSS IS DA BIGGEST! FOLLOW DA WARBOSS!
4. WAAAAAGH

[Taryys]

Once C3 gets integrated for PUGs and we get a lobby things will change greatly.
Stat based matchmaking will help too.

You can also send them to guides like this: [Guide] Playing with Friends, Groups, and Teams

[Jad3d]

ProfessorD, on 13 November 2012 - 12:20 PM, said:

I'd particularly like to hear from people I've PUGged with at some point. You would know me by my usual greeting.
"Good evening [or morning, or night, or whatever] everyone."
"Plans or strategies for this round?"

I'd start by not expecting others to plan for you. I usually wait to see what people appear to be doing and throw out some statagies. The real problem is getting the pugs to actually follow them. If you can find a way to make random people follow simple instructions consitantly, you should be running for congress or something.

[Warchanter]

I do all PUG's cause I have no idea when I'll be able to play or not (father of 6 yr old/5 yr old/newborn... )

Anyhoo... yeah when no one says anything just throw out something like "headin up to the f-line and holding..." and usually you'll get a good 4 or 5 people that follow you cause they don't have a clue anyway. When you look around and all you see are trial jockeys, it's a good bet that they'll follow anyone who even mildly appears to know what they're doing. You just gotta put something out there.

side note: Most hilarious opening strategy message and I wish I could remember who it was from:

"OK let's all run around in different directions..."

[Lyteros]

In my experience most games go way better if someone takes comannd and issues at least basic orders. The easier to understand and do, the more seem to be willing to follow. Any decision, even if not perfect or even good, is better most of the time then chaos and no order at all. The moment shooting starts and multiple heavys / assaults start to run after scouts and decoys the "command" part is generally over.

When everyone follows it's going surprisingly well most of the time, if 2 or more just split off and run another direction most games are already over tough...

[Wispsy]

I generally go with:

Attack
Kill
Do not die

And you know most of the time they do it and it works out well. They push up, find the enemy, start engaging without too many exposing themselves unnecessarily and push when they see an advantage! Most of the time it ends in a win and I put it completely down to my pug handling!

Edit: Often people throw in stick together as well, which is good advice in a number of different situations, including inexperienced players.

Edited by Wispsy, 13 November 2012 - 01:00 PM.

[The Amazing Atomic Spaniel]

I type "stay together guys" at the beginning of every game because the single most common reason teams lose is when they split up and get taken down one at a time as they walk into a fire zone. I've even seen Founder-tagged players do it and they really should know better .

Trying to coordinate anything by typing once the shooting starts is very difficult. Typing is slow and everyone has their attention elsewhere. Things should get better if PGI introduce built-in voice comms. For myself, I have cracked and finally bought a microphone and installed TS3.

[General Kaos]

ProfessorD, on 13 November 2012 - 12:20 PM, said:

I'd particularly like to hear from people I've PUGged with at some point. You would know me by my usual greeting.
"Good evening [or morning, or night, or whatever] everyone."
"Plans or strategies for this round?"

Most typical responses all sound something like
"stay together"
"kill the enemy"
"don't die"

I get no response at all about 1/3 of the time.

I will follow up about half of the time, depending on how many of the kinds of responses above I see, with a suggestion for a firing position for missile launchers, a location for fast scouts to focus on, and a choke point for brawlers to watch. People proceed, the vast majority of the time, to run around randomly as if no communication had just happened.

So, my question is: How do we get PUGs to communicate and follow a strategy? Is it even possible?

Related suggestion: Team voice chat should built into the game. God help me when this actually happens and MWO turns into X-Box Live, but I think it would be an improvement over the essentially random behavior we currently see in a game that (mostly) does reward good team play.

I agree that Team voice chat should be built in (hey, it works well in DDO). If however voice chat is integrated, it really will need a squelch setting so that the user can filter out foul mouthed tweens, and other bad ilk. As far as strategies are concerned, I believe that some people are yearning for a strategy and mission completion, and others are just trying different things out.

That being said, I think that randoms (PUG's), generally want to do their own thing. Sure, some like to follow strategies and such, but some want to just run around randomly and shoot wildly (hopefully a fully functioning matchmaker system will be able to seperate these two types of groups).

[General Kaos]

Wispsy, on 13 November 2012 - 12:54 PM, said:

I generally go with:

Attack
Kill
Do not die

And you know most of the time they do it and it works out well. They push up, find the enemy, start engaging without too many exposing themselves unnecessarily and push when they see an advantage! Most of the time it ends in a win and I put it completely down to my pug handling!

Edit: Often people throw in stick together as well, which is good advice in a number of different situations, including inexperienced players.

Gonna have to call a foul on that one! I have indeed met you on the battlefield and not only did your team lose to my PUG, but I personally hunted you down to kill you for your opening arogant statement of "your lives....I claim them".

[Wispsy]

General Kaos, on 13 November 2012 - 01:08 PM, said:

Gonna have to call a foul on that one! I have indeed met you on the battlefield and not only did your team lose to my PUG, but I personally hunted you down to kill you for your opening arogant statement of "your lives....I claim them".

I did say most of the time!

I do not deny dying, it happens for an unfortunately large number of reasons! :/

Edit: I am happy that you treasure the memory

Edited by Wispsy, 13 November 2012 - 01:20 PM.

[Tarman]

I've had great games where we had lots of effective comms; we once pulled a win out of a 6-8 start on Caustic (thanks matcher!) where we also took the first casualties. Target priority and sector regrouping kept us alive and deadly enough to take down the other team. "E4 crippled Hunchie on your six"

People knowing their game is a big help, and after the initial re-newbification of the playerbase, there are starting to be more pilots who know at least not to park in the caldera with a laserboat and alpha all day.

There are also the games where you know you're going to die, and all you can do is mitigate as best you can. It's the pug life. Personally the times when it gels are worth suffering through the matches where you're doomed by the end of the starting countdown. At the very least I like to think that if I pilot with sense in a pug then some of that could rub off on them.

General Kaos, on 13 November 2012 - 01:08 PM, said:

Gonna have to call a foul on that one! I have indeed met you on the battlefield and not only did your team lose to my PUG, but I personally hunted you down to kill you for your opening arogant statement of "your lives....I claim them".

I have seen Wispsy die once in all the matches I've seen him in, and it was mass LRM rain taking him down in the open. Generally he makes good on the life-claiming. Don't take the line arrogantly, he's a good dude. When we open a Mechwarrior school I am promoting him to Dean of Jenners.

[Goose Igaly]

Typically my Lance drops in and I'll come over team chatter with "[TC] heading <insert destination>". Problem is, it seems that this is taken as a command to follow. Will have to start modifying the plan in team chatter as our Lance is pretty organized most of the time and communicate focus fire over Skype. Problem comes in when everyone else on the team decides that, even though they're the ones following us, when we stop to deploy our line of fire we suddenly don't know what we're doing and push out past us.

Would be curious if anyone out there has seen the [TC] tag thrown out at match opening (For those wondering, it's Team Cortez). I know I've seen the <S> before.

[WarRats]

My original Pugging stategy
-I tried typing "stick together" or "Use the buddy stystem" as the basic strategy but of course that causes everybody to scatter faster.
-I have tried to take command but I have failed misserbly at figuring how to place things on the map.


So my new Pugging strategy is now about me adopting to whataver I can to help us win.

-If somebody has a plan I usually try to assist them with it.

-If we all go in one direction in organised fashion. I usually try to scout the other side to make sure we dont get caped from the other way. I announce what I am doing and will return to group or defend as needed.

-If everyone scatters. I form up with any friendly atlases or hunchbacks that seem to be looking to brawl. I hang close and focus fire on their targets.

-If the team runs out into the open and is getting hammered by fire support. I rush their fire support and try and take pressure off the rest of my team thats getting pounded

- If we have a couple firesupport mechs trailing behind, I sometimes stick around to keep light mechs off of them.

-If we dont have any firesupport then I sit back and provide some sniping.


Definitly not the best system but it has worked with moderate success for me.

Edited by WarRats, 13 November 2012 - 02:22 PM.

[kragmoor]

I usually try to get a basic plan together, find out which way we are going to go, who's going to cover tunnel. stuff like that

[Relic1701]

1: I say 'support each other and focus fire'
2: Watch in dismay as everyone scatters like cockroaches.

This happens with about 75% of the PuG matches I have, the other 25% are some of the best games I've had. My thanks go out to those 25%

[Smoke Dancer]

RocketDog, on 13 November 2012 - 12:59 PM, said:

I type "stay together guys" at the beginning of every game because the single most common reason teams lose is when they split up and get taken down one at a time as they walk into a fire zone. I've even seen Founder-tagged players do it and they really should know better . Trying to coordinate anything by typing once the shooting starts is very difficult. Typing is slow and everyone has their attention elsewhere. Things should get better if PGI introduce built-in voice comms. For myself, I have cracked and finally bought a microphone and installed TS3.

Any communication is better than none. It also helps if people are clear what weapons they have especially given the current propensity towards LRM Atlas boats. Staying together is also something that is important because you need team mates to give you that all important 360 radar coverage.

[Mr 144]

If all you say is "plan?" and recieve no answer other than the typical auto-snark...that means in order to change that, YOU have to lead. Personally, I hate leading...so I don't gripe about silence. Actually, some of the best Pug matches are done in complete silence.

If you need a plan, take command, and put one out there using the markers, txt, and what-not. Timid suggestions WILL NOT WORK! Take total control, be firm, not snarky. PUGS sense weak leaders and ignore them...don't show weakness. If no one listens, gripe about that...but to gripe about other's not having a plan, when you yourself don't have anything other than a few 'suggestions'...well...you should get my point.

Remember, Pugs are not generally social creatures...this is not the time for chat amongst the team for a comprehesive strategy. K.I.S.S....simple, firm, decisive. Pugs are also more inclined to follow movement/attack orders. Pugs are generaly not a patient sort, so any time based strategies longer than a few minutes usually result in a few getting antsy and zerging off to die.

Good Luck!

Mr 144

[JerryAgent]

Mu, on 13 November 2012 - 12:34 PM, said:

1. FOLLOW DA WARBOSS
2. WHO IZ DA WARBOSS?
3. DA WARBOSS IS DA BIGGEST! FOLLOW DA WARBOSS!
4. WAAAAAGH

This.

Wispsy, on 13 November 2012 - 01:10 PM, said:

I did say most of the time!

I do not deny dying, it happens for an unfortunately large number of reasons! :/

Edit: I am happy that you treasure the memory

I remember one frantic battle on Frozen Valley where we dueled and I managed to core you only seconds before your Jenner buddy cored me. Tip of my hat to you for the epic battle.

All it really takes to get a PUG to work together is to engage them in conversation. Whenever I take my atlas for instance, I sing a little song in all chat to raise spirits. It goes like:

I'm a little Fatlas,
Short and stout
These are my lasers
This is my Gauss

When I see your Jenners
Hear me shout!
Knock him down and core him out!

Overall I have had a great experience soloing in PUGs, because if you take command and issue orders and be proactive, people listen 80% of the time.