2926 replies to this topic

[Furiam]

Paran01ac, on 28 December 2012 - 11:50 PM, said:

I hate 3rd person view just like any one else of you. Game is already in a bad state. No reason to make it worse.

I wouldn't say the game is in a bad state, considering it's technically not even been released yet. It needs a lot of tweaking, sure, but that's why it's still in the "beta" stage. Though I do agree adding 3rd person view would certainly make the game a lot less interesting. I know someone mentioned adding a rear-view camera which I believe would be a good addition, imho. I mean, cars have them, apaches have them, why can't a mech?

[Eddrick]

I like the way the other MechWarrior games did it. No HUD in 3rd person view. It's nice to be able to look around at your Mech in the view. But, it shouldn't help by doing so.

In the other MechWarrior games. With no HUD. It was hard if/not impossible to aim. Giving no reason to use a 3rd person camera angle. Besides, just looking at your own Mech. It would put you at a disadvantage if you tryed it in combat.

[lEAKYcUBe]

Like Darkfox said, it should be used for "viewing purposes only". You cant use the mode to engage in combat.

The view should take you outside the cockpit and you should be able to pan camera angle little to see your mech in all its glory.

They can also design the view that when entering 3rd person view all keys are disable except for the arrows to pan and ESC to exit the view.

As simple as that, I think most people will be satisfied with the view should it work this way.

Leaky out,

[LynxFury]

It was already said that if done, it would run on separate set of servers so those of us who prefer the first person wouldn't have to worry about the rest of the mecha fans who like to see where they are going :-)

The poll was near meaningless because it was one in a very rarefied community that aren't of sufficient numbers to see this game to lift off. It's like going into an Irish pub and asking what they think about a different vintage of wine.

And there's probably a bit of downright denial that MWx has always been more popular in 3rd person, as well as just about every FPS shooter has vehicle 3rd person view available--that's where the masses are.

Edited by LynxFury, 30 December 2012 - 12:20 AM.

[Lucian Arkright]

If it's got 3rd person mode... Then it's not a F(irst) P(erson) S(hooter).

Sorry, just because something is popular, doesn't mean it's right. Just look at the Jerry Springer Show, or the Jeremy Kyle Show...

[shotokan5]

Promethey, on 26 December 2012 - 08:40 AM, said:

3PV--if made "optional"--will split the community, reducing the potential overall available matches from Community Warfare, small PUG's and other aspects of matching currently being played. This, of course, if personal player and match options DIS-allow 3PV matches during game setup (much like one may currently choose ASSAULT or CONQUEST prior to launch).

If one chooses to opt for ANY, in this mode, then the 1PV players will clearly be at a disadvantage due to the years of frustration this community saw from the previous iteration with mixed PV matching. Face it, entire leagues were set up around the premise of one view or the other (or in some cases, OPEN).

My opinion is you're not losing monetary potential from the small margin of players who WON'T play they game because they "CAN'T SEE THE REALLY COOL PAINTJOB ON MUH MECH HURRR!"

We heard that specious argument from the 3PV'ers for years, but all of us knew the root of their argument was centered in visibility to give them the CLEAR and DISTINCT advantage over their opponents who refused to leave the cockpit. What's NOT to like about being able to spot and line-up your enemy over an onstruction? Frankly, i don't know how the developers CAN deliver a 3PV system that isn't behind and slightly above the mech. Sgt. Magor was one of best ever in MW4. Let me say that not remembering your name must have the reason not for showing proper respect. I also remember why you spell your name the way you do.

In conclusion, i will simply reitterate how the inclusion of an 'Optional' view will fracture the community, limit available matches, and promote discourse and fractious arguments in and out of the battlespace all in the off-chance of retaining a handful of non-premium players who will likely loose interest in mucking around in the mechlab and resort back to their Xbox Game of the Month in their underground lair of mom's basement.

That last section is very interesting. I wonder Who owns Xbox Microsoft. Being as smart as they are LOL is it possible that was part of the reason the rights were sold in the first place? With the limited processing power of a game console then it would be better to use 3rd person view. Strangly they tried MW4 on the xbox and it bombed. Newer first person shooters were the death of MW4. They had no 3rd person view option. Microsoft just never seems to learn from its mistakes. windows 8 is simply what they wanted for 7 but could get figured out in time. Money and time is why they released windows7. now they want you to pay for what you should have had years ago. Remember what Mr. Butts? said," it is something we are looking at for the future". I have for the fourth time ask him to come on a podcast with me and give a reasonable explanation for 3rd person and other concepts, such as better cockpit view. I was even told that nowhere in the original web site where we founders 60,000? Spent' and state that on where in the information does it say first person view only. Is that true? I must have totally misread the web site. Come on can anyone who read it say I am wrong? If so please post you will not be flamed by me. But if I am right and not more than one of this can not post then, even what they are saying now is fraud even in Canada. Not one person has the right to post want to change to 3rd person view as an option or all the original moneys paid the first group of founders should be returned or a class action would not be beyond . Question. You can not sell someone saying its a goose but it is just a very large duck. Please put up or please be quiet on this 3rd person thing. We have beaten this thing to death. If you have even one of my many posts on this matter then you know where I stand.

Edited by shotokan5, 30 December 2012 - 08:15 AM.

[Gremlich Johns]

Eddrick, on 29 December 2012 - 04:35 PM, said:

In the other MechWarrior games. With no HUD. It was hard if/not impossible to aim.

Not true, ever hear of Burst on Target (BoT)? If a tanks sights are jacked up (out of sync)Tankers (and grunts) get trained to fire a round, watch where it hits on the sight picture (the view inside your sights with the reticle if you are a tanker), then move the impact to the target, fire again. You should hit the target.

look for BOT here

[LynxFury]

shotokan5, on 30 December 2012 - 07:25 AM, said:

That last section is very interesting. I wonder Who owns Xbox Microsoft. Being as smart as they are LOL is it possible that was part of the reason the rights were sold in the first place? With the limited processing power of a game console then it would be better to use 3rd person view. Strangly they tried MW4 on the xbox and it bombed.

They didn't try MW4 on Xbox, they released Mech Assault, which as it turns out was 3rd person and more successful THAN ALL other PC-Mech warrior games combined. It was followed by a less successful sequel that didn't sell very well.

Most modern FPS have 3d person available for the vehicles, which is why it's going to be an expectation for a great many prospective players that try MWO.

Edited by LynxFury, 30 December 2012 - 09:41 AM.

[Gremlich Johns]

LynxFury, on 30 December 2012 - 09:39 AM, said:

Most modern FPS have 3d person available for the vehicles, which is why it's going to be an expectation for a great many prospective players that try MWO.

And those players tend to be transitory. They play the game for about three months then move on to the next new thing.

[Eddrick]

A compremize may be what Chrome Hounds for the X-Box 360 did. It had both 1st and 3rd person cameras at the same time in a picture-in-picture. Freely, being able to swich between the two. However, in 3rd person, you can't aim very carfully. But, in 1st person, you get all the tools needed to aim carfully. http://youtu.be/Y-eopTRT2FA

No matter what. I want 1st person to be the emphesis in the game. If 3rd person is as usfull as 1st person. Then why would you ever use 1st person? To many other Mech games use 3rd person as the primary view (Like Armored Core). MechWarrior is one of the few games that has used 1st person as the primary view. I see no reason for it to change.

Edited by Eddrick, 30 December 2012 - 11:08 AM.

[shotokan5]

Sorry, I cant always remember back so long. O they gave the same game in a different name. I guess some people with Microsoft got their sales figures wrong. Game Spot, said the same thing it was a bomb. But unlike most I am old and forgetful. I guess every old Xbox remembers the game with such love. The sales figures counting the original for the xbox were ok but they followed up with an addition more money. It did bomb and that is a fact. I have to go to bed now I am old and my clock says 6:11 yawn... Forgive this old man maybe I was in another alternate universes at the time. Got to run the nurse is coming for me.

[LynxFury]

shotokan5, on 30 December 2012 - 03:14 PM, said:

Sorry, I cant always remember back so long. O they gave the same game in a different name. I guess some people with Microsoft got their sales figures wrong. Game Spot, said the same thing it was a bomb. But unlike most I am old and forgetful. I guess every old Xbox remembers the game with such love. The sales figures counting the original for the xbox were ok but they followed up with an addition more money. It did bomb and that is a fact. I have to go to bed now I am old and my clock says 6:11 yawn... Forgive this old man maybe I was in another alternate universes at the time. Got to run the nurse is coming for me.

It's ok to have a bad memory. But lets not pretend either.
MA sold over a million copies.
http://www.vgchartz....91/mechassault/
Gamespot gave it a 9.0 one of their higher rated games.
http://www.gamespot....review-2897126/
MA had quite a few mechs not in MW4...is wasn't a clone.
MA had 3rd person.
I never played it, I didnt' have an Xbox, but several of my battletech loving friends played it.

[shotokan5]

Where is it now. Gone with the windbags. Well if that is true then get an old Xbox and play it no one is stopping you. But one number is new most want the game to be first person. This is supposed to be a true first person experience. At least on PC. We can agree on one thing that the first person view needs to be better. Right now its as good as a 1944 VW no rear window. Like looking out of a fox hole with a M85 firing at you. So let us agree to disagree because MS loves money and if what you say is true then one of the first new games on the Xbox 360 would have been a version of those fantastic games. Never saw nada. They still had the rights to it at the time. So lets agree to disagree.

[Jakob Knight]

That the devs state that they are even considering 3rd Person seriously when they have previously stated there would be no such in the game is what hurts the most. Yes, 3rd Person would break the game if implemented in any way in the combat environment (that has been proven in past MW games, and nothing said has indicated MWO is different from those prior games in any way that would change that), but the statement that the company is exploring an option they flatly denied would -be- an option in their product has already broken any trust I had in them.

How, after all, can you trust someone who says one thing, then the exact opposite?

And the entire implementation of ECM has further proved how much the devs see this game as their own private thrillride, and not worthy of serious consideration. That hits at the confidence in the devs competency in game design.

So we end up with a dev team that is untrustworthy and incompetent in their trade. I think that trumps any considerations as to how bad 3rd Person would be in the game.

[Gremlich Johns]

Mechassault did well because console players that loved the game did not have the mental acuity to play a game that excelled at 1st person view, required them to work a mech without an aimbot, utilize torso twist without a thought, etc. And, how many people that bought MA despised it? It couldn't even portray quads properly, they cannot move as fast as spiders. Snow crabs maybe, but not spiders.

[SiriusBeef]

Can we get No Heat and Unlimited Ammo modes as well?

[Promethey]

shotokan5, on 30 December 2012 - 07:25 AM, said:

That last section is very interesting. I wonder Who owns Xbox Microsoft. Being as smart as they are LOL is it possible that was part of the reason the rights were sold in the first place? With the limited processing power of a game console then it would be better to use 3rd person view. Strangly they tried MW4 on the xbox and it bombed. Newer first person shooters were the death of MW4. They had no 3rd person view option. Microsoft just never seems to learn from its mistakes. windows 8 is simply what they wanted for 7 but could get figured out in time. Money and time is why they released windows7. now they want you to pay for what you should have had years ago. Remember what Mr. Butts? said," it is something we are looking at for the future". I have for the fourth time ask him to come on a podcast with me and give a reasonable explanation for 3rd person and other concepts, such as better cockpit view. I was even told that nowhere in the original web site where we founders 60,000? Spent' and state that on where in the information does it say first person view only. Is that true? I must have totally misread the web site. Come on can anyone who read it say I am wrong? If so please post you will not be flamed by me. But if I am right and not more than one of this can not post then, even what they are saying now is fraud even in Canada. Not one person has the right to post want to change to 3rd person view as an option or all the original moneys paid the first group of founders should be returned or a class action would not be beyond . Question. You can not sell someone saying its a goose but it is just a very large duck. Please put up or please be quiet on this 3rd person thing. We have beaten this thing to death. If you have even one of my many posts on this matter then you know where I stand.

Wow, this reply has so much: Microsoft, Win7 to Win8, Mr. Butts, Geese and Ducks. Oh yeah, and MA.

Not sure what all it had to do with MY post, but whatever. Again, I believe the developers are trying to field a product that's enjoyable to the majority of the community and has enough appeal to encourage new players to enter the MW universe. All of that, steeped in the understanding that a profit is also just as much sought after. My argument, and the argument of many here, is that (someone put it best) the players who would "prefer" 3PV are transitory.

The ones who AREN'T transitory, want it for advantage sake (ie, "Get a better perspective on the battlefield").

I stand by my argument--rambling random replies notwithstanding--that 3PV would absolutely fracture the community. It will reduce the availability of matches, if made an optional Match Mode, and likely run-off more paying customers who tend to enjoy playing the game in the style i believe it was intended: In Simulator mode.

Some good alternatives were suggested--no mech steering controls or HUD to appease the "HURRR LUK AT MUH MECH!!11" crowd (which i find most to be disingenuous and that's not the real reason they prefer 3PV at all). As one of my teammates told me the other nite:

"You want to look at your mech from outside the cockpit? Stick around a while and i'll gladly oblige as it goes critical"

lol

[Zerstorer Stallin]

I cant even believe 3rd person is being talked about. What happened to "there wont be any 3rd person view?" I've not met one person who's true intent for 3rd person isnt to avoid the problems from 1st person gives(rocking, blocked view from explosions those pesky lights running circles around you, ect). Its always someones way of seeking an advantage. Keep the game as it is, spend the time and resources working on a mega campaign and fixing problems like ECM. I think a move to a usable 3rd person would drive alot of players away from MWO. Of, course this is just my 2 cents.

[Suicidal Idiot]

Perhaps we could get a big building with mirrored glass to be able to admire our mechs as we walk by. Hopefully the glass would be unmarkable and unbreakable.

[HGAK47]

Im new to this game. It is not hard to get used to. The draw for me to this game was the fact it has elements of strategy and the fact it was still a first person game.

How can people find it hard to learn after a few games?

Ok sure their first game might seem a bit daunting but like others have said, a quick but proper tutorial first time around would go towards helping.