35 replies to this topic

[Atheus]

I ran my SRM6x6 this morning for a bit - something I haven't done since closed beta. It's definitely not a mech anyone can win against in a 1v1 face-off if they're not ducking and weaving, and even then they're probably going to lose. The one thing I will say is that I had a few 1v1's where the opponent managed to blow off one of my arms - well he would still die, but the rest of the match was just depressing only firing 3 of the 6 SRM 6's. Still, if someone was focused on taking off one ear before the SRM Cat closed to under 150m, he would have a chance.

The main weak point of a 6x6 is usually ammo. Mine had 6 tons of SRM ammo, which is enough for 16.7 salvos. After that, I may as well afk the rest of the match if jumping on their base isn't possible. Regardless, that 16.7 salvos usually results in between 600 and 900 damage, or more if I faced off against some particularly cooperative targets. It usually takes 3-4 salvos to destroy a mech from 100%, though I managed to do it in 1 and 2 a few times (SRM Head Shot).

All in all, I have mixed feelings about the 6x6. On one hand, you run around with this rather arrogant feeling that people will regret facing off against you at close range, and for the most part that's what happens. On the other, the build is pretty boring in the sense that while you may blow a few guys up in hilariously short order, there are plenty of matches where you get an ear blown off early on and can barely deal enough damage to matter, or you run out of ammo, or you get cored trying to move in to that <150m attack range (preferably ~90m) while your team hangs back at the safer 300m range. The 6x6 is a nasty mech to meet head on, but in a battle of attrition the 6x6 will eventually wind up being the guy who has nothing to contribute.

[Bagheera]

RragnarR40k, on 18 November 2012 - 03:56 AM, said:

Anyone that fails to see the SRM6 as lame, is either a trickerhappy srm6pult pilot or out of their mind. Ok I stand corrected on the damage if the spread you posted is upto date, but still 6x15 damage?? It's like letting a mech equip 6 Autocannon LB/X 15 and then saying it's not op... Besides I think the LB/X has more spread than srm on short range. The whole thing about SRM spreading and not being as effective is kinda hmm, so so.. With a nice XL engine and elite skill for speed upgrade (+7,5% boost) your pult will go 75 kp/h and it turns fast and very far so this mech is really not that hard to use... Try going up against a team that has 4 of these in their ranks and you'll be crying nerf in a second...

All Cats are capable of going fast and rediculously easy to drive with their very wide torso twist arc. That's nothing unique. Normally I would make a comment about engine restrictions here, and how because of broken netcode and tears from jenner pilots ("Why are commandos and hunchbacks so fast?") we now have Cats that are faster than all mediums except the Cicada and 1 Centurion variant.

But lets set that aside for a moment, because I just cannot call any mech with a maximum range of 270m and massive heat management issues "OP." Does it suck to come around the corner and find one in your face? Sure. But that's true about ANY high-alpha-value mech. Streak Cats? SRM Shotgun cats? So very easy to take down at range.

fxrsniper, on 18 November 2012 - 08:43 AM, said:

srm 6 is 15 damage streaks are 10 because it shoots 2 rockets at a time that's 2/3 the fire power not one and they lock.

All SRM (streak or otherwise) damage is 2.5 points per missle that hits. There is no such thing as an SSRM2 that does 10 damage. Please refrain from using numerical values unless you are using the correct numerical values. It gets old correcting the misinformation on this forum.

Edited by Bagheera, 18 November 2012 - 08:52 AM.

[Dimento Graven]

fxrsniper, on 18 November 2012 - 08:43 AM, said:

srm 6 is 15 damage streaks are 10 because it shoots 2 rockets at a time that's 2/3 the fire power not one and they lock.

Streaks are actually potential 5 damage, or 2.5 per missle, just like SRM6s get 2.5 per missle. The damage on any SRM or SSRM is 2.5 damage per missle that hits, for a maximum potential of 2.5x2 (or x4, or x6), and then you multiply again for how many launchers you have, so (15, 10, 5, or 5)x2 or x3, or x4, or x5, or x6 of that particular rack system.

So the maximum missle carrier that I am aware of is the Cat A1 at 6 missle hard points, so the maximum potential SRM damage ranges from 10 to 90 points based on the 'mech loadout.

Edited by Dimento Graven, 18 November 2012 - 09:54 AM.

[Karenai]

Are SRM catas cheapshots and lame? Yes.
Are SRM catas cheap? No.
Are SRM catas op? No. Unless you run vs. blind pugs who do NOT focus fire it down first.

SRM/SSRM catas>Gauss/PPC catas>stationary scouts>mediums>heavys>assaults>scouts

That is the list I go with for chosing my targets.

And I love those big ugly cata cockpits.

[Scarlett Avignon]

SRM's have a range of 270 meters.

I'll leave the rest for you to figure out.

[Corvus Antaka]

If this is the case a good solution might be to increase the SRM 6 heat output. this is probably a problem due to Artemis tightening the spread.

I think this comes more the a boating problem, where boats have little to no penalties for alpha striking, giving them exceptional performance to key locations very quickly in 1 shot.

a better solution might be to look back to a solution like increasing heat output when firing more than 2-3 weapons of 1 type at the same time.

[Dimento Graven]

Colonel Pada Vinson, on 18 November 2012 - 10:57 AM, said:

If this is the case a good solution might be to increase the SRM 6 heat output. this is probably a problem due to Artemis tightening the spread. I think this comes more the a boating problem, where boats have little to no penalties for alpha striking, giving them exceptional performance to key locations very quickly in 1 shot. a better solution might be to look back to a solution like increasing heat output when firing more than 2-3 weapons of 1 type at the same time.

Actually you should try and boat SRM6s some time, you'd be suprised.

Take a look here: http://www.dotamento...MWO-weapons.pdf

You'll see that SRM6's are already at the top of the heat spectrum.

I put 3 SRM6's in an Atlas D-DC just to check out the whining, and I can tell you, even with minimal ammo and maxed enchanced heat sincs, you're not going to be getting away with too many alpha strikes.

Plus, even with Artemis (yes, I tested 3 SRM6s with Artemis) the spread beyond, say 10 meters, is pretty darn extreme. Whenever I aimed 'dead center' at an immobile mech beyond 90 meters, I was pretty much garunteed to hit EVERY visible hit box of that 'mech. Unfortunately, the spread also caused a significant number of missles to miss the immobile 'mech as well, and I imagine had this particular target not been shut down due to heat issues, I would have seen his AMS take out even more missles before reaching him.

I don't think heat needs to be touched in SRM6s, nor do I think there needs to be a nerf.

Expense alone will convince most boaters to not use artemis. Even with Founder's bonuses, if I've fired even half my ammo, I'm looking at repair/reload bills of approaching 200k. If I take significant damage, the repair bill can easily go beyond 200k. That's with a 'mech running a standard engine, and standard armor, so repair costs from XL's, or FF armor, don't apply.

It's hugely expensive, and even a win doesn't garuntee profit. For players without the Founder's bonus... Well, I'm not certain if they're even breaking even...

Even if we digress a bit and discuss streaks, streaks aren't affected by Artemis, and their spread is as significant as regular SRMs. When I run my Cat A1, LRM15'sX2, and SSRMsX4, I fire 8 streaks at a time, more often than not at least 4 missles miss, and only rarely will I all missles hitting the same location.

I think SRMs in all forms are nearly balanced, and may need a bit less spread... But for now I'm not seeing streak cats regularly get 4 or more kills per match, the same with SRM boats.

Anyone having significant issue with SRM boats may need to install AMS. Since the LRM nerf, I've seen a lot of 'mechs drop AMS in favor of other things. Mostly it's only the heavies and assaults carrying AMS any more, and heck, 50% of the time I've seen a Atlas K, he doesn't have ANY AMS loaded, and for a 'mech with TWO AMS hard points, well, that's just odd...

[Corvus Antaka]

I dont think they are OP right now...just trying to note my preference for more heat vs a damage nurf on them or spread nurf again....if indeed the short range dmg output of srm6's could be of concern

[Dimento Graven]

Colonel Pada Vinson, on 18 November 2012 - 12:58 PM, said:

I dont think they are OP right now...just trying to note my preference for more heat vs a damage nurf on them or spread nurf again....if indeed the short range dmg output of srm6's could be of concern

I don't think they're OP either, and need no changes at the moment.

I dislike the expense artemis adds to reloads, but, that's not a bug, balance issue, or anything. I just hate having to spend so much cash at the end of each match.

[PL Harpoon]

it's strange that every succesful CAT build is considered OP. In fact every specialized build is called OP here just because it can deal lot of dmg in certain conditions.
I've been playing this game since early september and only ONCE I've seen situation when something was really OP - LRM's at the introduction of Artemis.
If enemy can easily kill you - change your tactics.
If other players have better mechs than you - change your config. I'm quite sure right now every mech (except for maybe Raven ) has his role on the battlefield.
And please, don't try to adjust the reality (be it only virtual) to yourself - instead adjust yourself to the situation.

[Mechwarrior5138008]

Kell838, on 18 November 2012 - 06:39 AM, said:

SRM 6 Cats would be perfectly fine, if we had only a long range weapon to counter them... like LRM's! But since that is nerfed into the ground, i can see why people complain. Beta is Beta, and Devs never gonna learn.

SRM6 Cats are the new FOM? lol...so easy to kill. just dont stand stationary 50m in front of one and you'll be just fine.

LRMs are also just fine. They are no longer the point/click/win for noobs they were a couple weeks ago.

[PL Harpoon]

Looks like CATs are the most hated mechs by noobs and whiners.


... which is fine by me

[PeRRaKo]

michaelius, on 18 November 2012 - 06:44 AM, said:

Just wondering but when do IS get SSRM4 and SSRM6 by BT timeline ?

3058 for both the SSRM4 and SSRM6:

http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Streak_SRM-4

http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Streak_SRM-6

So we should not be seeing any of those goodies any time soon.

[Thorn Hallis]

PeRRaKo, on 19 November 2012 - 02:26 AM, said:

3058 for both the SSRM4 and SSRM6:

http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Streak_SRM-4

http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Streak_SRM-6

So we should not be seeing any of those goodies any time soon.

Thats for the IS variants. The Clan-ones we'll probably see next year.

[PeRRaKo]

Thorn Hallis, on 19 November 2012 - 02:41 AM, said:

Thats for the IS variants. The Clan-ones we'll probably see next year.

Yes, the IS variants, the ones he asked for

Although I wonder if we will have the possibility to integrate clan tech on IS chasis...
Anyway, at this time we can only especulate on how the Clans will be implemented in the game and the CW.

Edited by PeRRaKo, 19 November 2012 - 03:19 AM.

[Tarskin]

The life of a mech jock that likes to drive canon variants only