299 replies to this topic

[The Herrick]

BalzaSteel, on 18 November 2012 - 09:51 AM, said:

if it bothers ya the answer is very simple, just buy the mechs you want to play and only do the basic upgrades, nobody is forcing you to buy/play mechs you don't want to, thats your decision, but if you do decide to buy more mechs and play them till they're elite you may just find that you like them. BalzOut

Just enjoy losing an edge because your basic efficiencies are no longer doubled and you have no elites. Just because PGI aren't pointing a gun at player's heads and making them grind doesn't mean the system is any less stupid.

[I7aggoHok]

Budor, on 18 November 2012 - 09:54 AM, said:

Solution: If you want to max with 1 variant you need 3x the xp. I guess its implemented the way it is to "force" people into buying mechbays... I voted NO because i kind of enjoy to grind stuff.

yeap. I dont need 454541 variants of raven/atlas or something. Why i need to buy mechbays slots?

[Enig]

Enig, on 18 November 2012 - 09:41 AM, said:

I want to drive my 4x now until the end of oblivion. But even if I put in thousands of hours into my 4x I will never be a master? How does that make sense?

That most certainly isn't the point

[MadPanda]

If you asked this a week ago, I would have voted 'yes'. I didn't like it at first that I had to buy 2 other atlas models. I thought my first baby, Atlas-K, was all I needed. But I've experimented on builds on the D and DC atlas models after having been "forced" to buy them and the D model is now my new favorite and the DC model second favorite. I now have 3 different atlas models that suit my every need. One long range lrm boat style (DC), close range brawler (D) and overall achiever (K).

So after all I'm glad that I was forced to buy the other models because I was getting little bored playing the K model all the time thinking "this is it, I'm at the top, I can't change or improve". With the new atlas models I'm having a lot of fun again. Many may not like the feature of getting 3 models, but the devs were onto something with that. You sometimes get stubborn and think the model you have is best, but if you just try the others out you may find a new favorite.

[The Herrick]

I7aggoHok, on 18 November 2012 - 09:57 AM, said:

yeap. I dont need 454541 variants of raven/atlas or something. Why i need to buy mechbays slots?

Well the assumption was that we would have more than 4 mechs actually worth using. PGI have however been rather poor on delivering that.

Enig, on 18 November 2012 - 09:58 AM, said:

That most certainly isn't the point

How is it not the point?

Edited by The Herrick, 18 November 2012 - 10:01 AM.

[HarryMannbach]

The Herrick, on 18 November 2012 - 09:48 AM, said:

Thankfully no. However you get barely any money from selling your mechs because PGI loves to try and brute force players into spending money.

So much negativity... PGI has done a pretty damn fine job of reviving an awesome series, and has made the core game experience FREE. Why does it come as a shock to people that there need to be ways for them to make money and keep supporting the product? The costs of developing a modern game and running the infrastructure to support it are not insubstantial. I don't think they are doing anything inhuman by trying to have methods of bringing in continued income.

[Enig]

The Herrick, on 18 November 2012 - 10:00 AM, said:

How is it not the point?

Read my original post.

I.


Can not master a mech.


By piloting that mech into infinite.

[8CH Trooper]

F2P is really only free to the casual player, those of us who want to play will pay for the things we really want. I would rather they just bill me 10 dollars a month and get rid of all of the things they try to force you to spend real money on. This will have the added benefit of weeding out some of the Aholes that will undoubtedly show up after MWO is launched for real.

Edited by 8CH Trooper, 18 November 2012 - 01:54 PM.

[Chrithu]

I voted yes.

Though I do not really mind I think doing things that way is the most mindles way to do it that is possible.

It is pretty obvious that the whole purpose of the mechanic is not to make the game more fun but to get players to invest CBills or even MC in order to upgrade a single variant.

Stuff like that is one of the many bad symptoms of the cash grab that MMOs have become since WoW and the invention of the F2P business model have hit us.

It's all about keeping people playing. If they actually have fun doing it is only a second or third priority, which is why so many MMOs are "grind before you have fun" by design. I know there are people who like this and sadly far too many people like it so that rubbish is here to stay for some years.

What I don't get about it all is why most designers/publishers nowadays don't get their mind around to the fact that if your game is fun in ALL aspects (you could also say if your game is complete from a certain point of view) it will be played for a long time, maybe even longer than if you implement "artificial" hurdles to force people to spend more time/money on the game.

I'm not saying give out everything for free though. But any effort that has to be put into the game has to make sense and provide for fun in a way. Being forced to spend CBills and Time on a Variant I probably do not want to keep playing is plain and simple no fun at all but much more a hassle that may even drive more people away than it encourages to pay money or spend more time.

Having to spend time getting resources and crafting an Items you want to use or want to sell for big cash is in fact fun and encouraging because it brings you immediatly to a desired goal. Having to work towards a totally different item first, that is worthless or useless to you in order to get the desired item though is in my view a bad design choice because it's almost viewed as harassment by a lot of players.

Edited by Jason Parker, 18 November 2012 - 10:16 AM.

[The Herrick]

HarryMannbach, on 18 November 2012 - 10:04 AM, said:

So much negativity... PGI has done a pretty damn fine job of reviving an awesome series, and has made the core game experience FREE. Why does it come as a shock to people that there need to be ways for them to make money and keep supporting the product? The costs of developing a modern game and running the infrastructure to support it are not insubstantial. I don't think they are doing anything inhuman by trying to have methods of bringing in continued income.

They already made back all their dev costs and turned a profit. Just because the game is free to play does not mean they need to gate off everything with stupid amounts of grind that players hate in the off chance they will pay for shortcuts instead of leaving for one of the many better ran F2P titles out there.

When I say run I mean both in how they do business and the game not being a buggy trainwreck that crashes every hour.

Also Mechwarrior was already being revived before MWO was even started as a free mod called Living Legends, you may not have heard about them much since PGI slapped a cease and desist order on their *****.

[Gorith]

8CH Trooper, on 18 November 2012 - 10:05 AM, said:

F2P is really only free to the casual player, those of us who want to play will pay for the things we really want. I would rather they just bill me 10 dollars a month and get rid of all of the things try to force you to spend real money. This will have the added benefit of weeding out some of the Aholes that will undoubtedly show up after MWO is launched for real.

While I like the idea of a P2P mechwarrior game to make that work and make equal profit they would need ALOT more content and immersion than what MWO is currently or honestly will become (going by what they have said they wanted to do with the game)

[Lightfoot]

I voted yes, just because all the MechWarrior Lore I have read indicates you gain Elite and Ace levels in a 'mech Class not a certain chassis. However, I am okay with whatever produces the best game balance.

[BalzaSteel]

The Herrick, on 18 November 2012 - 09:55 AM, said:

Just enjoy losing an edge because your basic efficiencies are no longer doubled and you have no elites. Just because PGI aren't pointing a gun at player's heads and making them grind doesn't mean the system is any less stupid.

funny how every silver lining seems to have a cloud isn't it?

basicaly what it boils down to is you want to have all the advantages but your too lazy to earn them, that's your problem not the games.

BalzOut

Edited by BalzaSteel, 18 November 2012 - 10:15 AM.

[HarryMannbach]

Jason Parker, on 18 November 2012 - 10:06 AM, said:

I voted yes. Though I do not really mind I think doing things that way is the most mindles way to do it that is possible. It is pretty obvious that the whole purpose of the mechanic is not to make the game more fun but to get players to invest CBills or even MC in order to upgrade a single variant. Stuff like that is one of the many bad symptoms of the cash grab that MMOs have become since WoW and the invention of the F2P business model have hit us. It's all about keeping people playing. If they actually have fun doing it is only a second or third priority, which is why so many MMOs are "grind before you have fun" by design. I know there are people who like this and sadly far too many people like it so that rubbish is here to stay for some years.

I think it is certainly a matter of keeping people playing, but the gaming industry has been doing this for years, first via multitudes of sequels, now many games are trying to find ways to have one title become more long-term viable. It's simply business. It's not free for them to do what they do, so consumers have to choose the products they want and support them financially. Personally, I think the 3 variant requirement makes sense from a lore standpoint, if nothing else. You are getting credit for mastering the chassis, not a variant, so I can't bring myself to vote yes.

[Levi Porphyrogenitus]

Given that the current setup has every mech with the same efficiencies, I'd be perfectly happy with Elite/Master unlocks being across weight class (Light, Medium, Heavy, Assault) instead of by individual mech. Alternatively, PGI could give you a bonus Mechbay slot when you unlock Master with a mech type, making it a little bit easier to expand your garage. That would have the added bonus of getting people to "buy-in" to a mech chassis, making it just that little bit more likely that they'd spend MC on the remaining bays needed to finish unlocking a mech type.

As a related aside, there should be no cap on the number of total mechbays a player can have. This seems like the number one potential revenue generator for PGI right now (and will likely remain a strong one even once cosmetics become available), and any kind of artificial limit to the number of bays allowed seems counterproductive.

[Hikyuu]

Gorith, on 18 November 2012 - 09:25 AM, said:

It's not punishing players it's a way to keep people from maxing out mechs to quickly. Remeber for them for make money with players paying mainly for cosmetics and cbill/xp boosts the grind must be fairly substantial.

Taiji, on 18 November 2012 - 09:39 AM, said:

You can't call mechanics which encourage people to play more of the game a 'punishment' without making me laugh.

thank you for getting the ******* idea.

to get your favorite tank in World Of Tanks, you have to progressively learn other tanks.

the only difference in MWO is that to become expert in a Chassis, you have to know how to play that chassis, Variants are simply different weapon loadouts.

this creates a progression system that requires A. the player to devote more than a days worth of time to the game (i can max out a chassis in a day, easily.) and B. the player spend some of their earned income on a new mech now and then (some people just LOVE the jenner) and quite possibly speed these two processes up by purchasing MC, or grinding.

I bought MC but only to get my Raven, and open mech slots for later mechs. I blew most of it pretty quickly. had i spent money solely on the raven. I wouldn't need another dime of Cbills.

this nonsense has got to stop. please think before you post threads.

Levi Porphyrogenitus, on 18 November 2012 - 10:16 AM, said:

Alternatively, PGI could give you a bonus Mechbay slot when you unlock Master with a mech type, making it a little bit easier to expand your garage.

good idea, should recommend that to PGI on the feedback forum or support@mwomercs.com

Edited by Hikyuu, 18 November 2012 - 10:19 AM.

[I7aggoHok]

HarryMannbach, on 18 November 2012 - 10:04 AM, said:

So much negativity... PGI has done a pretty damn fine job of reviving an awesome series, and has made the core game experience FREE. Why does it come as a shock to people that there need to be ways for them to make money and keep supporting the product? The costs of developing a modern game and running the infrastructure to support it are not insubstantial. I don't think they are doing anything inhuman by trying to have methods of bringing in continued income.

I have nothing against the fact that they make money. I like to buy skins / jewelry / rare robots and I'm willing to pay for it! But why should I pay for additional slots / robots, I do not need in order to open the Elite and Master

[HarryMannbach]

The Herrick, on 18 November 2012 - 10:08 AM, said:

They already made back all their dev costs and turned a profit. Just because the game is free to play does not mean they need to gate off everything with stupid amounts of grind that players hate in the off chance they will pay for shortcuts instead of leaving for one of the many better ran F2P titles out there. When I say run I mean both in how they do business and the game not being a buggy trainwreck that crashes every hour. Also Mechwarrior was already being revived before MWO was even started as a free mod called Living Legends, you may not have heard about them much since PGI slapped a cease and desist order on their *****.

I don't think they are out of line by protecting what they now hold the rights to. Their dev costs were made back because a whole lot of people were excited enough about what they were doing to invest in the project, which is the essence of business startup capital. It doesn't mean you all of a sudden stop trying to do things in a way that will keep your business running in the long term. I've not but maybe once had my game client crash on me, so I think "buggy train wreck" is a bit melodramatic, but bear in mind the game is in beta. As in beta testing which means work-in-progress. Either enjoy the access to the product, or don't play it, in my opinion. Unless you have a ********* streak, in which case, don't play it unless it pains you greatly

[Gorith]

I7aggoHok, on 18 November 2012 - 10:20 AM, said:

I have nothing against the fact that they make money. I like to buy skins / jewelry / rare robots and I'm willing to pay for it! But why should I pay for additional slots / robots, I do not need in order to open the Elite and Master

So after maxing your favorite mech what would you do?

Having different variants of the same chassis will actually help you in the long run when the metagame gets put in because you will likely know the heat index/terrain style of the planets you are dropping on so you can have 3 of your favorite mech ready to go decked out for whatever environment your getting dropped down onto

[Rokuzachi]

I think it was a poor way to do the system. At least, given the early state of the game, there's plenty of opportunity to make it into something much better.

It just feels unnecessary.