32 replies to this topic

[Arcane Azmadi]

Well, I just finished trying out the RVN-3L Raven and I wish I hadn't. What a colossal waste of time, effort and MCs. For double the cost of a normal Raven you get the crappest mech in the game which does NOTHING. Piddly weapons, tin-can armour, no jump jets. And the tradeoff for this? The NARC beacon, the TAG, the Beagle Active Probe, the ECM? Utterly, utterly worthless.

Seriously, what is the POINT of all this? You're rolling around the battlefield in a tin-can, you have to get close to the enemies to tag or NARC them, you die if coughed on, the Beagle is unneeded (I couldn't even tell if it was doing anything at all) and the ECM ineffective. The game is too fast-paced for subtleties like this, there's absolutely no reason whatsoever you'd want to use one of these junkheaps rather than a Jenner or even a Commando. The Raven is a wonderful little tool in MechCommander, but this isn't MechCommander. And the fact that it costs so much when it's so useless is just adding insult to injury. I just have to ask why?

[PurpleNinja]

Well, if BAP, ECM and NARC worked properly and if we had big maps where scouts could really scout, then Ravens could be useful.

[Streeter]

ECM is supposed to be pretty good but at the moment its not implemented.

Narc is pretty average given its weight / ammo etc.

Tag actually works quite well for LRMs but you really need to be on voice with another team member or its pretty difficult to co-ordinate with it.

BAP helps sensor range a bit and also pics up shut down mechs, I dont think its worth it unless you have a free 2 or so tons you dont know what else to do with.

[Redshift2k5]

BAP is currently functional. ECM is currently non-functional. Trust me, when the ECM is actualy online it will be worth it.

BAP is primarly useful for a spotter, it gives you a longer targetting range. If you're not using it to spot for targets, what are you using it for?

[Khobai]

The biggest problem with the Raven is that it doesn't do electronic warfare better than any other light mech.

Not only does the Raven have worse weapon hardpoints than the Jenner, but it's no better at electronic warfare either, since the Jenner can also use TAG/NARC, BAP, and ECM (they said all light mechs and some medium mechs will be able to use ECM). There's really no reason to use the Raven unless it can do something the other light mechs can't.

That's why I feel each mech needs unique mech efficiencies. It makes no sense that the Jenner and Raven share the same skills when they have drastically different roles. The Jenner should have harassment skills and the Raven should have sensor warfare skills.

Edited by Khobai, 26 November 2012 - 05:47 AM.

[Rifter]

I agree, not just about ewar but the raven in general. The jenner is just a all around better mech.

Edited by Rifter, 26 November 2012 - 05:38 AM.

[Redshift2k5]

Rifter, on 26 November 2012 - 05:35 AM, said:

I agree, not just about eway but the raven in general. The jenner is just a all around better mech.

We don't know which mechs will be ABLE to mount an ECM once it is added.

Also, module slots can make a big difference for enhancing sensor range and unit detection; how many modules slots does the Raven get and how many does the Jenner get?

[Streeter]

Khobai, on 26 November 2012 - 05:35 AM, said:

The biggest problem with the Raven is that it doesn't do electronic warfare better than any other mech.

Not only does the Raven have worse hardpoints than the Jenner, but it's no better at electronic warfare than the Jenner, since the Jenner can also use TAG/NARC, BAP, and ECM (they said all light mechs and some medium mechs will be able to use ECM).

There's just no reason to use the Raven unless it can do something the other light mechs can't.

it looks perty?

[Rifter]

Redshift2k5, on 26 November 2012 - 05:38 AM, said:

We don't know which mechs will be ABLE to mount an ECM once it is added.

Also, module slots can make a big difference for enhancing sensor range and unit detection; how many modules slots does the Raven get and how many does the Jenner get?

I was under the impression ECM was a module so could be loaded on any mech as they all have slots, and AFAIK all mechs i have seen have 2 slots(3 with master unlocked)

[NoRoo]

Khobai, on 26 November 2012 - 05:35 AM, said:

The biggest problem with the Raven is that it doesn't do electronic warfare better than any other light mech.

Not only does the Raven have worse weapon hardpoints than the Jenner, but it's no better at electronic warfare either, since the Jenner can also use TAG/NARC, BAP, and ECM (they said all light mechs and some medium mechs will be able to use ECM).

There's really no reason to use the Raven unless it can do something the other light mechs can't.

Yeah... I was actually surprised when we found out that anything would be able to fit ECM or BAP. As an owner of 3 ravens and 3 jenners, I can't see any reason to drive my ravens unless they get some ewar advantage at some point. Hopefully they do.

[Khobai]

They said all light mechs and some medium mechs will be able to use ECM. So it wont be anything. But as far as I know the Jenner will be able to use ECM.

[Drenzul]

Ewar isn't in game yet.

BAP is incredibly effective, particually when used as a scout or with streaks, no longer is shutting down a defence against streaks.

Tag is awesome as a scout.

Raven can fit similar armour and speed to a Jenner as well, its main difference is it needs to switch the loadout down to fit the ECM and other EW items, so no it will never have the firepower of a jenner if it wants to do it's primary role.

[Redshift2k5]

Rifter, on 26 November 2012 - 05:42 AM, said:

I was under the impression ECM was a module so could be loaded on any mech as they all have slots, and AFAIK all mechs i have seen have 2 slots(3 with master unlocked)

NoRoo, on 26 November 2012 - 05:44 AM, said:

Yeah... I was actually surprised when we found out that anything would be able to fit ECM or BAP. As an owner of 3 ravens and 3 jenners, I can't see any reason to drive my ravens unless they get some ewar advantage at some point. Hopefully they do.

ECM is not a module. modules are software and give you some small bonuses, modules take module slots but not crit space or tonnage.

ECM is equipment.

ECM will only be mountable to specific mechs

ECM
Target Date: December 4th - 60%
Status: Play Testing, Additional Feature Work
Notes: Working on balancing. Most likely will limit to specific Light/Medium Chassis for now (similar to how jump jets work).

http://mwomercs.com/...eature-roadmap/

[Fenix0742]

Arcane Azmadi, on 26 November 2012 - 05:22 AM, said:

And the fact that it costs so much when it's so useless is just adding insult to injury. I just have to ask why?

Because it has an XL engine. Look at the price of any mech with an XL, it costs more. Honestly though, the 3L is the best raven after a total refit. Haing a bigger stock engine means it has a bigger max engine, and having 2 missile slots means you can mount 2 streak launchers. After you get speed tweak you can go just as fast as a jenner, and have almost as many medium lasers. There's also nothing stopping you from maxing the armor. It also has 3 module slots which may be important someday. The only problem with the 3L is that all of the stock gear is useless. Maybe once we get more gamemodes, tonnage limits on drops, and global abilities like long tom strikes, the only role for any chassis is combat.

[MuonNeutrino]

Note that it says *specific* light and medium mechs, not *all* lights and some mediums. I'd feel quite confident that the jenner will *not* be one of those mechs. My guess for starters is raven & cicada.

[Khobai]

Quote

My guess for starters is raven & cicada

If the cicada can use ecm theres no reason to use the raven. its better to take a cicada as a scout because it doesnt put a light mech on the other team and theres a high probability of putting a slow medium on the other team than another cicada.

[Boris The Spider]

The 3L is currently the only chasis that can mount ECM, although it does nothing at the minute, at some point it will, my 3L is already fitted up with this in mind. BAP with the two current sensor modules is pretty darn effective, I can hard lock an enemy at over 1000M, which leaves two free module slots. It is also capable of mounting the largest engine of any RVN chasis, although I dont use anything larger than my other models currently.

NARC needs a drastic reworking, TAG is good as is, as for the 3L's combat capabilities, as I deploy this model in tandem with heavy/assault mechs who will soon be taking advantage of both my ECM and AMS umberla, all it needs to be able to do is chase off a scout mech, not win a 1vs1 with them.

Horses for Courses.

Khobai, on 26 November 2012 - 06:22 AM, said:

If the cicada can use ecm theres no reason to use the raven. its better to take a cicada as a scout because it doesnt put a light mech on the other team and theres a high probability of putting a slow medium on the other team than another cicada.

I think that if the ECM is to be added to other mechs it will be on new chasis variants, as it seems to me that the ability to add ECM is reflected in the price tag of the 3L, price seems a little steep for just the XL engine upgrade.

Edited by Boris The Spider, 26 November 2012 - 06:27 AM.

[Orkhepaj]

Drenzul, on 26 November 2012 - 05:48 AM, said:

Ewar isn't in game yet.

BAP is incredibly effective, particually when used as a scout or with streaks, no longer is shutting down a defence against streaks.

Tag is awesome as a scout.

Raven can fit similar armour and speed to a Jenner as well, its main difference is it needs to switch the loadout down to fit the ECM and other EW items, so no it will never have the firepower of a jenner if it wants to do it's primary role.

you are not playing the same game as us then

BAP incredibly effective...
tag awesome?....
Raven similar speed as jenner?...

you clrly dont play the MWO

[Redshift2k5]

Boris The Spider, on 26 November 2012 - 06:25 AM, said:

The 3L is currently the only chasis that can mount ECM, although it does nothing at the minute, at some point it will, my 3L is already fitted up with this in mind. BAP with the two current sensor modules is pretty darn effective, I can hard lock an enemy at over 1000M, which leaves two free module slots. It is also capable of mounting the largest engine of any RVN chasis, although I dont use anything larger than my other models currently.

NARC needs a drastic reworking, TAG is good as is, as for the 3L's combat capabilities, as I deploy this model in tandem with heavy/assault mechs who will soon be taking advantage of both my ECM and AMS umberla, all it needs to be able to do is chase off a scout mech, not win a 1vs1 with them.

Horses for Courses.



I think that if the ECM is to be added to other mechs it will be on new chasis variants, as it seems to me that the ability to add ECM is reflected in the price tag of the 3L, price seems a little steep for just the XL engine upgrade.

sounds like you're really getting your value out of BAP and modules! Good luck with the ECM when it becomes avaialble.

[Boris The Spider]

Redshift2k5, on 26 November 2012 - 06:31 AM, said:

sounds like you're really getting your value out of BAP and modules! Good luck with the ECM when it becomes avaialble.

Thank you Redshift, all part of my design philosopy. I have created a mech I am happy to drive at the mintue and I know that in the near future its getting a large buff without me even having to click on mechlab. Also, something I would recomend to all RVN-4X pilots, don't be tempted to pull all but one JJ off you build, becuase one tuesday, could be a week, could be a month or more, but your going to find that your build requires a total rework, possibly costing you several million C bills.

What I am most looking forward too though is better abilities to comunicate with my team, wether ingame VOIP, BF2 style Comm-Rose or a return to 8 man teams, thats when the RVN and other scouts/ewar are going to realy shine.

Edited by Boris The Spider, 26 November 2012 - 06:44 AM.