36 replies to this topic

[M E X]

I intend to upgrade to a Sapphire HD7750 Ultimate 1024 MB PCIe soon ... does anyone use this GPU until now ?
What FPS do you have and how satisfied are you with this GPU ?

MfG, MEX

PS:

M E X, on 11 February 2013 - 06:46 AM, said:

... I now seem to have usually 12-18FPS@1440x900+MAX and 21-27FPS@1027x768+MIN

FPS/ . . . 1440x900+MAX . . 1024x768+MIN
Login . . . . . . . . . . . . 33-36 . . . . . . . . . . 48-52
Home . . . . . . . . . . . . 30-33 . . . . . . . . . . 41-44
Options . . . . . . . . . . 30-33 . . . . . . . . . . 41-44
Mission Summary . . 12-31 . . . . . . . . . . 12-44
During Battle . . . . . . 07-31 . . . . . . . . . . 11-31

Looks like since the last Patches, after 9th February, the Performance has increased again

I also considered a Geforce GT 640, but it needs more power and has only 384 instead of 512 unified shaders:
http://www.hwcompare...radeon-hd-7750/
Although it is slightly cheaper than a HD7750 and has 13% better Texel & Pixel rates, I dont like it because of its +10W !

Because of immediate availability and the price of 87.47€ I bought a
MSI R7750-PMD2GD3, Radeon HD 7750, 2GB DDR3, DVI, HDMI
Many thanks to Chbribs and Vulpesveritas for their valuable advice

Edited by M E X, 11 February 2013 - 08:42 AM.

[Cid F]

No 77xx Card for gaming! Buy a 78xx Ort 79xx. I use a 7950 which is ab out 260€....Ach du bist ja Ösi, da schreib ich deutsch. Kauf dir keine 7700 zum zocken, damit wirst du nicht glücklich. Kauf dir besser eine 7850 oder 7870. Oder halt für um die 260€ eine 7950.

[Teh Rav3n]

I have to agree w/ Cid F. for the most part. An HD 7770 would be ok, but that would be the bare minimum imo for 1080p gaming. You will be much better off with a 7850/7870 overall, which are a little more powerful than the 6970's.


I'm replacing my 6970 with the MSI R7950 TF III right now actually (in transit for my new build).

[M E X]

If you are not satified with a "Cape Verde Pro" chip of the Southern Islands GPU family, what do you think about the "GK107" chip of a NVIDIA GeForce GT 640 ?

I intend to get a GPU for less than 100€ here in VIENNA, so I fear the 7950 is far outside my budget range.

MfG, MEX

PS: IF I could afford it, I would buy:

Alienware M18x Cosmic Black - Anodized Aluminum
Intel® Core™ i7-3940XM (8MB Cache, up to 3.9GHz w/ Turbo Boost 2.0)
Dual 2GB GDDR5 AMD® RADEON HD 7970M CrossFireX™
8.192 MB (4 x 2 GB), 1.866 MHz DDR3-Dual-Channel-Speicher
128GB mSATA Boot Drive + 500GB 7,200rpm SATA 3Gb/s
LCD 46,74 cm(18.4") WideFHD (1920 x 1080) WLED LCD
ALIENFX-FARBE Mars Red

But sadly I dont have the necessary ca$h !

Currently I only have a old HP dc7600c with 5GB RAM and a integrated graphic, which I urgently need to upgrade with a GPU for less than 100€ ...

Edited by M E X, 29 November 2012 - 10:10 AM.

[Vulpesveritas]

M E X, on 29 November 2012 - 09:35 AM, said:

If you are not satified with a "Cape Verde Pro" chip of the Southern Islands GPU family, what do you think about the "GK107" chip of a NVIDIA GeForce GT 640 ?

I intend to get a GPU for less than 100€ here in VIENNA, so I fear the 7950 is far outside my budget range.

MfG, MEX

The Nvidia Geforce GT 640 / GK 107 is only about as fast as the Radeon HD 6670, which is half as fast as the AMD Radeon HD 7770 ghz Edition / Cape Verde Pro. It takes a Nvidia Geforce GTX 650ti / GK106 on the green side to equal / slightly beat the Radeon HD 7770 Ghz Edition.

I'm hoping you can order from Amazon Germany, if not I apologize for my assumption. (basing off geography and it's amazon.)
If you're willing to go used, this Radeon HD 6790 is probably the fastest card you can get; http://www.amazon.de...tag=clownova-21
Otherwise, you're going to get stuck with a Radeon HD 7750 as the fastest card.

If you can increase your budget, you can get a 7770 new, or if you're willing to buy used, you can get a Radeon HD 5870 which will do very well in this game, exceeding the performance of any of the other cards by a considerable amount; http://www.amazon.de...tag=clownova-21

[M E X]

Vulpesveritas, on 29 November 2012 - 10:18 AM, said:

...
Otherwise, you're going to get stuck with a Radeon HD 7750 as the fastest card.

If you can increase your budget, you can get a 7770 new, or if you're willing to buy used, you can get a Radeon HD 5870 which will do very well in this game, exceeding the performance of any of the other cards by a considerable amount; http://www.amazon.de...tag=clownova-21

I cant afford more than 100€, and I would prefer a PASSIVE cooled new card ... as I dont have a credit card or PayPal, I usually buy from a shop in Vienna where I can save postage & porto, using www.geizhals.at for finding good offers:
http://geizhals.at/?...4_passiv#xf_top

Looks like the HD7750 is the best what I can get for 100€ ... does anyone of you already use this GPU ?
What FPS do you have with this card ?

MfG, MEX

[Vulpesveritas]

M E X, on 29 November 2012 - 11:05 AM, said:

I cant afford more than 100€, and I would prefer a PASSIVE cooled new card ... as I dont have a credit card or PayPal, I usually buy from a shop in Vienna where I can save postage & porto, using www.geizhals.at for finding good offers:
http://geizhals.at/?...4_passiv#xf_top

Looks like the HD7750 is the best what I can get for 100€ ... does anyone of you already use this GPU ?
What FPS do you have with this card ?

MfG, MEX

Well the fastest passively cooled graphics card is the Radeon HD 6850, but that's not anywhere near your budget. Generally I don't recommend passively cooled usage, but then again I don't really mind the sound of fans blowing, and is a personal opinion. The main problem being passively cooled solutions are also more expensive than their cooler running active solutions. For under 100, there is a 7750 passive from Powercolor; http://geizhals.at/765414 And if you're looking active, a 7770 from MSI; http://geizhals.at/824326

FPS on a 7750 at 1080p is around 25-35fps with a quad-core CPU.

[M E X]

Vulpesveritas, on 29 November 2012 - 11:21 AM, said:

Well the fastest passively cooled graphics card is the Radeon HD 6850, but that's not anywhere near your budget. Generally I don't recommend passively cooled usage, but then again I don't really mind the sound of fans blowing, and is a personal opinion. The main problem being passively cooled solutions are also more expensive than their cooler running active solutions. For under 100, there is a 7750 passive from Powercolor; http://geizhals.at/765414 And if you're looking active, a 7770 from MSI; http://geizhals.at/824326

Thanks for the links

I were already considering the 7750 from Powercolor before your reply, as it is cheaper than the card which orginally looked the best for my budget.

The problem with active cards is that they usually need more power, maybe more than my power supply is able to deliver ... although this is my main concern, I also prefer the better RELIABILITY and silence of a passiv cooled card.

Quote

FPS on a 7750 at 1080p is around 25-35fps with a quad-core CPU.

25-35fps @ 1080p sounds good, but until I can afford a better CPU/MainBoard I hope this GPU will deliver at least 20fps @ 1024x768 with LOW settings with the old HP dc7600c I currently have available

How important is the influence of the other options ?
I asume fps are better if I dont use "windowed" mode ?

MfG, MEX

PS: I intend to use a old HDreadyTV(1600x1050) which I used on my PS3 since 2007 instead of a monitor, so HDMI is a must have as I dont want to use VGA !

Edited by M E X, 29 November 2012 - 11:47 AM.

[Vulpesveritas]

M E X, on 29 November 2012 - 11:45 AM, said:

Thanks for the links

I were already considering the 7750 from Powercolor before your reply, as it is cheaper than the card which orginally looked the best for my budget.

The problem with active cards is that they usually need more power, maybe more than my power supply is able to deliver ... although this is my main concern, I also prefer the better RELIABILITY and silence of a passiv cooled card.
25-35fps @ 1080p sounds good, but until I can afford a better CPU/MainBoard I hope this GPU will deliver at least 20fps @ 1024x768 with LOW settings with the old HP dc7600c I currently have available

How important is the influence of the other options ?
I asume fps are better if I dont use "windowed" mode ?

MfG, MEX

PS: I intend to use a old HDreadyTV(1600x1050) which I used on my PS3 since 2007 instead of a monitor, so HDMI is a must have as I dont want to use VGA !

Well, power usage on the 7750 and 7770 are already low, and fans generally don't consume more than 5 watts of power. They're also generally designed to last more than 100,000 hours of use, or with an average of 8 hours a day usage... 35 years. Or 12 years of being on 24/7. Even cheaply made sleeve bearing fans have a mean time before failure of 50,000 hours, and those sell for less than $5 a piece most of the time. The fan with the lowest MTBF is this one, and it's MTBF is 30,000 hours, or 4 years of non-stop use. And keep in mind, passive cooled cards need more case airflow in order to keep temps within an optimal range, so having a small, cramped case or one with an amount of dust will actually make passive cards less reliable than an active cooled card. It's why most cards are Active cooled.
As for your dual core CPU, yeah you'll be dragging along. Honestly, in your situation, you may be better off doing a motherboard + CPU upgrade and going with an AMD trinity solution for better overall graphics. You won't be able to pull of 1080p, but 720p is a given using the integrated graphics if you get an AMD A10-5800k and a motherboard. And you can add on a radeon HD 6670 for similar performance to a 7750 using hybrid crossfire when the game supports it.

Edited by Vulpesveritas, 29 November 2012 - 12:00 PM.

[M E X]

Its not the reliability of the FAN about which I am concerned.
A passive GPU card is usually designed for needing as few current as possible, generating as few heat as possible, which will allow me to use a smaller ( or in my case "older" ! ) power supply, until I can afford the upgrade to a "XL engine" ...

I dont even have a dual core CPU ! ... It is a P4-630, identified by Ubuntus memtest from the boot CD as:
Pentium 4 (0.09) with 2993 MHz, chipset Intel i945 P/G with memory speed 2866MB/s in the lower 3319M of my 5GB RAM

First I bought a old used HP Compaq dc7600 Convertible Mini for 50€ with 1GB RAM & 80 GB HDD.
Then I upgraded to 5MB RAM with 2x2GB PC2-6400 CL6 240-Pin DIMM for another 50€.
As MWO doesnt support the integrated GPU, I then bought a EVGA NVIDIA® GeForce™ 8400GS 512 MB DDR3-RAM PCIe x16 DVI, VGA, HDMI for another 30€ with MONEY BACK guarantee for testing ( already given back of course ).
From the experiences with the 8400GS GPU ( 4-8 FPS only, but working ! ), I now know that I need at least a grafic card with a HD7750 ...

The next step is now to buy a suitable GPU for less than 100€ ( raising the total I spent for MWO to ~200€ )

The 50€ for the HP dc7600c were not only for the CPU & mainboard, but I also needed a power supply & case which are not as useless as the old scrap I had until now, as I stopped assembling PC's in the last century.
After getting a useable GPU, the next step will then be either a CPU upgrade, or most likely a new mainboard ( capable of using my 2x2GB PC2-6400 RAM ) with at least a quad core CPU ... THEN I might consider an AMD trinity solution for better overall graphics as the next step !
Of course I will also need a new case with a bigger power supply when I upgrade to a new CPU/mainbord or better GPU.

For playing MWO I had the options of waiting at least until next year ... until I can spend up to 1000€ for a brand new gaming PC
OR
buy some cheap scrap like the HP compaq dc7600c and upgrade it for as few money as possible so that I can at least play MWO in lowest resolution NOW

As you see I decided for scavenging the scrapyard for my first own mech in MWO instead of wasting REAL money for a shiny brand new mech, like one of the spoiled rich kids of the IS aristocrazy or a megalomanic cauldronborn

MfG, MEX

Edited by M E X, 01 December 2012 - 05:12 AM.

[Vulpesveritas]

M E X, on 01 December 2012 - 03:23 AM, said:

Its not the reliability of the FAN about which I am concerned.
A passive GPU card is usually designed for needing as few current as possible, generating as few heat as possible, which will allow me to use a smaller ( or in my case "older" ! ) power supply, until I can afford the upgrade to a "XL engine" ...I dont even have a dual core CPU ! ... It is a P4-630, identified by Ubuntus memtest from the boot CD as:
Pentium 4 (0.09) with 2993 MHz, chipset Intel i945 P/G with memory speed 2866MB/s in the lower 3319M of my 5GB RAM

First I bought a old used HP Compaq dc7600 Convertible Mini for 50€ with 1GB RAM & 80 GB HDD.
Then I upgraded to 5MB RAM with 2x2GB PC2-6400 CL6 240-Pin DIMM for another 50€.
As MWO doesnt support the integrated GPU, I then bought a EVGA NVIDIA® GeForce™ 8400GS 512 MB DDR3-RAM PCIe x16 DVI, VGA, HDMI for another 30€ with MONEY BACK guarantee for testing ( already given back of course ).
From the experiences with the 8400GS GPU ( 4-8 FPS only, but working ! ), I know know that I need at least a grafic card with a HD7750 ...

The next step is now to buy a suitable GPU for less than 100€ ( raising the total I spent for MWO to ~200€ )

The 50€ for the HP dc7600c were not only for the CPU & mainboard, but I also needed a power supply & case which are not as useless as the old scrap I had until now, as I stopped assembling PC's in the last century.
After getting a useable GPU, the next step will then be either a CPU upgrade, or most likely a new mainboard ( capable of using my 2x2GB PC2-6400 RAM ) with at least a quad core CPU ... THEN I might consider an AMD trinity solution for better overall graphics as the next step !
Of course I will also need a new case with a bigger power supply when I upgrade to a new CPU/mainbord or better GPU.

For playing MWO I had the options of waiting at least until next year ... until I can spend up to 1000€ for a brand new gaming PC
OR
buy some cheap scrap like the HP compaq dc7600c and upgrade it for as few money as possible so that I can at least play MWO in lowest resolution NOW

As you see I decided for scavenging the scrapyard for my first own mech in MWO instead of wasting REAL money for a shiny brand new mech, like one of the spoiled rich kids of the IS aristrocrazy or a megalomanic cauldronborn

MfG, MEX

Allow me to simply say, upgrade to a quad core first. the A10-5800k has integrated graphics capable of pulling off the game at lower settings. However this game is very CPU intensive, it takes a quad core to run the game smoothly, and dual cores struggle at even minimum settings. Most dual cores struggle to pull off 15-25 frames per second with a mid-range GPU as of last patch. That you don't even have a dual core P4 puts you at a serious disadvantage in this game, and even if you did upgrade to a 7750, you still likely wouldn't be able to get good frames per second on account of your CPU just not having enough power for this game.

On a bright side with Trinity, since you would be running the integrated graphics overall system power draw would be lower than your current system now. You could then choose to upgrade the PSU after that and perhaps then add on a more capable GPU, however I would highly recommend focusing on upgrading your CPU right now.

Here's a motherboard, APU, and RAM set for under 250.
http://geizhals.at/845220
http://geizhals.at/805214
http://geizhals.at/639751

[M E X]

Vulpesveritas, on 01 December 2012 - 03:48 AM, said:

Allow me to simply say, upgrade to a quad core first ... Most dual cores struggle to pull off 15-25 frames per second with a mid-range GPU as of last patch. That you don't even have a dual core P4 puts you at a serious disadvantage in this game, and even if you did upgrade to a 7750, you still likely wouldn't be able to get good frames per second on account of your CPU just not having enough power for this game...

Thanks for this advise, but it is already TOO LATE, or TOO EARLY, for it ...

Fact is that I now have the dc7600c and I NEED A GPU as the integrated GPU isnt powerfull enough for MWO.

I asume the dreaded "dual core bug" is the case for the problems many players currently have with their framerate:
http://hardforum.com...ad.php?t=983781

But with a P4-630 that isnt one of my problems, and might actually be a ADVANTAGE of using a single core instead of a dual core

A single core P4 might allow better performance than a "dual core bug" plagued CPU since the last patch ... I will see this as soon as I get my new graphic card.

MfG, MEX

Edited by M E X, 01 December 2012 - 04:10 AM.

[Vulpesveritas]

M E X, on 01 December 2012 - 04:08 AM, said:

Thanks for this advise, but it is already TOO LATE, or TOO EARLY, for it ...

Fact is that I now have the dc7600c and I NEED A GPU as the integrated GPU isnt powerfull enough for MWO.

I asume the dreaded "dual core bug" is the case for the problems many players currently have with their framerate:
http://hardforum.com...ad.php?t=983781

But with a P4-630 that isnt one of my problems, and might actually be a ADVANTAGE of using a single core instead of a dual core

A single core P4 might allow better performance than a "dual core bug" plagued CPU since the last patch ... I will see this as soon as I get my new graphic card.

MfG, MEX

The frame rates in this game aren't due to a "dual core bug" (which hasn't been a problem in most cases for 5 years now, and I haven't heard of anything in the last 3 years of it at all.) rather, the game is coded for Quad cores and above, and anything weaker (such as your P4) struggles to run the game.
On another note, that it is a P4 is another hit down, given that Pentium 4s (Netburst) were a worse failing in x86 CPU architecture than AMD's Bulldozer.

Edited by Vulpesveritas, 01 December 2012 - 04:24 AM.

[Oderint dum Metuant]

MEX Vulp is 100% correct, the single core P4 will not work for MWO, there is no bug with dual cores, they are just old in the tooth and showing their age.
The game runs smoothest on Quad core systems, as its currently more CPU intensive than GPU intensive.
If you plug a 7750 into your system, im pretty sure you will see 0 difference in your gaming on MWO, because the CPU is what is holding it back.

As Vulp has already linked above, for the budget side your looking at, you will get far far better results going for and AMD Trinity chip, with is fairly decent integrated graphics, it also allows for Hybrid Xfire down the line, if you have more money to spend on your PC at a later date.

Hybird Xfire is the ability to buy and use a single standalone GPU and have it work alongside the integrated graphics of the above processor

[M E X]

Please read #10 before replying !

IF I see ZERO difference, I will have at least the 4-8 FPS I had with the 8400GS !
But I expect better performance with a HD7750 ... and at least I will be able to play MWO again.
Currently I cant play MWO at all, and of course a CPU/mainboard upgrade is the NEXT STEP after getting a usefull GPU card.

MfG, MEX

Edited by M E X, 01 December 2012 - 05:19 AM.

[Vulpesveritas]

M E X, on 01 December 2012 - 05:01 AM, said:

IF I see ZERO difference, I will have at least the 4-8 FPS I had with the 8400GS !
But I expect better performance with a HD7750 ... and at least I will be able to play MWO again.
Currently I cant play MWO at all, and of course a CPU/mainboard upgrade is the NEXT STEP after getting a usefull GPU card.

MfG, MEX

The problem is that you're limited by your extremely low end CPU, which is nowhere near as powerful as what you need for decent frames per second. With the AMD trinity option, you're getting a better GPU than you have now, and a CPU that is actually capable of running the game, unlike what you have currently. THe 7750 won't help because of your CPU, hence why we are recommending going with the AMD trinity option, which will give you the performance you need to be able to play the game NOW instead of months down the line after you find that your performance hasn't improved with the 7750 and have to wait to upgrade your CPU and motherboard, and your PSU likely along with it. If you go with the 5800k, you can put off upgrading the GPU until you have a more capable PSU, and be playing MWO in the mean time since the integrated graphics are powerful enough to run the game.

[M E X]

Vulpesveritas, on 01 December 2012 - 05:11 AM, said:

The problem is that you're limited by your extremely low end CPU, which is nowhere near as powerful as what you need for decent frames per second ... If you go with the 5800k, you can put off upgrading the GPU until you have a more capable PSU, and be playing MWO in the mean time since the integrated graphics are powerful enough to run the game.

As I already told you in #10, I decided to get the GPU card before getting the CPU/mainboard upgrade !
Please read this post before replying, as I dont want to repeat or quote myself !

I waited several months before I bought the HP dc7600c, hoping to get away with having to pay less than 100€ for the absolute minimum hardware ... with the GPU card I intend to buy next week I am sadly already at up to 200€.

The solution you and DV Mc Kenna are suggesting would have cost me at least twice as much before I am even able to play MWO at lowest settings, which I wouldnt have been able to finance THIS YEAR !

MfG, MEX

Edited by M E X, 01 December 2012 - 05:34 AM.

[Vulpesveritas]

M E X, on 01 December 2012 - 05:32 AM, said:

As I already told you in #10, I decided to get the GPU card before getting the CPU/mainboard upgrade !
Please read this this post before replying, as I dont want to repeat or quote myself !

I waited several months before I bought the HP dc7600c, hoping to get away with having to pay less than 100€ for the absolute minimum hardware ... with the GPU card I intend to buy next week I am sadly already at up to 200€.

The solution you and DV Mc Kenna are suggesting would have cost me at least twice as much before I am even able to play MWO at lowest settings, which I wouldnt have been able to finance THIS YEAR !

MfG, MEX

With the AMD trinity setup, you're getting both a GPU upgrade and the CPU upgrade. We're merely trying to point out that it will be a waste of money in all likelihood to upgrade your GPU before your CPU seeing as your CPU is far below the minimum requirement for this game. Lowering the resolution / graphics settings won't make the game faster if your CPU is too weak in the first place.

[Egomane]

M E X, on 01 December 2012 - 05:32 AM, said:

As I already told you in #10, I decided to get the GPU card before getting the CPU/mainboard upgrade !
Please read this post before replying, as I dont want to repeat or quote myself !

I waited several months before I bought the HP dc7600c, hoping to get away with having to pay less than 100€ for the absolute minimum hardware ... with the GPU card I intend to buy next week I am sadly already at up to 200€.

The solution you and DV Mc Kenna are suggesting would have cost me at least twice as much before I am even able to play MWO at lowest settings, which I wouldnt have been able to finance THIS YEAR !

MfG, MEX

Even with the new gpu, you will not be able to get to playable fps. I predict, at best you will be at 10 or 12 fps because of your limiting cpu.

Wait a bit longer, until you have a little more money, and do as DV and Vulpes sugested and you will be much better of.

[Skyfaller]

I upgraded from a GT240 to a 7770 and im not impressed with it. Yes, FPS increase of 15~ but it stutters. The old nvidia card never stuttered.

Stay with Nvidia.