34 replies to this topic

[Freeride Forever]

PGI, you gonna fix this $h|t or what?

Edited by Freeride Forever, 28 November 2012 - 04:47 PM.

[DuffmasterFresh]

What is the issue? That adding multiple jump jets does nothing?

[FrupertApricot]

Thats it. Should take a few tons of jets to get proper effect out of em. righ tnow theres no reason not to throw one on. then again maybe no one would use em with that nerf

[Freeride Forever]

You got 'er Duffmas'.

[Gavin McStine]

im not sure but in table top didnt you need one just to get you off the ground, and two to get a small boost? If i rember with one it would only move you one space and only if your knocked down.

[Deadoon]

In TT you needed 1 for every 30 meters you wanted to jump. I'd be happy putting on 10 jump-jets on my ctf and going to ******** spots though.

[Skyfaller]

They just need to make the jumpjet capable mechs HAVE jumpjets as part of the chassis as default.

The jumpjet modules would then simply be jumpjet juice recovery speed.

1 JJ = half the current recovery time.
5 JJ= twice the current recovery time.


Easy enough way to fix it no?

[Brandeis]

That wouldn't work, because the Jumpjets have mass to them, and not everyone uses them. Not to mention, I think every mech should be allowed to equip them if they want. My stepdad ran an Awesome variant with jets that was well...awesome...

[Goreshade]

Its kinda broken when you can get away with putting 1 jump jet on a Cataphract and jump long distances. I think PGI should make the jump jets give you 1 second of jump capability each, with a maximum of 6 jump jets. As well. maybe make them increase the regeneration rate on the jump gauge with each jump jet. As well, acceleration should be effected by each jump jet. Heat on the other hand needs to build as you use jump jets, about 2% per second you use them. This issue needs to be addressed and responded to. Most that own or have played the table top game would like a fix, so players aren't just equipping 1. It allows the Jenners to boat up on lasers and still be able to jump, while being heat efficient. This would make players sacrifice fire power or heat efficiency for mobility.

Currently with testing jump jets:

5 flight seconds regardless of amount of jump jets and no effect to height or acceleration
6-8% solid heat, seems like heat sinks do not effect this

Table top rules:

1 jump jet gives you 1 movement point per jump jet equipped.
1 heat is generated per 1 movement point.
There is no minimum or maximum.
jump jet weight .5 ton for 20-55 ton mechs, 1 ton for 60-85, 2 tons for 90-100 ton mechs

In game changes:

1 jump jet gives 1 second of flight, with maximum equip of 6(that way people cant troll around with jump jets)
3% heat per second, having heat sinks reduce this down to 1% per second
1 jump jet can only lift you 30 meters, 4-6 giving you increased acceleration
8 seconds recovery time with 1 jump jet, and removing 1 second per jump jet after that, 5 seconds with 6

Edited by Goreshade, 30 November 2012 - 09:25 PM.

[Deadoon]

Goreshade, on 28 November 2012 - 08:30 PM, said:

In game changes:

1 jump jet gives 1 second of flight, with maximum equip of 6(that way people cant troll around with jump jets)
3% heat per second, having heat sinks reduce this down to 1% per second
1 jump jet can only lift you 20 feet at a slow pace, 4 giving you maximum acceleration
13 seconds recovery time with 1 jump jet, and removing 2 seconds per jump jet after that, 10 seconds with 6

So nerf the **** out of jump-jets and make them tactically useless?

20 feet per is a far cry from 30 meters per. The highlander should be able to jump a full 90 meters with it's 3 jump-jets The heat from jumpjets is negligible, it generates heat, yes, but firing a medium laser generates the same amount of heat as using all 3 to jump a full 90 meters.

If the highlander cannot jump to it's full height, what is the whole point of it's own named attack, the highlander burial?
It's 3 jj on your stats would bring it to 60 feet, or a mere 20 meters, barely taller than itself, and frankly falling a few meters is not enough to cave in or do significant damage to any mech immediately by crushing in it's head of torso, but rather it would merely slide off and fall on it's ***.

[Goreshade]

Deadoon, on 28 November 2012 - 09:12 PM, said:

So nerf the **** out of jump-jets and make them tactically useless?

20 feet per is a far cry from 30 meters per. The highlander should be able to jump a full 90 meters with it's 3 jump-jets The heat from jumpjets is negligible, it generates heat, yes, but firing a medium laser generates the same amount of heat as using all 3 to jump a full 90 meters.

If the highlander cannot jump to it's full height, what is the whole point of it's own named attack, the highlander burial?
It's 3 jj on your stats would bring it to 60 feet, or a mere 20 meters, barely taller than itself, and frankly falling a few meters is not enough to cave in or do significant damage to any mech immediately by crushing in it's head of torso, but rather it would merely slide off and fall on it's ***.

Currently you only need 1 jump jet on any mech built, which wasn't intended like that. Table top rules is what PGI has based this game off of, which I clearly stated what the table top jump jets are. I suggested that the jump jets give you 1 second of flight per jump jet. I could have messed up a bit on it, but it clearly states that jump jets aren't correct. When the highlander comes out, it has 3 jump jets, which weigh 2 tons a piece. You can pop 2 off to free up for weapons or ammo, which should effect the range of its jump capability. Like I said before and I will say again, you should have to sacrifice heat efficiency or fire power for mobility. You think they build jumbo jets with only 1 engine to fly the thing? I think not. It's merely a suggested balance, and not a nerf.

I made a mistake, I meant 30 meters per jump jet.

Edited by Goreshade, 29 November 2012 - 09:04 PM.

[Dagger906]

TT does not translate to internet robots... Port jumpjet from previous Mechwarrior games, not TT.

[ICEFANG13]

I also would like it to be fixed, as I do not run them, for this reason (I don't like using things that are considered broken), but at least I can remain patient and suggest they fix it rather than calling it like the OP did, "fix this crud now!" Come on, its hardly the worst part of the game, but I also would like a bug fix patch to help out the few bad problems there are.

[Deadoon]

Goreshade, on 29 November 2012 - 08:59 PM, said:

Currently you only need 1 jump jet on any mech built, which wasn't intended like that. Table top rules is what PGI has based this game off of, which I clearly stated what the table top jump jets are. I suggested that the jump jets give you 1 second of flight per jump jet. I could have messed up a bit on it, but it clearly states that jump jets aren't correct. When the highlander comes out, it has 3 jump jets, which weigh 2 tons a piece. You can pop 2 off to free up for weapons or ammo, which should effect the range of its jump capability. Like I said before and I will say again, you should have to sacrifice heat efficiency or fire power for mobility. You think they build jumbo jets with only 1 engine to fly the thing? I think not. It's merely a suggested balance, and not a nerf.

I made a mistake, I meant 30 meters per jump jet.

Yeah, i know that the jjs are a bit cheap as they currently are, but by having them at your stats when they stack would make them nigh useless. you already sacrifice firepower and heat efficiency for using jjs when done properly, but they are not useless nor are they anywhere close to the level you are wanting them to be.

Heck, I'd drop the lrms on a highlander and replace them with more jump-jets to make me a pseudo-flight capable mech, just for the benifit of mobility and battlefield disruption, when you see a assault mech flying 200-300 meters in the air.

Edited by Deadoon, 29 November 2012 - 09:27 PM.

[Goreshade]

ICEFANG13, on 29 November 2012 - 09:15 PM, said:

I also would like it to be fixed, as I do not run them, for this reason (I don't like using things that are considered broken), but at least I can remain patient and suggest they fix it rather than calling it like the OP did, "fix this crud now!" Come on, its hardly the worst part of the game, but I also would like a bug fix patch to help out the few bad problems there are.

I'm posting about it, just to get it fixed, cause its not correct. Its to much of an advantage, even for jenners. PGI is trying to emulate the tabletop game to this, I believe they even said so themselves. All the equipment and weapons should have been done before they even went open beta, which is pretty much live. Bugs are always in games, broken or incorrect equipment should of been done before the bugs are.

[Goreshade]

Dagger906, on 29 November 2012 - 09:02 PM, said:

TT does not translate to internet robots... Port jumpjet from previous Mechwarrior games, not TT.

The older mechwarrior games are taken from the tabletop, but they put their own spin on it. PGI is trying to do their best to emulate the tabletop to PC game.

[Maverick Howell]

Skyfaller, on 28 November 2012 - 07:06 PM, said:

They just need to make the jumpjet capable mechs HAVE jumpjets as part of the chassis as default.

The jumpjet modules would then simply be jumpjet juice recovery speed.

1 JJ = half the current recovery time.
5 JJ= twice the current recovery time.


Easy enough way to fix it no?

Best idea ever ^^^^^^^^^^^^

[Jadel Blade]

Maverick Howell, on 30 November 2012 - 12:22 AM, said:

Best idea ever ^^^^^^^^^^^^

Except its not a good idea at all. Apart from that I guess.

How about you add in ...

They need to make machine gun capable mechs HAVE machine guns as default.

The need to make LRM20 capable mech HAVE LRM20 as default.

etc etc.

You get the point. Its a silly idea.

They do need to fix them though. Adjust the burn time based on the amount of jets, add in directional ability based on the number and position.

[Skyfaller]

Jadel Blade, on 30 November 2012 - 12:59 AM, said:

Except its not a good idea at all. Apart from that I guess.

How about you add in ...

They need to make machine gun capable mechs HAVE machine guns as default.

The need to make LRM20 capable mech HAVE LRM20 as default.

etc etc.

You get the point. Its a silly idea.

They do need to fix them though. Adjust the burn time based on the amount of jets, add in directional ability based on the number and position.

That makes no sense because an MG is a weapon and uses a weapon slot. The JJ only use up one critical slot and is not bound to any specialized slot. In fact, they are only bound to be used in JJ capable mechs.

Hence, if you make the JJ be part of the chassis itself, meaning no added weight because of it... you make the JJ capable mechs simple have JJ as they should have.

The JJ modules would be required if the mech is to recover the JJ fuel/energy/whatever. If you do not load 1 of them you only have fuel for one jump and then it never fills up.

Put 1 of them and it refills at half the rate it does now.
Additional JJ modules simply increase the rate of fuel recovery. I put 5 = 2x recover simply because the mechs that have JJ show default 5 jets.

Since JJ fuel does not recover mid-flight you wont have 'flying mechs'. A mech that loads.. heck, lets say 10 JJ modules just for kicks... would recover all its jump fuel within a second or two of landing.

...but remember he gives up 10 tons for that ability.

Its a balanced and very workable solution.

[MaddMaxx]

The real trouble is that since they limited the Mechs they are available to, they have to make the Jets be paid for in actual weight based on chassis movement #'s via Engine size.

Some tweaks will be required as MWO's engines do not directly translate but we can extrapolate to get close enough.

Example: Given that a STD 215 (13,5t) engine in MWO converts to a 4 MP rating, it would require 4 JJ's(minimum) to actually take off, move, hover and or whatever.

Edited by MaddMaxx, 30 November 2012 - 12:08 PM.