16 replies to this topic

[Corison]

Yes there are a million threads on this... So hopefully their listening.

If you love ECM you can stop reading as I am not interested in how you think its balanced and fine because you don't like lrms/ssrms, just my own.

How ECM _Should_ have been implemented.
1) Counters active boosts (Narc/Artemis)
2) Limit LRMs to Direct Fire Only
(Firing unit must have their own LOS/Lock to target)
(Or have LRM’s fire in a direct line like ballistics when fired without a lock. No spread since lrms have the same damage pattern at 7 hexes as they do at 21)
3) Counter secondary sensor modes when implemented.
(Including 360 lock, and Beagle, Radar, and whatever else gets added)

Additional Bonus non-tt that I wouldn’t mind seeing.
1) Maybe generate ghost images on radar
2) Disrupt mini-map/radar positioning
3) Disrupt Target Info – No more damage report on the target

Things ECM should _NOT_ do.
1) Prevent Lock (With LOS) - Worst implementation ever
2) Prevent Communication – WTF were they smoking? “good” teams already use voice. This just is stupid punishment of PUG's.
3) Prevent firing of LRM’s at a target.. WTH where did they come up with that garbage?


Don’t Forget clan ecm can be mounted on about anything. So its just going to get worse.

[Bguk]

Reply #13782458163548134

Please merge all these ECM threads.

[MrPenguin]

Oh, they can read. They just know that you're wrong.
ECM is fine.

Edited by MrPenguin, 06 December 2012 - 11:53 AM.

[Roadbeer]

Corison, on 06 December 2012 - 11:52 AM, said:

If you love ECM you can stop reading as I am not interested in how you think its balanced and fine because you don't like lrms/ssrms, just my own.

Translation:

This is my rant, I don't care what you have to say and my opinion is the only one that maters
/fingers in ears "LALALALALALALALALALALALALA"

[Corison]

Your right, my opinion is the only one that matters. Thanks for the bump.

You could try to present why the current implementation is correct or best, but I suspect I can show its wrong in almost every respect.

[Enigmos]

Just speculating, mind, but I don't believe we have a grasp of things that are also in the developmental pipeline.

You can still see the target if you have LoS, yet ECM would still render your targetting computer unable to calculate a lock. However I do agree that LRM should have a better direct fire capability that flattens trajectory and increases speed. But it should be area-of-effect (AOE).

For an example of things I think might be in the pipeline is the effects of PPC/ER PPC. It is very reasonable to think that PPC effects would include te neutralization of ECM equipment for some period of time, until the electronic system can reboot.

[Roadbeer]

Corison, on 06 December 2012 - 11:57 AM, said:

Your right, my opinion is the only one that matters. Thanks for the bump.

You could try to present why the current implementation is correct or best, but I suspect I can show its wrong in almost every respect.

You told me to stop reading if I think ECM is fine. Didn't say don't reply

[Corison]

I am not sure at this point how much long term credit I would give them.

They should have a fair bit of content planned down the pipe, but so far a lot of it has been introduced concept item without balancing, rapidly buff or debuff it, then introduced something else to counter the vocal crowd at the time.

In the example above having PPC/ERPPC disrupt ecm would be very nice, but wouldn't have much impact I suspect. Right now most of the units running it are high speeds and rarely hit at long range unless their running straight... and they either die fast or learn not to do that.

Roadbeer, on 06 December 2012 - 11:59 AM, said:

You told me to stop reading if I think ECM is fine. Didn't say don't reply

Your right, but figured it was implied. I will be more specific in the future if needed.

[Enigmos]

Corison, on 06 December 2012 - 12:02 PM, said:

I am not sure at this point how much long term credit I would give them.

They should have a fair bit of content planned down the pipe, but so far a lot of it has been introduced concept item without balancing, rapidly buff or debuff it, then introduced something else to counter the vocal crowd at the time.

In the example above having PPC/ERPPC disrupt ecm would be very nice, but wouldn't have much impact I suspect. Right now most of the units running it are high speeds and rarely hit at long range unless their running straight... and they either die fast or learn not to do that.

The velocity of PPC propagation is to increase to that of an AC/2 round this coming Tuesday. Fast movers will not be able to so easily evade in that case.

[Velba]

Your a chump.

Don't bother reading any further because I'm right and your wrong and I can probably prove it.

Chump.

[lightnin]

I completely agree with everything the OP posted except the following:

How ECM _Should_ have been implemented.
1) Counters active boosts (Narc/Artemis)
2) Limit LRMs to Direct Fire Only
(Firing unit must have their own LOS/Lock to target)
(Or have LRM’s fire in a direct line like ballistics when fired without a lock. No spread since lrms have the same damage pattern at 7 hexes as they do at 21)
3) Counter secondary sensor modes when implemented.
(Including 360 lock, and Beagle, Radar, and whatever else gets added)

Additional Bonus non-tt that I wouldn’t mind seeing.
1) Maybe generate ghost images on radar
2) Disrupt mini-map/radar positioning
3) Disrupt Target Info – No more damage report on the target

Things ECM should _NOT_ do.
1) Prevent Lock (With LOS) - Worst implementation ever
2) Prevent Communication – WTF were they smoking? “good” teams already use voice. This just is stupid punishment of PUG's.
3) Prevent firing of LRM’s at a target.. WTH where did they come up with that garbage?

[Sevaradan]

sorry but ecm is fine, thanks for playing!

[Diffedge]

Ehh, implementation needs to be tweaked but it def changes the game. I have had a couple rounds in my lrm boat now, and I have only been able to use my 2 med lasers the whole round and half of that round I could not tell who was friend or foe. (I think It was a bug but it was def a challenge when all I had was the mini map to identify friend or foe. And yes we had ecms on our side but not much you can do when there are 2-3 on the other team.

Anyways, I think the devs are trying to get this game to be tactics based vs what it currently is which is more just focus fire to win.
Now we are going to have long range sniping wars it seems not really tactics but maybe someday.....

Ohh or we are going to have 2-3 atlas's with ECM grouping together and just having a ball.

Edited by Diffedge, 06 December 2012 - 12:19 PM.

[Corison]

Long range sniping was always one of the more effective means with a Gauss or PPC if your target was silly enough to stand still which many are. LRM's have been hit or miss due to their damage spread and easy of evasion.

I can see a lot more good things being done with the game, just hoping they don't kill it in the process.

[Ricama]

Corison, on 06 December 2012 - 11:52 AM, said:

Yes there are a million threads on this... So hopefully their listening.

If you love ECM you can stop reading as I am not interested in how you think its balanced and fine because you don't like lrms/ssrms, just my own.

How ECM _Should_ have been implemented.
1) Counters active boosts (Narc/Artemis)
2) Limit LRMs to Direct Fire Only
(Firing unit must have their own LOS/Lock to target)
(Or have LRM’s fire in a direct line like ballistics when fired without a lock. No spread since lrms have the same damage pattern at 7 hexes as they do at 21)
3) Counter secondary sensor modes when implemented.
(Including 360 lock, and Beagle, Radar, and whatever else gets added)

Additional Bonus non-tt that I wouldn’t mind seeing.
1) Maybe generate ghost images on radar
2) Disrupt mini-map/radar positioning
3) Disrupt Target Info – No more damage report on the target

Things ECM should _NOT_ do.
1) Prevent Lock (With LOS) - Worst implementation ever
2) Prevent Communication – WTF were they smoking? “good” teams already use voice. This just is stupid punishment of PUG's.
3) Prevent firing of LRM’s at a target.. WTH where did they come up with that garbage?


Don’t Forget clan ecm can be mounted on about anything. So its just going to get worse.

1) no, it should not make all other tech useless.
2) this would not be too bad if missiles were faster but as it stands they will just be sniper weapons that have the worst damage to weight ratio and never hit anyone who isn't slowly wandering around in the open.
3) again 1.5 tons for blanket countering all advanced tech is really overpowered.

What it should do: prevent paper doll information on everyone covered. Maybe prevent sharing target information if the scout is actually in the coverage area but that's pushing it. At the size and weight of AMS + ammo ECM is should to be an interesting, somewhat useful piece of equipment. It should not be a wide ranged cloaking device that destroys what little communications abilities Pugs have and render the user practically immune to almost every other piece of tech.

[Corison]

Those Atlas's may have an interesting time once Artillery is in if they stay to close.

Add in some unique elements to MWO, perhaps smoke for example to force alternate vision modes and it gets interesting.

[Walk]

Corison, on 06 December 2012 - 11:57 AM, said:

Your right, my opinion is the only one that matters. Thanks for the bump.

You could try to present why the current implementation is correct or best, but I suspect I can show its wrong in almost every respect.

Except for you blatantly said not to do that in your first post. I can show how your opinions on ECM are wrong in almost every respect, but you are obviously so cemented in your views it would be pointless.