78 replies to this topic

[l33tworks]

I just started playing the game for the first time after many months of only watching vids etc and I shocked at how badly I'm doing.

Even after days of playing I just cant seem to amount to anything.

Granted I am playing from Australia but can this really matter that much or is it mostly something I can do to improve? I am not a gaming noob by any means in fact I was very good in all the past online warrior games.

Here is a typical game for me, I jump in my any mech, usually one of of my founders mechs, say an Atlas, see any enemy, do all I can from a distance with the LRMS, try to stay behind cover as much as possible, for minutes even, some hit, some hit walls, some miss, it seems normal compared to what I see spectating.

Eventually as I run into enemies I start Pummeling. 4 Goddam medium lasers all on target into anything I see, almost every time AC 20 or gauss at the same time any change I get, cant tell if they are registering damage but half the time they seem to hit, repeat, rinse, again again, keep my concentration UP, Pummel all I can. My 4 lasers are usually spot on. Its hard work staying on target and pummeling away but it seems not get me nowhere.

End result is I fire as much as I can into anything I see but Im usually dead in under 20 seconds. Sometimes I go from full health to almost dead in a few shots whereas I need to plough away at mech for 2-3 minutes and still I dont get a kill. I only get this chance because they are often shooting at someone else.

Dont get me wrong Im not running up first and getting killed, I'm usually the last one there so the battle has already started and there are friends about. On top of that the enemies are already weakened, be even easier to kill them, but its not. They take shot after shot from me but wont die. And talking big targets but Ravens, jenners, hunchies whatever.

But I get that Atlas is a big target so I try myself get in a jenner commando etc.

This time I'm dead almost instantly :S


So I try completely hide stay back for a 1 on 1. Eventually someone gets close.

It doesn't matter what it is, Jenner or dragon or catapult I come out dead.

I cant understand it as I'm landing 4 medium lasers, clean shots, plus a gauss in them or anything else I have. All close combat up and personal, but they will be a mech with 1/4 the firepower and just tear me up. My mech goes from full health to red to black in a matter of shots.

In the whole 3 days Ive been playing I've only had 1 kill my KDR is 0.04. Its so rare it was like an eclipse. To be honest it was all but dead when I went up agaisnt it will full health. Still got me to 1/4 health. Then I think someone farted in my direction and I died.

I'm far from a sore looser but it does get frustrating.

[WhiteRabbit]

if your reticule doesn't turn red you arent hitting them--> try to lead them some more, maybe that'll help

just because it looks like you hit them doesnt mean you actually do.. especially with a high ping.

Edited by WhiteRabbit, 09 December 2012 - 09:31 AM.

[l33tworks]

I'm not really sure what you mean. The lasers are lined up to hit the enemy mech and require no leading. IF I lead the ballistic shots any more they will miss. The same as if I lead them less. Are you saying seeing the shots hit on your screen doesn't mean you are hitting them?

[the Gingerbread Man]

l33tworks, on 09 December 2012 - 09:32 AM, said:

Are you saying seeing the shots hit on your screen doesn't mean you are hitting them?

Precisely.

[Wormrex]

And I think as a founder you should know how weapons hit/register.

4 med lasers amount to 20 dmg IF the full duration of ticks land.

AC20 damage had been confirmed to dissipate instead of pin point.

Gauss, well gauss blows up fast now.

Usually I play that steal kill assist dragon (only have 3 of these) whom help the big Fatlas soften up the enemy until they pop.

It really depends on your play style, some folks are twitchy and take to the liking of instant damage dump weapons, like gauss.

Me however, rely more on continuous fire weapons to pile up damage, partly due to latency issues.

So I suppose it is practice more and see you ingame!

[demoyn]

l33tworks, on 09 December 2012 - 09:27 AM, said:

do all I can from a distance with the LRMS

Found the problem. Stop wasting tonnage on LRMs. Fix the mech to fit your style. Also, if you have a ping over about 200 you're probably completely useless to your team.

[WhiteRabbit]

l33tworks, on 09 December 2012 - 09:32 AM, said:

I'm not really sure what you mean. The lasers are lined up to hit the enemy mech and require no leading. IF I lead the ballistic shots any more they will miss. The same as if I lead them less. Are you saying seeing the shots hit on your screen doesn't mean you are hitting them?

well what you see on your screen and what the real positions of the mechs (on the server) are isn't identical--> you have to compensate for the lag and shoot where your target is on the server

Edited by WhiteRabbit, 09 December 2012 - 09:34 AM.

[aspect]

If you are dead in 20 seconds in most matches, your problem is likely how you are moving during combat (imo). Stand still or move directly at the enemy, and you are just a huge target. Saying you are dead even faster in a light with a mediocre ping is even more confusing to me. I think you might want to try playing a few matches where you just try to avoid death as much as possible, and do damage as a secondary priority. The people who are putting down huge damage are the ones that live to the end of the match.

You should definitely be able to make some kills with LRMs though, esp if you have artemis installed.

This may sound weird, but perhaps you could download msi afterburner (or fraps), record a couple matches, and post them to youtube? Would let folks on here give you a more accurate critique.

[stjobe]

Make sure you press R so you can see target info. Try hitting them where their armour is lowest.
That little red triangle above the enemy? When it's filled, someone else on your team is targeting that enemy. Try shooting at the same target as someone else.
Taking fire? Twist your torso to the left or right to spread it out over CT/RT/LT. You'll last *much* longer doing that.

Other than that, I don't know. Kills don't matter much in this game anyway (winning matches is where it's at), but I'd think that in an Atlas you'd get more than one every three days.

[Smokeyjedi]

#1 you are in Australia, mayb your ping for connection to server is too slow to register those hits.......what is your typical ping per match? and if its 250 or higher, you are going to have to lead the target. by a fair bit at those high ping numbers.
THIS WILL MATTER ONLY ON MOVING TRGTS.

if most of this is happening on stationary targets you may want to look into weapon convergeance and ways to improve your focus'able weapons, with timing or crit slot location.

eg. When I use my founders atlas D, I would typically run 1 GR and 3 Large pulse lazers. an alpha strike after waiting the 1.5 seconds for weapon convergeance would come from L-arm(LPL) R-arm(LPL) CT(LPL) and RT(Gauss) of my mech thats 30ft spread. but having that land on a dragon shoulder where the arm and torso meet, will result in sugical removal of that arm, in usually less than 2 seconds flat. your top right hud display shows your locked®targets armour readout, pay close attention to this, that data readout will tell you where to focus your fire. if u lead properly should be able to correct your issue.

spraying an enemy Atlas for example with srm6-no artemis, could potentially have u stripping 300+ more armour off of it, to get to those internals, especially if the pilot is dodgey and making it tuff to CONCENTRATE fire on 1 specific location.
If you put 6ML in a hunchy 4P and run around shooting shoulders only(full beam duration as concentrated to 1 point as u can manage)then run away, youll not only remove limbs and have internals exposed for your team to bury shells/rounds/lazers/bombs.and missiles into.................
if your team is right behind you supporting you, you can bet someones gonna sink his battleship immediately following limb removal.........and your still alive to rinse/repeat with minimal damage.

Edited by Smokeyjedi, 09 December 2012 - 10:00 AM.

[Malkavios]

demoyn, on 09 December 2012 - 09:34 AM, said:

if you have a ping over about 200 you're probably completely useless to your team.

my ping is on average between 240-280 and i can get up to 4 kills a match so a ping over 200 should not be considered useless

[MahKraah]

they are hitting your gausscannon and it explodes -> killing your mech, thats why you die that fast.
replace the gauss with something more stable, in case of your bad ping may a lbx10(shotgun). shoot where your target will be in 1 second. lrm are a bad idear with ecm everywhere move them off . the weight you save you use to max your armor.
tonnage left over? ad heatsinks and upgrade the lasers to pulse, they shoot "shorter" means the dammage they do is more on target as it is delivered in a smaller timeframe, also they do 6 instead of 5. remember you WILL need more heatsinks.
i am playing just since 6 weeks, belive me it gets better.
about my fittingadvice, i am no atlas user/specialist, who ever is, feel free to correct me

[Broceratops]

keep at it! watch some streams of decent players, emulate someone who's play style meshes with yours.

[Roughneck45]

Broceratops, on 09 December 2012 - 09:54 AM, said:

keep at it! watch some streams of decent players, emulate someone who's play style meshes with yours.

This.

Find some teammates too. Sounds like you need some support in the focus fire department.

[Jack Corvus]

l33tworks, on 09 December 2012 - 09:32 AM, said:

I'm not really sure what you mean. The lasers are lined up to hit the enemy mech and require no leading.

It's been said before, but because this is a pretty big deal - yeah, they do. You have to compensate for the netcode troubles and your own latency. Laser shots need leading. Play like it's 1997 and you've got dial-up.

If you've been aiming dead on, it's not actually hitting where you think you're hitting, unless the enemy mech isn't moving.

[l33tworks]

Holy crap. Ok taking all this on board.

I have no ussual mech. I suck equally with them all.

[Flash Yoghurt]

Try to monitor your ping, with the high base ping you get from australia ECM will totally ruin it, making leading targest nearly impossible. We have the same problems from europe. Every ECM effecting you will increase your ping by ~50%.

[aspect]

l33tworks, on 09 December 2012 - 10:04 AM, said:

Holy crap. Ok taking all this on board.

I have no ussual mech. I suck equally with them all.

Would also like to add, your attitude is fantastic. I think most people who have similar experiences just come on here and post a rant thread about weapon balance, ECM, heatsinks, or whatever. Glad you are enjoying the game enough to keep playing despite your frustrations and very cool that you are openly looking for feedback.

[BigJim]

l33tworks, on 09 December 2012 - 10:04 AM, said:

Holy crap. Ok taking all this on board.

I have no ussual mech. I suck equally with them all.

Don't lose heart mate - The entire netcode is up for a re-write, but yeah, as others have said, you will need to lead your target for the time being.

To get into boring details, the hit-effects (the laser-beam, the sparks that fly off the target after a Gauss-strike, etc..) are all client-side effects.

But the actual "hit" is done server-side.

So take a fast mech, moving laterally across your vision, you may well have to lead that target by 1x or 2x mech-lengths in order to register a hit, maybe even 3x lengths if it's a Light mech.
Not just Lights either, I've had times where I need to lead Mediums like Hunchies and Centurions in order to hit.

Std lasers are great for "feeling out" where the lag-spot is on moving mechs, because you move the beam during it's burn-time in order to feel for that spot.
Sure, an AC20 is hard hitting, but if it misses it's wasted.



As some have also said, the crosshair will flash red for a second or two when a hit is registered, and this includes when you've successfully lag-shot someone by leading them.
This is how I normally assess how much I need to lead my targets.


I'd also second playing with a team - It doesn't even need to be a "full time" team, just jump on the community TS server (like the No Guts no Galaxy TS3) and jump into one of the many ad-hoc groups that form on there at all times of day, and you'll see a massive difference.

Edited by BigJim, 09 December 2012 - 10:15 AM.

[Wrayeth]

A couple things that you may or may not know:

First, hit detection is server-side, and thus there's a slight delay before your weapons actually fire. As such, you'll need to lead your target if he's moving laterally in relation to you. This applies even with lasers, though not by very much. Autocannons, gauss, and PPCs all require amount of target lead.

Second, don't judge if you're hitting by the graphics; they lie. Instead, watch your targeting reticule. If it turns red, you've hit your opponent.

Third, lasers are damage-over-time weapons. If you hit your target initially with the laser but don't keep it on target for the entire duration of the beam, you'll lose most of the damage. You need to keep the laser on target until the beam ends.

Fourth, there are two targeting reticules. The circle is for your arm weapons and the cross is for your torso weapons. The cross follows the circle, but can take time to catch up. If you're firing both arm and torso weapons, you'll want to wait until they're both in the same place. You can fire when they're not aligned, but you'll need to pay close attention to the location of the reticule for the weapons you're firing.

Fifth, group your weapons. Since ballistic/PPC/missile weapons don't hit instantly, keeping them in the same group as your lasers will generate a lot of misses. Instead, place your ballistics/PPCs/SRMs in a separate group from your lasers and fire by group.