19 replies to this topic

[Sybreed]

Before the devs started talking about ECM and how it would work, I was sure it would simply protect the mech that's using it. Because of that, I thought "well, this sounds perfect for scouts!". Nothing too OP about this, you have to rely on lasers and ballistics to take down that particular mech. Said mech can come and go without being detected. Fair enough.

Then I see how it's in-game, and I think PGI has overdone it this time. First, when I saw it would be a "bubble", I thought it would be an activated bubble that would last for 15 seconds then stop working, having a cooldown attached to it. Then, I saw this thing would be on all the time with no penalty except tonnage lost.

They wanted to make ECM so great, it's now a game changer for 1.5 ton. You rarely see LRMs now, and SSRMs are deadweight if your team got no ECM and the other does (although, I've seen my share of dumb teammates who couldn't use "counter" mode, therefore really not helping his team).

Of course, I don't even know how it worked in TT, so some might say "well they got it right", but if that's the case, we missed an opportunity to step away from TT a little!

[Ryvucz]

Good news is, we didn't get to see the "overpowered" version.

http://mwomercs.com/...0-into-the-lab/

'(>.<)'

[EnigmaNL]

Read: http://www.sarna.net...rdian_ECM_Suite

It was always supposed to cover 180m around the ECM equipped 'mech.

I don't understand all the fuss about ECM, I think it's just fine. It adds more tactics to the game and screws with SSRM and LRM boats which is fine by me. And no, I don't have any ECM equipped 'mechs so I'm not biased. I also use LRM's one some 'mechs (but don't boat them) and I can still fight even when ECM is messing with me.

[Corvus Antaka]

yeah and I was sure it would only double missile lock times, not make missiles useless.

Having lots of fun brawling though

[Invisibleone CZE]

And I think it should work on the bearer the same way, no missile lock of its own ssrm and lrm. By my opinion, ECM sould go only to non missile chasis. I run all variants of Jenner ane before ECM was introduced, I usually have not much troubles with streak commando. They were anoynig but beatable if i had one or two ssrm myself. But now, when i cant target him, it's practically unbeatable. So when equiped with ECM, all guided missiles shouldn't be allowed or direct fire only .
Thats my opinion.

[Zyllos]

Well, I would say that you are indeed correct, because what we have is GECM. It is to protect just the mech equipped with it.

AECM is used for the umbrella protection but providing none/little for the AECM mech.

[Sybreed]

EnigmaNL, on 10 December 2012 - 02:14 AM, said:

Read: http://www.sarna.net...rdian_ECM_Suite

It was always supposed to cover 180m around the ECM equipped 'mech.

I don't understand all the fuss about ECM, I think it's just fine. It adds more tactics to the game and screws with SSRM and LRM boats which is fine by me. And no, I don't have any ECM equipped 'mechs so I'm not biased. I also use LRM's one some 'mechs (but don't boat them) and I can still fight even when ECM is messing with me.

ECM didn't bother me until I've ran 4-5 matches in a row where my team had no ECM and the other team did. The huge tactical advantage it gives is phenomal for a 1.5 ton piece of equipment.

The other way PGI could fix this is by implementing battle value matchmaking and giving ECM a pretty huge battle value!

[StalaggtIKE]

PGI should revert ECM to original BT lore. It should work as the following:

Quote

180 meter range of interference of radar, infrared, ultraviolet, magscan and sonar sensors (guided weaponry, targeting computers, and communication systems)

Which means:

• All mechs should be able to be locked on by LRM/SSRM unless within the 180m ECM bubble.

The current ECM suite is working as the ECM/stealth armor combo. Stealth armor renders battle armor invisible to every active probe. Until PGI implements stealth armor, ECM should not cause any interference to anyone outside of 180 meters of the ECM equipped battlemech.





TL;DR - The current system is working as the ECM/stealth armor combo, thus it is broken and not working as it should.

[StalaggtIKE]

EnigmaNL, on 10 December 2012 - 02:14 AM, said:

Read: http://www.sarna.net...rdian_ECM_Suite

It was always supposed to cover 180m around the ECM equipped 'mech.

I don't understand all the fuss about ECM, I think it's just fine. It adds more tactics to the game and screws with SSRM and LRM boats which is fine by me. And no, I don't have any ECM equipped 'mechs so I'm not biased. I also use LRM's one some 'mechs (but don't boat them) and I can still fight even when ECM is messing with me.

Partially correct. There are no effects outside of the 180 meter range. So, LRM should be able to gain a lock just the same as prepatch. What we currently have implemented is the effects of the stealth armor/ECM combo. To continue with the current effect, stealth armor should be introduced.

Edited by StalaggtIKE, 10 December 2012 - 10:24 AM.

[Coolant]

ECM encourages team play and increases tactics...

I use Streak 2's and still get lock-ons in general ~70% of the time. If I wait a few seconds I can usually get a lock on 90% of the time. I did not switch over to SRM's and doing just fine. I don't mind not being under an ECM "Bubble". If the enemy can see me, good, that means I'll actually get into combat rather than hiding. My unit doesn't hide and cap most of the time, we want to improve our combat, so we engage the enemy. We don't all have ECM, often times no more than 2 of us. We switch out from Disrupt to Counter because there is now some strategy. But, ultimately, at least for me, it comes down to squaring off one on one with a mech going toe to toe and ECM doesn't impact that much.

Edited by Coolant, 10 December 2012 - 11:27 AM.

[StalaggtIKE]

Coolant, on 10 December 2012 - 11:26 AM, said:

ECM encourages team play and increases tactics...

I use Streak 2's and still get lock-ons in general ~70% of the time. If I wait a few seconds I can usually get a lock on 90% of the time. I did not switch over to SRM's and doing just fine. I don't mind not being under an ECM "Bubble". If the enemy can see me, good, that means I'll actually get into combat rather than hiding. My unit doesn't hide and cap most of the time, we want to improve our combat, so we engage the enemy. We don't all have ECM, often times no more than 2 of us. We switch out from Disrupt to Counter because there is now some strategy. But, ultimately, at least for me, it comes down to squaring off one on one with a mech going toe to toe and ECM doesn't impact that much.

Encourages teamwork? I beg to differ. Without any help I get the same results as you with my ECM equiped RVN-3L or AS7-D-DC. I carry dual SSRMs and able to get locks ~90% of the time. Team or not, I can play the same. The point is, it is always better to run with ECM, than not.

Edited by StalaggtIKE, 10 December 2012 - 01:03 PM.

[Corvus Antaka]

Coolant, on 10 December 2012 - 11:26 AM, said:

ECM encourages team play and increases tactics...

I use Streak 2's and still get lock-ons in general ~70% of the time. If I wait a few seconds I can usually get a lock on 90% of the time. I did not switch over to SRM's and doing just fine. I don't mind not being under an ECM "Bubble". If the enemy can see me, good, that means I'll actually get into combat rather than hiding. My unit doesn't hide and cap most of the time, we want to improve our combat, so we engage the enemy. We don't all have ECM, often times no more than 2 of us. We switch out from Disrupt to Counter because there is now some strategy. But, ultimately, at least for me, it comes down to squaring off one on one with a mech going toe to toe and ECM doesn't impact that much.

sorry but switching from disrupt to counter isnt strategy its "which team brought more ECM"

there was plenty of strategy pre-ecm. you had to be smart to get to the LRM boats, you had varied tactical options. now it's just ECM warrior online.

in fact for premades things have improved, because ECM has made it even harder for pugs to be involved in focusing fire or having any idea wtf is going on.

[luckyhobbit]

Maybe make current ecm effects self only, or the "umbrella" only slows missile-locks? Any tech that renders another weapon or mech variant next-to useless is completely over the top. I was getting as sick of lrm spam as the next man, and like the fact we now have more brawling, but are they really going to leave ecm as it is? It hasnt even reduced the amount of streak-mechs as the devs might have thought, when pugging if you want easy mode just use a commando with streaks, tag and ecm or a raven with similair set-up. I'm actually glad theres no patch today - at least the game wont get any worse...

[p4r4g0n]

@OP Had similar thoughts when I saw ECM announced and was prepared to defer making any judgement on it until sufficient time had passed for a fair evaluation. If the current evolution of game play is what PGI anticipated from their internal play testing, PGI clearly has a very different game in mind from what many of us have assumed.

Bottomline: ECM does too much for what it costs. It needs some balancing, either in what it does or in what it cost to run it.

I've also gotten tired of seeing people repeatedly saying ECM was meant as a counter to LRMs and SSRMs. I do not recall any such statement or announcement from PGI in this respect and in addition, it is a totally meaningless counter to SSRMs when you think about it.

Current streakcats use 2SSRMs and require more than 1 salvo for a kill. Good streakcat pilots are still doing a fair amount of damage even with ECM and once 6SSRMs come into play, doing quick hit & runs for 1 salvo kills will be the FoTM unless a truly EFFECTIVE change is made to stop boating.

As far as LRMs are concerned, I'll just repeat what I said elsewhere .... I have ask if you guys just started playing again after rage quitting when the bugged flight path came into play with the Artermis patch or you just have problems using AMS and finding cover.

Seriously? LRMs were that big a problem after they removed the bugged flight path that it had be nerfed almost to the point of non-existence? Where are the LRMs deterrents to movement in the open, the cautious probing for open avenues of advance through cover?


I'm looking forward to see what PGI does or says about ECM in its current iteration but IMO, anyone that thinks ECM mechs will not be FoTM until something changes is either part of a premade, a damn fine pilot or just plain delusional.

Edited by p4r4g0n, 11 December 2012 - 03:29 AM.

[Kmieciu]

ECM is so powerful right now that, given the choice, everyone would mount one on their mech.
1,5 tonnes 2 critical slots is the equivalent of an AMS with 1 tonne of ammo!

[USMC Iceman]

The only issue I have had using LRMs with ECM is were I don't have any one other than my self to TAG the targets. I see this in PUG 8 man and 4 man drops were the players are just out to have FUN and not much into team work or support play.

If you have artillery on the battle field and no one calls in targets or protects the artillery then they become ineffective very quick.

Cave rush any one? We don't need the 3 LRM units for support, let the lights wipe them out.

[maxx2504]

Hi !

It would be better to have ECM only on mechs who have this in canon. End of discussion.

[USMC Iceman]

Then should all Mech have to stick to the weapon and Armor load out from Canon? That would make this game so much fun. LOL.

[Twisted Power]

Coolant, on 10 December 2012 - 11:26 AM, said:

ECM encourages team play and increases tactics...

No it doesn't. It encourages different team play and different tactics. There is already team play and already tactics. When you drop as a group with or without ECM there is team play and tactics. So you are just wrong.

ECM is overpowered and does more then what it has ever done in any game. Adding it does not increase game play difficulty, just changes it by increasing the duration of a match and promotes defence.

My unit wins often with ECM and 8 mans and we agree it needs to be changed (not nerfed but changed). It does to much. The people who do like it only like it because people like being OP. Nothing against that I like to be OP somtimes too but I prefer to play a balanced game.

Edited by Twisted Power, 11 December 2012 - 08:18 AM.

[Mercules]

Still only does that because LRMs and SSRMs are implemented incorrectly They shouldn't require a "Sensor Lock" to achieve "Target Lock" for firing.