28 replies to this topic

[TheAquired]

Hi everyone,
I want to buy a new mech as soon as I have saved up enough. I am trying to decide between the K2 and X4. The idea is I want a ballistic or "gun" based mech. Both have advantages and dissadvantages, but having had no experience with either, I find it very difficult to choose. I would love some opinions from everyone here.

And we may as well throw in a dragon variant, I have no experience with any of those either. so what is a good way to go? I dont know if it would change anyone's opinion on what would work best, but unfortunatly I have a high ping.. (250ms)

Thanks!

[TruePoindexter]

TheAquired, on 11 December 2012 - 11:59 AM, said:

Hi everyone,
I want to buy a new mech as soon as I have saved up enough. I am trying to decide between the K2 and X4. The idea is I want a ballistic or "gun" based mech. Both have advantages and dissadvantages, but having had no experience with either, I find it very difficult to choose. I would love some opinions from everyone here.

And we may as well throw in a dragon variant, I have no experience with any of those either. so what is a good way to go? I dont know if it would change anyone's opinion on what would work best, but unfortunatly I have a high ping.. (250ms)

Thanks!

Depends on your play style. Also if you have a high ping you might want to favor energy weapons since they're easier to lag lead in which case neither of these mechs is really your best option.

[deforce]

i have both mastered and while similar they are diff. aiming from torsos is a lot diff from the fracts arms. since the last patch and they made gauss very fragile i would highly recommend going with the 4x because on the k-2 you will have a XL engine along with that gauss and if the gauss explodes your dead.

the 4x also can carry bring a slight bit more armor and a high heat eff.

[Vlad Ward]

The K2 is a bit sturdier with its guns being located closer to its center of mass. Its smaller horizontal profile is harder to hit from the front, and it has a significantly greater horizontal torso twist range.

On the other hand, the 4X has greater vertical mobility with its arm-mounted guns, and is capable of mounting 4 smaller ballistics (quad AC/5, 2x AC/5 + 2x UAC/5, etc) if you want to go that route. It's important to note, however, that its arms hang fairly low to the ground so it has trouble firing over vertical cover.

The make or break factor for some people is the fact that the K2 is capable of a much greater land speed than the 4X. Being a 65-ton chassis, it gets slightly more speed at an equivalent engine rating, and it has a much higher engine cap.

Pros and cons. In the end, pick whatever suits your style the most.

[Redshift2k5]

Honestly first you should make use of a trial mech with Ballistic weapons before purchasing a ballistic-centric mech. Get a feel for how you handle ballistics and their lag-dependant fire-delay.

After that, you'll need to figure out which ballistic you want to use and how many. Dual gauss? Four AC2s? Dual AC-20s? Quad AC5s? Triple Ultra/5s?

How fast do you want to go? The 4X can mount 4 ballistics but it's quite slow with a max of 59 while the other Cataphracts and all the Catapults have a max of 78.

[Dukarriope]

I find the K2 much better. I can't stand using my 4X and I regret buying it... but that's really probably just me.

I like the K2 more since I can build it into a zombie (and the use of torso-mounted weapons only avoids convergence issues), plus it's faster with a XL300, while not having the kind of risk associated with having huge side torsos on the 'phract. Plus armor on the Catapult isn't thin.

[One Medic Army]

I like ballistics, but I've been disappointed by the Cataphract 4x.
All the ballistic mounts are on the arms, which only have 9 slots each (not enough for an AC/20 or 2x UAC/5s). This restricts you to using only 2 of the large ballistics, or using multiple AC/2s or AC/5s.
The arms are fairly easy to target, and are both wide and low, making close-in targeting with them suffer.
It's secondary hardpoints are all space limited.
It's slow as heck.

The Cataphract 3D, 2X or Catapult K2 would be better choices in my opinion.
The hero cataphract looks pretty nice as well, but I haven't yet thrown over 5k MC at it to test it out.

[deforce]

Dukarriope, on 11 December 2012 - 12:07 PM, said:

I find the K2 much better. I can't stand using my 4X and I regret buying it... but that's really probably just me.

I like the K2 more since I can build it into a zombie (and the use of torso-mounted weapons only avoids convergence issues), plus it's faster with a XL300, while not having the kind of risk associated with having huge side torsos on the 'phract. Plus armor on the Catapult isn't thin.

K-2 with a XL300 what kind of weapons are you mounting on there???

also my ping is approx 200ms. its all about learning to play with your ping. everyone needs to lead ballistic shots when they aim, just need to learn your lag and compensate with a little more of a lead.

[Enigmos]

Vlad has it pretty well, but I would add that the engine variance between the K2 and 4x should be a key point to your decision.

The 4x should be fine as impressive fire support for the Atlas, since his speed is similar and he fits nicely in that role.

The K2 I think dies a little easier but is (potentially) much faster, very much like your Awesomes.

So which type of Assault do you see your play style fitting better? Slow, durable, extreme damage output, or more vulnerable, more nimble, and faster high damage output?

[Levi Porphyrogenitus]

K2 is a safe XL user, the 4X is not. That makes a huge difference if you're planning on using Gauss Rifles.

For most any other ballistic, though, you might well be better off with the Cataphract, since it has more hard points for boating the smaller guns.

AC10s and LB-10Xs are a bit of a toss-up, and you'd really want to base your decision on whether you prefer aiming with arms or torsos.

AC20 leaves no choice at all, you must go K2 (and you can't use an XL).

Personally, I'd base it on which ride I wanted to drive. I went 4X, since I like the Cataphract much more than the Catapult, so grabbing the 4X gets me to 3 variants (I already had the 1X and 2X). I'll be doing Catapults eventually, but they're pretty much my last priority.

[Dukarriope]

deforce, on 11 December 2012 - 12:10 PM, said:

K-2 with a XL300 what kind of weapons are you mounting on there???

also my ping is approx 200ms. its all about learning to play with your ping. everyone needs to lead ballistic shots when they aim, just need to learn your lag and compensate with a little more of a lead.

I have a ping of 250~320, and I can consistently do very well with my K2. And what am I carrying? Ballistics.

Take your pick, I've done well in all of the following (in order of how I tried them):
2x Gauss Rifle x70R, 1x small laser,
2x AC/10 x 05R, 2x medium lasers, AMS x1T
2x AC/2 x1,125R, 2x medium pulse lasers, AMS x2T
2x PPC, 2x AC/2 x150R, AMS x1T
2x LB-10X/AC x105R, 2x medium pulse lasers, AMS x1T

And yes, I can aim far ahead, yes I can lead.

[Ptom]

You want a "Gun Mech"? The X-4 hands down.

1. Mount 4 ac5's on it.
2. put them all in 1 firing group.
3. put that group on chainfire.
4. dakka dakka dakka dakka

[TheAquired]

thanks for all the replies everyone. I have a much better idea now, although its still unbelievably difficult to choose. I am leaning to the 4X, seeing as I have been using the trial cataphract this whole time, but the K2 intriuges me. I would liek to buy them both, but for now its which will serve me better. Still leaning towards 4X..

[TruePoindexter]

TheAquired, on 11 December 2012 - 12:55 PM, said:

thanks for all the replies everyone. I have a much better idea now, although its still unbelievably difficult to choose. I am leaning to the 4X, seeing as I have been using the trial cataphract this whole time, but the K2 intriuges me. I would liek to buy them both, but for now its which will serve me better. Still leaning towards 4X..

Well that can help us make a suggestion. What do you like on the trial 1X?

[TheAquired]

Well I like the Ac/10. I dont like the PPC much. I do have an issue with it's speed, but not much. I know the 4X has much better heat effeincy which is great. At the same time, I dont LOVE the arm mounted ballistic weapons on the cataphract. So its a tough call.I enjoy a brawl more than sniping though. I like the quad ac/5 idea. Hope this helps

(As you can no doubt see, I am very much conflicted)

[SpiralRazor]

Trust me when i say that the Arm mounts are infinently preferable to having them mounted on the torsos, particulary on maps with a lot of varying elevations(colony/caustic)

[Codejack]

I have both. It depends on which loadout you want.

4X is good for:

4xAC/2, 2xMLAS
4xAC/5, 2xMLAS
2xAC/5, 2xUAC/5, 2xMLAS
etc

K2 is good for:

2xAC/2, 2xERLLAS
2xAC/5, 4xLLAS
2xAC/20, 2xMLAS
2xAC/10, 4xMLAS
etc

Both are good for:

2xGauss

The Cataphract can load 4 ballistic weapons.

The Catapult can mount bigger and heavier weapons, overall; LLASs, PPCs, AC/20s, etc don't fit on the Cataphract. The Catapult is faster.

[Iron Tusk]

4X. It's the only mech you can unironically mount an ER Large Laser on. Also, think of the alternate load outs and play styles. The K2 gets you the AC/20 cat, and the UAC/5 + lasers build. The 4X has the AC/2 x4 fire suppression, Gaussaphract (with the aforementioned ER Large), the 4X AC/5 dakkadakka, the UAC/5 x2 AC/2 x2 dakkadakka plus, or the way to light on ammo UAC/5 x2 AC/5 x2 pub destroyer.

[TruePoindexter]

TheAquired, on 11 December 2012 - 01:04 PM, said:

Well I like the Ac/10. I dont like the PPC much. I do have an issue with it's speed, but not much. I know the 4X has much better heat effeincy which is great. At the same time, I dont LOVE the arm mounted ballistic weapons on the cataphract. So its a tough call.I enjoy a brawl more than sniping though. I like the quad ac/5 idea. Hope this helps

(As you can no doubt see, I am very much conflicted)

The heat efficiency from the 4X comes from its weapon loadout not really its heat sinks. Load it with 4 AC2 and you can get it to run really hot. Also if you're used to the 1X's speed you're going to be in for a shock as the 4X is very slow. Not just in running speed but in turning/twist speed as well. Replacing the engine the 4X to the largest you can fit still doesn't get you to the stock 1X/2X/3D performance.

Have you considered just getting a 1X or 2X and modifying it? I've seen some very effective builds with those and my concern is that the 4X and Catapult K2 are not what I would call new player friendly. They favor specialized builds that when used properly are very powerful but have some major weaknesses. Here's an example 1X that I've run in the past and had some success with.

CTF-1X: 1 AC20 5 ML

Spoiler

Chassis Name: Cataphract
Model Name: CTF-1X
Variant Name: 1 AC20 5 ML

Engine Cost: 1,200,000 C-Bills
Heat Sink Cost: 60,000 C-Bills
Armor Cost: 130,208 C-Bills
Weapons Cost: 1,000,000 C-Bills
Equipment Cost: 0 C-Bills
Ammo Cost: 50,015 C-Bills

Engine: 300 Standard Engine
Internal Type: Endo Steel Internals
Armor Type: Standard Armor
Heat Sinks: 15 (12) Double Heat Sinks

Tonnage: 70.00
Speed: 74.6 kph
Armor Total: 400
Alpha Strike Damage: 45.00
Alpha Strike Heat: 41.67%
Firepower: 12.09 dps
Heat Efficiency: 44.44%
Effective Range of Loadout: 270m

Head: 18/18
Right Torso: 44/60
Right Rear Torso: 16/60
Center Torso: 68/88
Center Rear Torso: 20/88
Left Torso: 44/60
Left Rear Torso: 16/60
Right Arm: 44/44
Left Arm: 44/44
Right Leg: 43/60
Left Leg: 43/60

Weapons Locations
Right Arm:
(2) Medium Laser
Left Arm:
Medium Laser
Right Torso:
Medium Laser
AC20
Left Torso:
Medium Laser

Heat Sink Locations
Left Torso: 3


Equipment Locations

Ammo Locations
Head:
AC20 Ammo
Right Leg:
(2) AC20 Ammo
Left Leg:
(2) AC20 Ammo

[Oinkage]

@OP

This is the only question that matters.

Do you want dual AC20?

If yes, then get a K2. If no, then get a 4X.

That is all.