14 replies to this topic

[geck0 icaza]

This isnt a rant on ECM itself. There's a thread for that and I'll leave it there.

I think there is an issue with the Atlas DC being the one having ECM. It already was the best variant to have as an Atlas and needed no boost to it. If you look at every chassis currently in game there is one maybe 2 variants that are note worthy but there is also the variant no one takes unless they need the XP for the other mechs.

Take the Cataphract for example:

3D - Jump Jets, 2 Ballistic hard points, 4 beam: solid mobile platform
2X - All types of hard points, great for an all around build with very high DPS potential
4X - 4 Ballistic points allows for heavy handed but slow designs
1X - a non- jump jet, with 1 less Ballistic hard point version of the 3D

In this comparison its obvious which of these variants needs additional value. The 1X would be best suited for ECM because it simply lacks the features to compete with the others.

Same thing can be done with the Atlas:

RS : Good hard points with multiple Missile hard points (unique design plus: 4 beams, all in arms)
D: Again, good hard points but in different ways. Additional Ballistic, and 2 beams in the CT.(though it doesn't allow for as good damage placement it allows you to retain weapons even without side torsos)
K: worse hard points with only 1 missile and 1 ballistic. Makes up for it by being able to carry 2 AMS (not really that much of a trade off but the effort is there)
DC: 3 missle hard points and 2 ballistic hard point. Be it SRM's, LRM's UAC 5's, Gauss, AC 20's this mech gives you the most flexibility and potential DPS.

In this comparison again its obvious which Atlas should have ECM. The K lacks the heavy hard points to carry as much DPS as its counter parts so its kind of easy to see it being able to carry ECM. The DC is IMO the wrong choice for this seeing how it already has a considerable advantage in the hard point department.

Go through all of the chassis and their variants and you will start seeing the same pattern. I just hope when more mechs are able to carry ECM we don't end up with a DC situation where there will very little variety because the strong variants just got stronger.

Thanks for reading and keep up the good work.

[Kibble]

I would have to agree with this. I would love to see a bit more variety of varients on the field. By putting ecm on the "less popular" varients will alow groups to use them as command mechs.

Edited by Kibble, 16 December 2012 - 05:52 PM.

[Straylight]

The question, though, is whether or not the addition of ECM capability is alone enough to take a 'mech from "inferior" to "must-have".

The answer seems to be a resounding 'yes' from Raven and Cicada pilots.

[Hysteria]

I really like the idea of each mech having one variant that carries ECM. Giving ECM to the less DPS optimal variants seems pretty logical as well because it gives them a real purpose other than to buy them just to unlock elite perks and then selling them.

[Abivard]

how but just dumping those variants and spend the resources on introducing new mech classes?

[Straylight]

Abivard, on 16 December 2012 - 09:20 PM, said:

how but just dumping those variants and spend the resources on introducing new mech classes?

Because one is flipping a switch (metaphorically speaking), and the other is a lot of time, effort, coffee, and rage.

[geck0 icaza]

Straylight, on 16 December 2012 - 06:12 PM, said:

The question, though, is whether or not the addition of ECM capability is alone enough to take a 'mech from "inferior" to "must-have".

The answer seems to be a resounding 'yes' from Raven and Cicada pilots.

The idea is to NOT have a mech be a must have but give every variant a reason for being chosen.

[Terror066]

In my opinion every Mech should be able to carry an ECM. That little Ravens are able to knock down an Atlas... Same chances to everyone. I don´t like these light mechs but there is no medium(except the Cicada which in my opinion is no medium) or heavy that could carry an ECM. These mechs are worthless right now because these fast little mechs that carry all the SSRM´s and ECM destroy a medium in a minute.
OK many of you may think that i have no skills in fighting blablabla. But there is no way for me to play with ECM because there´s no Chassis that could carry ECM that I like.

Greetings

[CoreHunter]

but then people will have to think about wether or not to run ECM and the devs aparently think that is B*&^%S*(&%^ and everyone should shut the *(&^# up and die to their new ECM Overlords.

p.s. Praise ECM....

[Tarriss Halcyon]

+1. Mostly because I'm sick of seeing Raven, and they've got a curse on 'em.

However, certain things (netcode, etc) must be fixed before I'd be happy to see Jenners with ECM. At all. As it is, it would be like a smaller Cicada with missiles. And potentially higher speed. And Jump Jets. Similarly, Spider would do the same, although Spider is also heavily underarmed, I think it's two laser hardpoints, and that's it.

In the way of Awesome, an -8M with ECM is possible, due to the -8Ma variant piloted by Adam Steiner. It packed ECM. Granted, they could make it a hero mech, so at least they're getting some extra cash inflow.

Dragons NEED ECM. Dragons are rare on the battlefield. I personally pilot one, but it barely competes with Catapult or Cataphract in numbers, even though in the right hands (like mine), it's incredibly lethal. And so on. I would NOT want to see any Catapult with ECM, however. The thing is almost overused as it is.

[Straylight]

geck0 icaza, on 16 December 2012 - 11:28 PM, said:

The idea is to NOT have a mech be a must have but give every variant a reason for being chosen.

Perfectly balanced games are like ROUS: I don't think they exist.

[geck0 icaza]

CoreHunter, on 16 December 2012 - 11:48 PM, said:

but then people will have to think about wether or not to run ECM and the devs aparently think that is B*&^%S*(&%^ and everyone should shut the *(&^# up and die to their new ECM Overlords.

p.s. Praise ECM....

Sarcasm or not a negative attitude doesn't help the situation or convince the devs to take this train of thought serious.

Straylight, on 17 December 2012 - 12:41 AM, said:

Perfectly balanced games are like ROUS: I don't think they exist.

They don't. But good ones constantly shift really really close to it.

[Corvus Antaka]

its actually a significant problem because the ECM has been put on the best chassis in terms of speed & hardpoints. The Commando choice in particular.

[RotS Targe]

I'd have to agree with the OP, the chassis that ECM are available on are not the best choices balance wise.
I would like seeing some more chassis get ECM, especially in the heavy range, and maybe a different Medium as well.

[Xenoid]

Just an idea, but I would much rather see ECM as a Master achievement like the extra module slot, something that any mech can get if that level of XP is reached. Or make it a module that has to be worked for and earned through XP as well as cash. In this way, every mech could potentially have ECM, but it would need to be worked at getting.

In TT (I know, TT hardly applies in MWO) any mech could get ECM (customized builds, etc.) so to limit it to just four mechs is counter to that. And if these 4 mechs enjoy the ECM advantage, than perhaps they should suffer some drawback. It's bad enough 3 out of that 4 already enjoy lag shields.