14 replies to this topic

[Destoroyah]

The main problem I have with ECM is that there are no real counters to fast ECM mechs. The Targeting band is so small it's almost impossible to get locking weapons on them.

The first preposal is to make BAP and the Sensor increase module add too the maximum range you can start targeting so with BAP and the sensor module if it could increase the targeting range to 400m this will give lock weapons more wiggle room.

The second proposal Make BAP if you get within 180m of the ECM mech reduce the ECM bubble size from 180m to 120m so a 30% decrease. They can argue that the BAP signal is so strong at succh close ranges it partially overpowers the ECM.

The third proposal make ECM and BAP require Electronic Warfare Hardpoints so some mechs will have to choose between one or the other and also will prevent mechs from always putting the EW equipment in safe low target priority areas like legs and will make mechs have to pssible juggle with there loadouts as they got to account for the EW's now.

The fourth final proposal since NARC is generally worthless. Now make NARC penetrate ECM for the targeted mech so for the duration of the NARC the enemy is effectively countered regardless of how far or near you are. Second Make NARC ammo track targets, We get only 6 freakin rounds per ton and a ton of SRM ammo can fit 100 missles. I'd think NARC ammo would be more advanced at that weight per round. I know Neither of these proposals are Canon but neither is the current supremely lackluster implementation of them as is.

[Wolf72]

good suggestions, I like the idea that NARC counters ECM.

[Codejack]

Why not just let BAP get lock within the ECM bubble (at increased lock-on time, ofc)?

I like the other suggestions, especially the EW hardpoints, although I would suggest that most lighter mechs, Ravens especially, get 2 of them since they SHOULD be mounting ECM and BAP. Not to mention that 3 tons is quite a bit on those chassis'.

NARC should work through ECM for everyone, though; as hard as it is to use and as heavy the ammo is, it ought to burn through ECM for its duration.

[SJ SCP Wolf]

Or you can just put tag on your mech and we can move on to crying about something else.

[ICEFANG13]

Working as intended apparently. I like the suggestions, but I doubt they'll listen.

Oh haha, TAG is the counter to ECM? Tell me more how powerful that is?

Edited by ICEFANG13, 21 December 2012 - 06:26 AM.

[EnigmaNL]

SJ SCP Wolf, on 21 December 2012 - 06:25 AM, said:

Or you can just put tag on your mech and we can move on to crying about something else.

Yeah, as soon as they make it so the TAG doesn't take up an energy hardpoint...

Or they need to make the ECM take an energy hardpoint to balance it out.

[Codejack]

If you can hit them with TAG, WTF DO YOU NEED THE MISSILES FOR?!

[Lupus Aurelius]

TAG is not a counter to ECM.

LOS, and has to be pinpointed on the target mech and held there for as long as it takes missiles to hit, requiring a weapon hardpoint and has to have a key permanently depressed to work, and is only effective on 1 mech at a time.

vs

AOE that runs 24/7, all you have to do is toggle between counter and disrupt, can be placed in any 2 crits and weights 1.5 tons, requires no targeting, and is effective on all mechs within the 180 m radius.

[Zyllos]

- Make 1 Counter ECM counter all Disrupt ECM in range. I personally think making 1 Counter ECM work against all Disrupt ECM a big one because then it isn't always about fielding more ECMs, but instead using your Disrupt ECM to scout and not run into another equipped ECM mech to be countered and open for locking weaponry. This also doesn't make the Atlas D-DC team (4+ ECMs) just invincible against lock-on weapons because your team didn't decide to take 5+ other ECM mechs. This is really a way to give a reason for a team to take mechs other than ECM but to take at least 1 ECM mech for disruption.

- Make ECM reduce sensor range by 50%, not 75%. ECM is ment for scouting, not keeping certain mechs locked out of firing. Even at 400m sensor range, LRM users will only have 220m worth of workable distance to lock on with missiles while SSRMs will only have 90m.

- Let the BAP display some indication that an ECM equipped mech is within normal sensor range (according to Sarna saying BAP is jammed by ECM but indication is notified). Maybe give BAP users "pings" (kinda like how Thermal Mode shows the ping sweep, which seems like to me PGI is already testing out) so they can spot where ECM mechs are physically at. Once teams start to only take 1 or 2 ECMs, having BAP which gives pings to physical locations could be used to detect where ECM mechs are located at so you could chase the ECM mechs and destroy them with direct fire weapons. Then you might see teams start to take no ECM and work together with BAP users to counter ECM.

- Any mech equipped with ECM, running in Disrupt mode, should not be able to lockon with LRMs/SSRMs. This provides a pro/con for having equipped ECM.

- As many have said, fix the issues with hit detection. This will really help out in the department of having light mechs survive a disproportional amount of fire according to their weight. But this is obvious, just extremely important and I am sure PGI is working on.

- Change NARC to provide non-LoS targetting for an extended period of time. Allow PPCs to destroy them on hit (or location destruction) and Disrupt ECM within 180m to stop the beacon while it is broadcasting.

Edited by Zyllos, 21 December 2012 - 07:13 AM.

[SJ SCP Wolf]

So basically you all want a crutch nerf to ECM so you can make configs without having to worry about ECM. Well that's bull. ECM is part of the game and building your ride without considering for it is a choice you make. If you get screwed in a pug with 7 other teammates who made that same "do not include ECM/take ECM capable ride" that's your problem. Deal with it in game with your guns.Coming to forums and asking for the devs to make it easier for you is embarrassing.

[ICEFANG13]

Ok so all weapons and everything in game has a disadvantage to it. What is ECM's?

[Magik0012]

SJ SCP Wolf, on 21 December 2012 - 08:53 AM, said:

So basically you all want a crutch nerf to ECM so you can make configs without having to worry about ECM. Well that's bull. ECM is part of the game and building your ride without considering for it is a choice you make. If you get screwed in a pug with 7 other teammates who made that same "do not include ECM/take ECM capable ride" that's your problem. Deal with it in game with your guns.Coming to forums and asking for the devs to make it easier for you is embarrassing.

No we want ECM to have some balance.

Maybe generate heat?
Take up a hard point?
A bit more weight?
Maybe 2 or 3 crit spaces?
etc.

It is a very powerful (and useful) system right now. And it should be.

But there are really no reasons NOT to take ECM right now if your mech can equip it. There should be some.

[Yokaiko]

Wolf72, on 21 December 2012 - 03:04 AM, said:

good suggestions, I like the idea that NARC counters ECM.

Every try to use a NARC? It has 8 shots per ton of ammo and is really REALLY slow in the air.

....for 8 seconds active.


If it lasted half of a match it "might" be worth it, right now it wouldn't last until you could get LRM on target, and god help the target hid behind a building.

[Capt Sternn]

I have been in over a thousand games and I would like to make a suggestion on ECM.

For Light/Scouts:

ECM is a very important piece of equipment for scouting. A month ago I was slaughtering scouts left and right with LRMs so there needs to be help so that scout can actually scout. ECM provides that. But in its Current form it is very OP. My sugeestion for 35 ton or lower is this.

Keep the weight/tons the same for the ECM but remove the Umbrella effect.
Streak missile systems on an ECM equiped Mech do not function while it is active mode but will in Jamming mode.
Allow all scouts to carry this version of equipment.

For medium, heavy, and Assault:

Include the Umbrella Protection out to 100m
Streak missile on an ECM equiped Mech do not function while it is active mode but will in Jamming.
Have the ECM equipment Cost 6-8 tons and several million C-bills.
Allow most if not all Mechs to have this.

What does this do for the game. It provides the cover scouts need to do their jobs without making 2 models the go-to Streak assassins they have become. It also allows larger mechs to have a significant team-oriented piece of equipment but at a large cost to their own damage output.

[Yokaiko]

Just reverse the effects.

Counter is the bubble and disrupt is nearest mech.

The scouts get to the keep the handy part for scouting and if you attack in a counter bubble, well sucks to be you. Lets face it this is a 1.5 ton, NON-targeted module.

That it has no draawbacks is a little nutz for what it does.