67 replies to this topic

[Hesketh Vernon Hesketh Prichard]

are people playing this game getting WORSE AND WORSE? They dont listen, they do whatever they want and dont understand that having a PLAN/TACTICS and sticking to them WORKS! I wish people would have faith.

I no longer will try and help now. Cant be bothered listen to peoples B$ after trying help them. And so begins the degradation.........

[Livewyr]

We all reach that conclusion at some point...

[WildeKarde]

If they make a mess of a game it's no loss but time. Taking a chance could net them more money though, but if people worked together then they could make more from a win.

Have to agree that some people not receptive to a plan, they think they know best when evidence disproves that. And we can all have bad games, get taken out by a well co-ordinated attack but should at least listen and be beaten by a better organised enemy and not our own mistakes.

Couple of times I've seen four mechs come out of the arch in the forest, shout to the team and to be the only mech actually turn back. Not until three of us had died did anyone acknowledge it. Everyone was alpha striking to get kills on the other mechs - we lost each game.

[Thirdstar]

It's actually GOOD news if you think about. A lot of players I'm seeing are new, this means that MWO isn't going to die. Are these new players unskilled? Yes. And there will always be new unskilled players, if MWO continues to remain healthy.

PUB herding takes patience, is a thankless job and will often simply fail outright. That's just how it is. I wish we had WoTs Tiers but we don't, hopefully the ELO matchmaking changes will simply put all the newbies together where again hopefully they'll learn something.

A lot of you MW vets forget that new players may not be familiar at all with the setting, let alone the mechanics. Not everyone's played all 4 MW games, both Mechcommader games, dabbled in TT or played MW:LL.

Edited by Thirdstar, 25 December 2012 - 01:20 PM.

[xxx WreckinBallRaj xxx]

It was getting better until Dec 4, when it then got much worse. The patch after that was good, but didn't try to fix any of the balance issues created by the patch before it, so it was basically a side step. I wouldn't mind another 2 week delay though, if I was actually ensured they were coming at all. But they probably aren't.

The things Piranha do make less and less sense as time goes on. Take this new Stalker for example. I pretty much know MW and this game inside and out(Excel sheets full of data), but I don't understand this at all. It's got 5 variants, but 2 have less weapons than the others, with apparently no gain from this sacrifice. So why play them at all? That's 2 variants you may as well "not have" in the game since 3 others are just flat out better. They don't even change hardpoint locations to try to appear differently like other variants. They just have a few removed. There's simply no reason to use those 2 at all. Then there's the 55 variant. The 55 is an exact copy of the 3F, except with a second AMS. What? It doesn't lose anything in return for gaining that? Look at the Atlas K, it had to drop 2 weapon hardpoints to get that. But not the Stalker? What? I even looked at engine sizes for each variant just to solve this puzzle. Does the 3H and 4N get bigger engines? Nope. They're all the same. So can someone that apparently understands this more than me, explain it to me? Why would you ever use a 3H or 4N? Hunchback has 5 variants too, but with that Mech, each one is actually different with tradeoffs to each one. 4G has gets 3 Ballistic. 4H is 1B, more E. 4J has the highest number of missile holes.(Medium LRM Carrier) 4P is the laserboat. 4SP is the SRM brawler with 2E per arm, 2 shoulders for extra survival, and a perfect 12 missile holes for SRMs.(This all makes the 4SP better at Streaks or SRMs than the 4J, while its better at LRMs) Get it? They're all different. But Stalkers? Why would you ever use a 3H or 4N?

Edited by Bluten, 25 December 2012 - 01:25 PM.

[Thirdstar]

Bluten, on 25 December 2012 - 01:21 PM, said:

...............snip

Sounds completely unrelated to what the OP was talking about. Maybe you should start a thread about that?

[Cuthbert Allgood]

Is the first time player factor just always overlooked when it comes to the playing issues. Sure some people are just bad at games, but consider the fact that all day long every day people all over the world are installing for the first time and do not have a clue, nor will they for some time. Not a defense for poor playing here just pointing out what always seems to be overlooked in posts like this or the "Damn Pug" posts

Not a Flame or a troll response, Just My 2 cents.

[Tarman]

I'm going to say it's you. By my lights I've seen a general improvement in gameplay and piloting. There are always rookies, and with the matcher STILL a ghetto hoopty you will continue to see people shooting the ground with their ungrouped weapons right next to a tricked-out Ilya 4-man; but usually most of the pilots in any given match are at least decent.

If you're running in a team usually and you're also pugging, then either stop pugging or suck it up and share your wisdom. If even one dude listens to your advice even if you lose the match, then you've left a seed of good piloting somewhere. It's not like every dude who straps in started playing during the Crescent Hawk era, they need guidance more than a salvo of LRMs. Being all elitist doesn't do you any good either as you turn into a pug despiser. Which is ultimately silly because recruits for units have to come from somewhere, and we need LESS community in-fighting, not more.

[Cuthbert Allgood]

Thirdstar, on 25 December 2012 - 01:18 PM, said:

It's actually GOOD news if you think about. A lot of players I'm seeing are new, this means that MWO isn't going to die. Are these new players unskilled? Yes. And there will always be new unskilled players, if MWO continues to remain healthy.

PUB herding takes patience, is a thankless job and will often simply fail outright. That's just how it is. I wish we had WoTs Tiers but we don't, hopefully the ELO matchmaking changes will simply put all the newbies together where again hopefully they'll learn something.

A lot of you MW vets forget that new players may not be familiar at all with the setting, let alone the mechanics. Not everyone's played all 4 MW games, both Mechcommader games, dabbled in TT or played MW:LL.

LOL this popped up while I was typing my response

[xxx WreckinBallRaj xxx]

Thirdstar, on 25 December 2012 - 01:26 PM, said:

Sounds completely unrelated to what the OP was talking about.

Point was that the things Piranha does now make no sense at all to the rest of us, even MW fans. It's like we're all too stupid to understand them, when it should make perfect sense. It's like watching a movie, seeing a character do something completely illogical or counter productive to their goal, then scratching your head and going "wha?".

[WildeKarde]

Bluten, on 25 December 2012 - 01:21 PM, said:

It was getting better until Dec 4, when it then got much worse. The patch after that was good, but didn't try to fix any of the balance issues created by the patch before it, so it was basically a side step. I wouldn't mind another 2 week delay though, if I was actually ensured they were coming at all. But they probably aren't.

The things Piranha do make less and less sense as time goes on. Take this new Stalker for example. I pretty much know MW and this game inside and out(Excel sheets full of data), but I don't understand this at all.

You can't use the mechs as a reason for players play. In TT you took one of these variants because it had the equipment or weapons you wanted to play. In MWO we get to redesign all the variants therefore we pick the best variants to suit our builds.

For example AS7K was always taken in TT to get a gauss atlas, not needed in MWO, but you paid a higher cost that using the AS7D in BV. Most other mechs were the same - guys coming in probably have the basics from the TT which is shooting ever weapon each 10 secs

New players don't have the knowledge of builds when players so they will alpha all three ER PPC's on an awesome all the time. The guys who play needs to ask, I've had players say they are new so I pointed out don't fire all the guns all the time in the awesome, stick in a group, etc and they lived through the battle.

Should the first question be on launching "are there any noobs here?"

Edited by Jake Hendricks, 25 December 2012 - 01:35 PM.

[Thirdstar]

Had a guy in a match just a while ago who literally pleaded for advice about how to actually hit anything (after he was dead), he was under the mistaken impression that lasers lock onto enemies. I had to calmly explain about energy, ballistic, missile weapons and lag while dodging fire and trying to nail a pesky metal babby.

[Farix]

Hesketh Vernon Hesketh Prichard, on 25 December 2012 - 01:03 PM, said:

are people playing this game getting WORSE AND WORSE? They dont listen, they do whatever they want and dont understand that having a PLAN/TACTICS and sticking to them WORKS! I wish people would have faith.

I no longer will try and help now. Cant be bothered listen to peoples B$ after trying help them. And so begins the degradation.........

A number of factors could explain this. The two that come to my mind are 1) we are seeing more new players coming into the game who isn't aware that teamwork is needed. 2) The new rewards system rewards combat and doing as much damage as possible instead using tactics to achieve the objective. In fact, if you attempt the latter, you get yelled at by the other players for "doing it wrong".

[Thirdstar]

Jake Hendricks, on 25 December 2012 - 01:33 PM, said:

snip............ guys coming in probably have the basics from the TT which is shooting ever weapon each 10 secs

Don't get me started on that. That one issue has such far reaching consequences that it boggles the mind how the current iteration of heat and rate of fire made it into the game.

[XphR]

You see your team stumble and you choose to push them down with the dead, as opposed to raise them back into combat? One does not stop or even reverse degradation by accepting or furthering its spread. You cant open veins and complain about lifeblood slipping away.

[WildeKarde]

Thirdstar, on 25 December 2012 - 01:37 PM, said:

Don't get me started on that. That one issue has such far reaching consequences that it boggles the mind how the current iteration of heat and rate of fire made it into the game.

Only mentioned in the context of someone knowing in TT they can fire all my guns each round for two extra heat per round, then wondering why they are overheating in about 10 secs when it doesn't happen in TT.

[RedDragon]

Just some minutes ago I decided to play some PUG games. It was a mistake. Gave up frustrated after 3 matches.
Bes example from today: One disconnect at launch, so it's 7vs8. Told my team to stay together and let the enemy come. What does our Stalker do? Rush in totally alone, getting killed in the first 2 minutes of the match.
It's no shame to play badly when you are new. But it's a shame to do stupid things and not even try to listen to your team mates.

[Tempered]

Maybe they don't listen because you're giving bad advice?

I can not tell you how many just plain terrible "Generals" that I've run into.

[Thirdstar]

RedDragon, on 25 December 2012 - 01:45 PM, said:

Just some minutes ago I decided to play some PUG games. It was a mistake. Gave up frustrated after 3 matches.
Bes example from today: One disconnect at launch, so it's 7vs8. Told my team to stay together and let the enemy come. What does our Stalker do? Rush in totally alone, getting killed in the first 2 minutes of the match.
It's no shame to play badly when you are new. But it's a shame to do stupid things and not even try to listen to your team mates.

Okay, I understand entirely where you're coming from. Heck i've raged at PuG groups doing stupid things myself, and I'm not proud of that. But attempt to see it from their point of view. They're entirely new to the game with no contact with other players in a non-combat setting, no community, no lobby chat, nothing. At that point your directions might as well be in Latin and they have no reason to take your word for it, it is the internet after all. So they go off and die, someone calls them an ***** for doing this. What's the human reaction to being insulted? ignore the attached advice.

[RedDragon]

Tempered, on 25 December 2012 - 01:48 PM, said:

Maybe they don't listen because you're giving bad advice?

I can not tell you how many just plain terrible "Generals" that I've run into.

The point is - most of the time it's better to follow even a "terrible general" than do you own thing. A PUG that doesn't stick together or at least forms 2 or 3 smaller groups is a dead PUG in 9 out of 10 cases. When you are following orders, no matter how bad they are, at least the team stays grouped and has a fair chance of beating the enemy.