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Don't sell me power. DON'T DO IT.


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#1 Sholto MacLeod

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Posted 07 November 2011 - 06:41 AM

Okay, I'm ecstatic that this game is getting made, I'm going to pay for content I don't need just so that it stays around, even though I'm not going to have much time to play it. So yeah, all you freeloaders can thank ol' Sholto over here for subsidizing your habit when he gets the chance. Hell, if it looks like it's hitting rough water, I'll buy more than one account.

I love what these guys are doing. The fact that it's mech combat sim and not mech arcade (So MechWarrior rather than HaloWarrior) is going to make me pretty happy.

The bottom line is, I love that something is happening. I'm going to give it a try. (On a similar note, Crimson Skies as an ACTUAL SIMULATOR like the yr 2000 video game in a persistent disunited states would ALSO be fun.)

Here comes the rub: Unless something changes, I'm not expecting to see another MechWarrior single or multi-player game that isn't 100% fanbuilt. This Free to Play stuff is probably seen as slumming it by the bEAstards over at EA, while indie game houses probably think it's a vile corruption of their artform.

The fact that it's being released at all makes me happy, and I hope it's the game that saves Free To Play, and turns it into a respected model (It's already viable, just not respected).

As much as I love these guys for bringing back my beloved MechWarrior, they're not working for a billion dollar charity. They're working for a business, and one that isn't very large.

As someone who's in the business world myself now, I can tell you, the bottom line rules all. It doesn't matter how awesome my ideas are, it doesn't matter how cool that thing I wanted but didn't have time for would have been, as one of the higher up muckity mucks, you have to have to have to think about your bottom line.

That turns us all into vicious uncaring jackals.

So the question I would have if I were one of their bosses is this:

"How's [INSERT PET ISSUE HERE] going to work with the system we've designed?"

I mean, look at MWO. Really, look at the business model. We're going to have large-scale warfare now. We've been doing that in leagues for years, and finally a game company said "Hey, they're conquering planets in MechWarrior. Let's build a game around that." The whole world of this game is designed around community, teamwork, and testing your teamwork against their teamwork.

I can't tell you how many times I and my lancemates were wiped out by some group of kids because we were all drinking and joking around while they were playing a game with military precision. Most of us have been playing since MW2. Those kids earned their kills against us by virtue of our years of experience with Mechs.

My point to that story is that the purpose of this game is integration. There's a word called Synergy that ***** businessmen use to describe the idea that every aspect of a business should help some other aspect of a business. Personally, I fire anyone who says "Synergy" in a meeting on the spot. It proves they've been getting business advice from Delta Skymall, and that's bad for business.

So here's my question for everyone who thinks this game might be ruined forever because their favorite thing might not be in it: how does your pet issue help people integrate with a community, grow it to a larger size, and encourage those people who have money to spend it on everything from useful stuff to monocles for your atlas?

I'm going to be honest, video games are not my business. Video Games are the mental health supplement that keeps me from beating that fratboy intern to death with my keyboard every time he says the word "dude."

So the folks in charge of this shindig probably know a little more about video games than I do, considering it's what they do and everything. My point is, whatever this game is, if they haven't been lying through their teeth about mechanics and such, it's good enough for me. I'm ready to settle. As the Republican Party will eventually be forced to nominate Mitt Romney because there literally is no one else who might stand a bishops chance in hades of beating Obama, this game, whatever it is, is likely the last hurrah of MechWarrior in the video game world.

Unless it's a giant ******* success. And I as a customer am going to do what I can to make it one.

Which means asking this: Don't give me power for dollars. Don't make it so that I and my drunk friends can beat those kids who have the time to drill military precision, just because I have some disposable income.

Because I'm going to drink beer and have fun. I'm going to get shot out of my 'mech because I was too busy pouring that second scotch to dodge.

I deserve to be.

But damned if that atlas I'm driving isn't going to look snazzy in a monocle and tophat.

And the main reason you shouldn't sell me power, is because I'll buy it. My favorite weapon in ModWar2 has always been the knife. 90% of my ModWar2 kills come from running up silently and aerating someone's giblets. I can do that when I'm drunk. It's a one-hit kill. Sure, sometimes I run past the guy and he blows my head off with a shotgun, but I always respawn and kill him again. What was my point? Oh, yeah.

If you sell me a super kill-o-death laser, or a special mod that gives my atlas a one hit knockout on any mech, so that I can strip off all the weapons and give myself an 80KPH pummel monster, and no one else has those things, you'll have a drunk republican murdering people who just don't have the money to compete.

And while that may be fine for the US Economy, it's no way to run a community you actually care about.

Edited by Sholto MacLeod, 07 November 2011 - 06:58 AM.


#2 Primarck

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Posted 07 November 2011 - 06:54 AM

View PostSholto MacLeod, on 07 November 2011 - 06:41 AM, said:

Okay, I'm ecstatic that this game is getting made, I'm going to pay for content I don't need just so that it stays around, even though I'm not going to have much time to play it. So yeah, all you freeloaders can thank ol' Sholto over here for subsidizing your habit when he gets the chance. Hell, if it looks like it's hitting rough water, I'll buy more than one account. I love what these guys are doing. The fact that it's mech combat sim and not mech arcade (So MechWarrior rather than HaloWarrior) is going to make me pretty happy. The bottom line is, I love that something is happening. I'm going to give it a try. (On a similar note, Crimson Skies as an ACTUAL SIMULATOR like the yr 2000 video game in a persistent disunited states would ALSO be fun.) Here comes the rub: Unless something changes, I'm not expecting to see another MechWarrior single or multi-player game that isn't 100% fanbuilt. This Free to Play stuff is probably seen as slumming it by the bEAstards over at EA, while indie game houses probably think it's a vile corruption of their artform. The fact that it's being released at all makes me happy, and I hope it's the game that saves Free To Play, and turns it into a respected model (It's already viable, just not respected). As much as I love these guys for bringing back my beloved MechWarrior, they're not working for a billion dollar charity. They're working for a business, and one that isn't very large. As someone who's in the business world myself now, I can tell you, the bottom line rules all. It doesn't matter how awesome my ideas are, it doesn't matter how cool that thing I wanted but didn't have time for would have been, as one of the higher up muckity mucks, you have to have to have to think about your bottom line. That turns us all into vicious uncaring jackals. So the question I would have if I were one of their bosses is this: "How's [INSERT PET ISSUE HERE] going to work with the system we've designed?" I mean, look at MWO. Really, look at the business model. We're going to have large-scale warfare now. We've been doing that in leagues for years, and finally a game company said "Hey, they're conquering planets in MechWarrior. Let's build a game around that." The whole world of this game is designed around community, teamwork, and testing your teamwork against their teamwork. I can't tell you how many times I and my lancemates were wiped out by some group of kids because we were all drinking and joking around while they were playing a game with military precision. Most of us have been playing since MW2. Those kids earned their kills against us by virtue of our years of experience with Mechs. My point to that story is that the purpose of this game is integration. There's a word called Synergy that ***** businessmen use to describe the idea that every aspect of a business should help some other aspect of a business. Personally, I fire anyone who says "Synergy" in a meeting on the spot. It proves they've been getting business advice from Delta Skymall, and that's bad for business. So here's my question for everyone who thinks this game might be ruined forever because their favorite thing might now be in it: how does your pet issue help people integrate with a community, grow it to a larger size, and encourage those people who have money to spend it on everything from useful stuff to monocles for your atlas? I'm going to be honest, video games are not my business. Video Games are the mental health supplement that keeps me from beating that fratboy intern to death with my keyboard every time he says the word "dude." So the folks in charge of this shindig probably know a little more about video games than I do, considering it's what they do and everything. My point is, whatever this game is, if they haven't been lying through their teeth about mechanics and such, it's good enough for me. I'm ready to settle. As the Republican Party will eventually be forced to nominate Mitt Romney because there literally is no one else who might stand a bishops chance in hades of beating Obama, this game, whatever it is, is likely the last hurrah of MechWarrior in the video game world. Unless it's a giant ******* success. And I as a customer am going to do what I can to make it one. Which means asking this: Don't give me power for dollars. Don't make it so that I and my drunk friends can beat those kids who have the time to drill military precision, just because I have some disposable income. Because I'm going to drink beer and have fun. I'm going to get shot out of my 'mech because I was too busy pouring that second scotch to dodge. I deserve to be. But damned if that atlas I'm driving isn't going to look snazzy in a monocle and tophat. And the main reason you shouldn't sell me power, is because I'll buy it. My favorite weapon in ModWar2 has always been the knife. 90% of my ModWar2 kills come from running up silently and aerating someone's giblets. I can do that when I'm drunk. It's a one-hit kill. Sure, sometimes I run past the guy and he blows my head off with a shotgun, but I always respawn and kill him again. What was my point? Oh, yeah. If you sell me a super kill-o-death laser, or a special mod that gives my atlas a one hit knockout on any mech, so that I can strip off all the weapons and give myself an 80KPH pummel monster, and no one else has those things, you'll have a drunk republican murdering people who just don't have the money to compete. And while that may be fine for the US Economy, it's no way to run a community you actually care about.



Excellent post sir....just excellent....


Clay

#3 Joseph Mallan

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Posted 07 November 2011 - 06:54 AM

Quote

Video Games are the mental health supplement that keeps me from beating that fratboy intern to death with my keyboard every time he says the word "dude."
Dude... I'm a 45 year old Machining Specialist for a car company who spent 3 years in California, You'd just waste your keyboard on me Dude. :D :D :)

#4 Lori Black Widow Carlyle

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Posted 07 November 2011 - 06:56 AM

@Devs: Listen well to that man!
@OP: I couldn't put it better than that. So I even will not try.

[EDIT] Oh, I forgot to include the publisher into @Devs.

Edited by Lori Black Widow Carlyle, 07 November 2011 - 06:58 AM.


#5 Radman

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Posted 07 November 2011 - 06:58 AM

LOL! Hilarious and ditto. Except for the drunk part as I don't drink alcohol :).

This is one of my concerns, that whatever the developers say, that I'm able to buy success. I know they say we won't be able to but they need to stick to it.

#6 Korbyn McColl

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Posted 07 November 2011 - 07:02 AM

Well said.

#7 Amarus Cameron

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Posted 07 November 2011 - 07:07 AM

View PostSholto MacLeod, on 07 November 2011 - 06:41 AM, said:

Which means asking this: Don't give me power for dollars. Don't make it so that I and my drunk friends can beat those kids who have the time to drill military precision, just because I have some disposable income.

Because I'm going to drink beer and have fun. I'm going to get shot out of my 'mech because I was too busy pouring that second scotch to dodge.

I deserve to be.

But damned if that atlas I'm driving isn't going to look snazzy in a monocle and tophat.

Very true, those with the best teamwork should always win regardless of if they are all piloting locusts or not.

...*burst out laughing*...Ok maybe not locusts, but you know what I mean.

#8 Skygrunt

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Posted 07 November 2011 - 07:10 AM

View PostAmarus Cameron, on 07 November 2011 - 07:07 AM, said:

Very true, those with the best teamwork should always win regardless of if they are all piloting locusts or not.

...*burst out laughing*...Ok maybe not locusts, but you know what I mean.



Well if they are piloting locusts they just have bad strategy.

#9 Korbyn McColl

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Posted 07 November 2011 - 07:11 AM

View PostAmarus Cameron, on 07 November 2011 - 07:07 AM, said:

Very true, those with the best teamwork should always win regardless of if they are all piloting locusts or not.

...*burst out laughing*...Ok maybe not locusts, but you know what I mean.


Oh, I don't know...I'm sure there are plenty of us with tales about how we took out "that newb in a Direwolf" with a Kitfox in NM95. =)

#10 Trooper Thorn

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Posted 07 November 2011 - 07:21 AM

All that has been said is on the mark, however, we need to support these guys that are bringing back our favorite title that is not a mod and made by the fan base. So open up those wallets and show in a practicle way that we will support this game/title. Free-to-play is great but these guys need to be able to feed their families and pay their bills the same as all of us.

#11 CoffiNail

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Posted 07 November 2011 - 07:22 AM

Yeah I played Stronghold Kingdoms for about 5 months from the day it started up. The first town I had was nothing but surrounded by players who paid their way to invicibility, then started tearing in to me. I had no funds to buy my way to success. I made a new place, got to save my research but the buildings had to all be done from scratch. That area was not AS bad for a month there were a few people in east north wales who were paying but it was not that bad. Next they open another section of the map for players and about a dozen people within a screens distance payed, joined up and even though i had an established city, with 3 smaller cities right near it, with in a few weeks they were crushing me like nothing. That ended the game for me right there, that someone could play for two weeks and then some payer shells out loads of cash and next thing i know he is crushing my armies, etc.

#12 Adridos

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Posted 07 November 2011 - 07:29 AM

View PostTrooper_Thorn, on 07 November 2011 - 07:21 AM, said:

All that has been said is on the mark, however, we need to support these guys that are bringing back our favorite title that is not a mod and made by the fan base. So open up those wallets and show in a practicle way that we will support this game/title. Free-to-play is great but these guys need to be able to feed their families and pay their bills the same as all of us.


That doesnt mean, they have to sell power. As they said, they understand, that you cannot have succesful F2P game while doing it. They are lucky, that most BT fans are above 30 years mark and have income strong enough to donate for the game they like, its not like its just about 12 years, who have to beg their parents tom get 2$ on "school" while they use it to be able to beat everybody and call them "dudes".

#13 Damien Matashy

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Posted 07 November 2011 - 08:00 AM

My name is Damien Matashy and this is my favorite post on the forums.

:)

#14 Amarus Cameron

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Posted 07 November 2011 - 08:03 AM

View Postdevil man, on 07 November 2011 - 07:11 AM, said:


Oh, I don't know...I'm sure there are plenty of us with tales about how we took out "that newb in a Direwolf" with a Kitfox in NM95. =)

Hey I can understand the Kitfox v Direwolf match up, but a locust is pure fail. Though I know some love it regardless.

#15 Hayden

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Posted 07 November 2011 - 08:06 AM

I said it before, I'll say it again. They can take my money. They can take all of my money.

#16 Trooper Thorn

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Posted 07 November 2011 - 08:13 AM

View Postadridos, on 07 November 2011 - 07:29 AM, said:


That doesnt mean, they have to sell power. As they said, they understand, that you cannot have succesful F2P game while doing it. They are lucky, that most BT fans are above 30 years mark and have income strong enough to donate for the game they like, its not like its just about 12 years, who have to beg their parents tom get 2$ on "school" while they use it to be able to beat everybody and call them "dudes".


I am not calling for pay to win for I have had quite enough of that in World of Tanks where wallet warriors hold sway. I am calling for us to support this game and those who have made it with our finances in other ways perhaps a monthly or yearly membership and some extra goodies but these that I talk about will not change a player's advantage. I am all for tech trees that let you improve your equipment and skill level by working your way through the tech trees not just buying "Gold" assets. Yes, I am over 50 and disabled thus being on a fixed income, however, I am willing to play the game I so dearly care about and make reasonable contributions for membership and add-on goodies that will not effect the outcome of the game. It must always be about the players skill, determination and dedication along with team play that carries the day in combat within this game.

Edited by Trooper_Thorn, 07 November 2011 - 08:16 AM.


#17 Rabbit

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Posted 07 November 2011 - 08:14 AM

It's usually the people with no money who scream at those who do.. It is also those who have too much time on their hands that get mad at those who do not, and would rather supplement their time with cash... My free time is very valuable to me, I consider it a treat to play games, much like hanging out at a pub, or going to a sporting event, spending time in front of a computer is a big deal for me. That being said, I do not want to work and play around for 30+ hours to unlock (insert shiny mech part), my time is much too valuable for that.. I would rather throw $10 or so to the game makers to get "it" than spend my precious free time doing such. There must be a balance struck between those who would rather spend their free time working on getting an item in a game, and those who would rather work in the real world who wish to spend some time in the game.

That being said... the line for C3's and Narc beacons starts behind me.

#18 T S Hawk

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Posted 07 November 2011 - 08:15 AM

Well I agree with what he said but for the most part I have always avoided Mulitplayer Online games. Nothing really has ever caught my fancy and even when I got MW4 I only played the single player campaign, yes I know a definite mistake on my part. And I see these games that look cool and are free to play as well but they don't strike my fancy. Yes I am going to buy a premium account for this if I can afford it well in 2012 I should be able too much better than I am now.

I have been a player of Battletech for a long time and MWO will be a nice outlet to have even more fun of the game I love so much.

#19 Mal

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Posted 07 November 2011 - 08:24 AM

Dude :)

I think we don't have enough information to start accusing the developers of going the P2W path.. they've said repeatedly that we won't be able to buy a Tactical advantage. I think we need to give them the opportunity to reveal more about the game to us, before we hit the panic button and have more threads about how we don't like P2W.

Edited by Mal, 07 November 2011 - 08:24 AM.


#20 CoffiNail

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Posted 07 November 2011 - 08:29 AM

We are in the second week of this site being online... They are not going to tell us everything off the bat. They need to drag it for a number of months and keep us coming back to learn more.

I would gladly put some money to support the development





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