10 replies to this topic

[DeM0nFiRe]

Hey, so I didn't really see a thread in the first few pages that talked about the differences between Mechwarrior 2 through 4, so I thought we could talk about that here.

First, I would like to start off by saying Mechwarrior 2 was definitely my favorite. In fact, the first PC game that I owned (you know, besides family shared games) was Mechwarrior 2. So let me go into the differences between some of the games as I perceived them. I am looking at Mechwarrior 2, Mechwarrior 3, and Mechwarrior 4: Mercenaries.

Mechwarrior 2, I think, was clearly the closest towards being a hard core sim of the 3. You had more control over jump jets, as was mentioned in another thread. You had things like Death From Above (I am not sure if those are in the other 2, but I could never do it. Not sure if that was just my failing ). Component based damage was a big thing, in my opinion. You could have your ammo or weapons hit in addition to the limbs they were on getting blown off. When one leg gets destroyed, you didn't die. You had to continue the fight on one leg (which may mean you are lying on your face and only have the extreme angles of torso twist with which to work).

Mechwarrior 3 was fun, but most of what made it fun was the stuff that probably won't apply to MWO. What Mechwarrior 3 had that 2 did not was more interesting characters. The story and maps you got to play for was fun. The ability to salvage from destroyed mechs was good. However, there were things I did not like about mechwarrior 3, and they all would affect MWO. Basically all of the things I listed above were removed, I guess to simplify the experience and make it friendlier to new players. Personally, I think this was a mistake. Now, the simplified the control scheme for 3, which isn't really a bad thing. It sounds like MWO will let you pick how simple your control scheme is which sounds like a great idea to me. The rest of the simplifications made, however, detracted from the overall experience of the game. I am not exactly sure how blowing up when one leg gets destroyed made the game easier for players to understand. Component based damage has got to make a return as well.

Mechwarrior 4, actually, was mostly pretty similar to 3 the way the gameplay mechanics worked so I don't think I have more to add for this one.

To summarize, I think we need the more simulation-style gameplay from Mechwarrior 2, and a choice of either simple controls ala 3 and more sim-like ala 2. Battlefield salvage ala 3 would be interesting to have as well, but I am not sure if that will work with the rest of MWO since we don't have many details on that yet.

What thoughts do you guys have?

[Lightfoot]

Well MechWarrior 4 had more realistic arms in terms of damage resistance. Why would you put a weapon in 'mech-arms if they got blown off with one shot, which is what happened in MW2 and MW3. If that was the case 'mechs wouldn't have arms at all.

As far as damage taken, it should be simulation-based as well as 'mech movement and that would equal MW New.

[Adridos]

A bit from every game would be the best. Take simulation and mech "feel" from the second, salvage and if there will be added campaign, then charcters from third, better parts of fourth with arenas, glue it together with todays graphics and the game should be good.

[minobu tetsuharu]

Personally I want a simulation game but I understand why other people love games with more simplistic controls like Mech Assault. THat's why I proposed the following the in the "Serious Discussion on How the Devs Should Genereate Money"

Free to play players get the sim game and p2p gain access to the arcade game in addition to the sim game.

With the sim game free players have to deal with more complex controls but this level of detail has a very high skill ceiling.

With the arcade game pay to play players have the option of dumbing down their controls. The benefit comes from certain advanced player skill actions are automated thus making the game feel more like an arcade instead of a simulator.


My hope is that this is balanced well enough that the average player in arcade mode is up to the level of the bottom 60% while the best arcade players can only hope to match the bottom 80% simulation control users.


Even if you can't be the best with these controls by their nature arcade controls offer a good way to play the game in a relaxed manner.


FYI I'm a big fan of Mechwarrior 2. Also the stuff you mentioned that was in MW3 was done a lot better in Mechwarrior 2 Mercenaries.

When you customized mechs the level of detail in your customization would vary much more than 3 and could be considerably longer.

In mercs you not only had a stable of mechwarriors but also aerospace pilots.

The rate of progression was far better tuned than MW 3 where all the way to the end you still were scrounging for money, spare parts and new talent to pilot your vehicles like most Mercs had to.

Also legging wasn't an automatic KO in MW2 like it was in MW3.

[Wraith 1]

Mechwarrior 2: Mercenaries had probably the best single player of any game I've ever played, if MWO is anything like it, I will be very happy.

[Cake Bandit]

I want the targeting system from 3. Torso turning and arm aiming were seperate things and it felt so good.

[Sam Slade]

minobu tetsuharu, on 05 November 2011 - 01:25 AM, said:

My hope is that this is balanced well enough that the average player in arcade mode is up to the level of the bottom 60% while the best arcade players can only hope to match the bottom 80% simulation control users.

Don't mean to be rude but this is a terrible idea. You're basically saying make the people who don't take it is super seriously as me cannon fodder; no one pays to be cannon fodder all the time. This will lose money.

Edited by Sam Slade, 14 November 2011 - 04:57 PM.

[Cronicus]

Wraith-1, on 08 November 2011 - 02:04 PM, said:

Mechwarrior 2: Mercenaries had probably the best single player of any game I've ever played, if MWO is anything like it, I will be very happy.

This is honestly what I WANT. Mechwarrior 2 mercs was the best game of the lot and should be the base model for MechWarrior Online MechWarrior 2 Mercs was boss and if I can find a copy that works to download onto my comp I would still be playing it.

MechWarrior 2 Mercs For Life!

[Hodo]

Mechwarrior 1 was the best. It was the most true to the tabletop game and closest to being a sim.

[Rendall]

I liked 4 the best. it had limited customization (simplified, yes, but made the mechs more honest for the most part to thier originally intended roles. For example, if the Longbow was in MW3, it could had been mounted with anything, such as AC's or been a major laser or PPC boat). the only thing I didnt really like much about 4 was long range missles didnt seem to do much, even when the mech didnt have LAMS mounted. sure, enough hits will kill a mech, but when one got hit by 4 LRM 20 launches at the same time, and only has a yellow center mass (granted, hits werent always in the same place) on a heavy or medium mech, I have to wonder at that balance of those.

[Rhinehart]

I have loved all the mechwarrior titles. Each one had something to offer. I'd like to address another specific part of what the Mech franchises have done so well:

The Opening Cinematic!

Beginning with MW2 each game has done very well with their opening cinematic movie. Who can forget such moments as "He's got a Lock on me, He's Got a Lock on me!"..."Kodiak Jag Base, Kodiak!"..."Look at it this way kid. You get to keep all the money."..."He's going critical! Ejecting!"..."Any recieving unit, this is Sigma Lead. I have contact with main enemy force inside the palace grounds. I'll delay them here as long as I can."..."Got a BIG problem on your hands? Hire a BIG solution."..."For some it was a time of great loss...for others a time of great opportunity."...

While MW4 Black Knight and Mercs had cinematics that were reworked in game footage rather than true cinema, the premise and presentation were still awesome.

The only major dissapointment had to be MW3 Pirate's Moon, which didn't include a cinematic.

The concept movie Piranha put out for this was very cool, but suited for a single player game set earlier than this one is now. For an online game and by the time MWO is ready for release I'm hoping for a much broader, cooler intro cinematic with some action from around the Inner Sphere. It's a high mark to beat but I'm sure they can do it.