49 replies to this topic

[Roland]

Ironbar Sinister, on 23 January 2013 - 09:08 AM, said:

LOL Roland.

I was 90% certain that no one would get the joke, and that folks would yell at me for it. Congrats on surprising me.

[Apoc1138]

Kensaisama, on 23 January 2013 - 09:10 AM, said:

I always find it amusing when people throw tantrums and expect to be taken seriously.

This +1

the people complaining about being "ignored" are the very people who have brought this upon themselves by being ranty little 3 year olds, every time PGI say something they get jumped all over, so it's easier for them to say nothing and just plod along with content and patch releases and let people make of them what they may

I've been in since before the founders program, and I don't feel ignored... would I like more updates and more content quicker? yes I would... do I feel the need to post massive long rant / ragequite threads and hurl insults about?

No.

Do I like the newer bigger more uncut version of QnA? YES!

Edited by Apoc1138, 23 January 2013 - 09:16 AM.

[Sifright]

Ironbar Sinister, on 23 January 2013 - 09:07 AM, said:

Where is anyone saying someone's being ignored?

You people are [REDACTED]-insane.

Or you are [redacted].

DHS,
Heat sinks vs Fire rate
Jump Jets listed as working as intended when they lift yout a foot of the ground and have you hover there when listed as 43 meters

Keep living in lala land you magnificent [REDACTED]

Edited by Dakkath, 23 January 2013 - 10:00 AM.
Cleaned up post

[King Arthur IV]

its oky, they have medicare over there. fixing hurt feeling since 1970

[CygnusX7]

lol. Gotta love the negativity (partly the inspiration for my sig).
Have to doubt the current state of the game is nothing like it will eventually be.

If I'm wrong, oh well... It's just a game.

Patience pays... 7 miles to passing zone.

Edited by CygnusX7, 23 January 2013 - 09:29 AM.

[Kell Draygo]

CygnusX7, on 23 January 2013 - 09:28 AM, said:

lol. Gotta love the negativity.
Have to doubt the current state of the game is nothing like it will eventually be.

If I'm wrong, oh well... It's just a game.

Patience pays... 7 miles to passing zone.

Many of us had been patience through all of closed Beta. We also thought that the state of the game in closed beta can only get better.

[Targor Avelany]

Kensaisama, on 23 January 2013 - 09:10 AM, said:

I always find it amusing when people throw tantrums and expect to be taken seriously.

+1

Don't misunderstand me - same as Apoc1138, I would like to see some changes and fixes, new content, maps, modes, mechs. But primarely fixes.
Yes, it is frustrating for me to see nothing really happening patch after patch. Are there some problems with communication? With promises? - possible, I honestly don't know as I haven't been in the closed beta, so I don't know how it was back than.

But it does not inspite me to act like a little spoiled child, who can only scream "YOU ALL BAD!! YOU DON"T LOVE ME!! I POOOED!".
There is an example of complete immaturity couple of posts above this. How are you expecting to be taken seriously again?

I also agree that "actions shows more then just words" - I have seen this in Eve-Online primarely, where devs were not listening to their players for a long time. And players made their statement. Many times. Burn jita... Mass titan DD to show how broken it is... there are countless examples. AND THEY ACTUALLY QUIT THE GAME WHEN THEY SAID THEY WOULD.

When you scream and rage about quitting or make promisses of any kind - only to go right back to the game or just forget the promisses right away: not a single NORMALLY and LOGICALLY THINKING person will continue to trust and believe what you are saying.

[BigJim]

I'm sorry OP, nice try to inject some rationalism but you can't use rational arguments with these people, because they are fundamentally irrational.

They're adults who purposefully act like children; They understand perfectly well what Bryan's post was talking about, but they choose to misinterpret it, so they can make clever sounding arguments on the forum.
Just like you and I would wilfully misunderstand our parents as young children to try and get our own way.

Just ignore them, they have no bearing on your life right now, and it's the easiest thing in the world to keep it that way.

Edited by BigJim, 23 January 2013 - 09:43 AM.

[Sifright]

BigJim, on 23 January 2013 - 09:41 AM, said:

I'm sorry OP, nice try to inject some rationalism but you can't use rational arguments with these people, because they are fundamentally irrational.

They're adults who purposefully act like children; They understand perfectly well what Bryan's post was talking about, but they choose to misinterpret it, so they can make clever sounding arguments on the forum.
Just like you and I would wilfully misunderstand our parents as young children to try and get our own way.

Just ignore them, they have no bearing on your life right now, and it's the easiest thing in the world to keep it that way.

ohhhhh , look at him all growed up and wearing the big pants

[PANZERBUNNY]

Ya, Paul even said JJ's would be getting worked over just after X-Mas and at least Mid Jan.

It's almost Feb now. DELAYED! WHO COULD HAVE GUESSED!

Changing the JJ numbers and parameters around is a gigantic task, I know.

BigJim, on 23 January 2013 - 09:41 AM, said:

I'm sorry OP, nice try to inject some rationalism but you can't use rational arguments with these people, because they are fundamentally irrational.

They're adults who purposefully act like children; They understand perfectly well what Bryan's post was talking about, but they choose to misinterpret it, so they can make clever sounding arguments on the forum.
Just like you and I would wilfully misunderstand our parents as young children to try and get our own way.

Just ignore them, they have no bearing on your life right now, and it's the easiest thing in the world to keep it that way.

You use a lore unit and it's insignia for your merc corp. Your opinion is invalid.

Edited by PANZERBUNNY, 23 January 2013 - 09:52 AM.

[Targor Avelany]

Sifright, on 23 January 2013 - 09:48 AM, said:

ohhhhh , look at him all growed up and wearing the big pants

were you not hugged enough when you were a kid?

[BerryChunks]

Ironbar Sinister, on 23 January 2013 - 08:16 AM, said:

I have seen a lot of "PGI doesn't care about me because I post a lot" type posts since the latest Ask the Devs answers were published.

What? Huh?

Please, let us read & analyze the WHOLE answer:



Now, let us analyze entire answer - without taking bits out of context & complaining about them:

The question is "Are you discouraged by outrage?"

The answer states:

1. It hurts.
2. It is amazing how nasty some people can be.
3. Some days we'd rather not even deal with it.
4. We suck it up and try to understand.
5. Many people who complain a lot also play a lot & spend lots of real money.
6. We have grown thicker skin toward the players who are very vocal and post a lot - they don't hurt us like they used to.
7. When we see feedback from a new poster, that really stands out to us because it's feedback from someone new.

I think that is a fair and factual analysis, with little to no interpretive spin on my part.

Now I ask you - where in the heck do you get "awww they don't care about me/us guys who are constantly here posting away!" ?

If you feel that way, I feel you're wrong.

Lol... you just said the point at #7. Like I said, if you want them to really look at something, you make a sock puppet account to complain so that they take it more seriously. That is exactly what they have said. Are you a mongoloid?

[BigJim]

Sifright, on 23 January 2013 - 09:48 AM, said:

ohhhhh , look at him all growed up and wearing the big pants

PANZERBUNNY, on 23 January 2013 - 09:51 AM, said:

You use a lore unit and it's insignia for your merc corp. Your opinion is invalid.

I'm sorry, too tired to argue with you; I was up into the early hours participating in my unit's RHoD drops, and then I had to go to work today, leaving me too knackered to get worked up over what you say.

So yes, I both wear the big pants, and yes as one of the regular players in the only competition worth a damn round here I think my opinion is entirely valid.

Enjoy your thread guys.

[BerryChunks]

Fenix0742, on 23 January 2013 - 08:40 AM, said:

It isn't "we ignore people who post a lot, and listen to those who post less frequently"
It's "When you say something is ruining the game and then play 8 hours a day, we think you might be exaggerating. However, the guy who makes one post saying 'the new player experience sucks, uninstalled' and then actually quits FOREVER makes us pay attention."

Actions speak louder than words here: if you're not satisfied, stop giving them money every week. Did you ever see any of those emails from the Star Wars Old Republic MMO, where an NPC was begging the player to come back? Revoking your patronage is your most powerful tool as a consumer. The Minimum Viable Product business model BANKS on your lack of willpower to walk away. You don't need MWO, but MWO needs you. If you just keep throwing a tantrum on the fourms, and keep feeding them quarters, of course they're going to dismiss your complaints. As they say, words are wind.

You can also imagine it another way. If you continue to play for whatever fun you get out of it, but never spend a dime, they're going to lose money through you consuming resources.

Quote

7. When we see feedback from a new poster, that really stands out to us because it's feedback from someone new.

Let's dissect this.

New poster + feedback = stands out to us.

by the same reasoning that MUST mean

Old poster + feedback = doesn't stand out.

[Joseph Mallan]

Frostiken, on 23 January 2013 - 09:03 AM, said:

Because it doesn't seem to occur to them that perhaps people with lots of posts turn into angry crankypants specifically because the devs ignore them.

I don't get angry with the DEVs cause I've done this before on a smaller scale.

Quote

I actually had high praise for these devs and their communication a long while back, in beta. That communication slowly dribbled off to nothing.

That is quite normal when things start to hectic/busy. I don't know many DEVs who actively participate on their game's forum.

Quote

Then we were facing massive game-breaking issues. Huge outrage about the Gaussapult. Huge outrage about PPCs, the Awesome, and Large Lasers. Huge outrage about guided missiles.

Usually knee jerk reactions to players not knowing how to defend against/properly use said issues. I'm one of the most prolific on the forum, I have said the Artemis 4 tragectory needed fixed. GaussPult was fine. We actually needed more Mechs that could carry more than one Gauss! Awesome... needed(needs) help. Never was a fan of the Large Laser when there was a PPC around. But I have an ER large on my Atlas instead of a ERPPC, Traded the damage for a bit better heat. The Crying on Streaks is due to US boating the system. The problem is how WE are using the weapon, not the weapon itself.

Quote

All of these issues still stand. There's been a couple of token tweaks here or there, but they came many, many months and many, many patches after the first complaints. There have been plenty of excellent ideas on how to fix these problems, and it's knowing that we'll never see any new dynamics to change things up) that hurts people the most.

Lasers are fine. PPCs need a little love yet, Streaks need to be left alone and players need to use them as a supplemental weapon as they have always been. ECM needs to be more like Guardian is on TT. And in a bit we should get Angel which will only dumb down Streaks.

Quote

What exactly is the holdup? If half a dozen people working for MWLL that aren't getting paid any money can release patches on a regular basis and actually implement new features like a HUD overhaul, what are the paid professionals doing? I must be missing something because unless IGP is a bureaucratic nightmare, what really stops the devs from working on something new and releasing it in a timely manner?

Publishers? Investors? Dirty sweat socks?

[MustrumRidcully]

Frostiken, on 23 January 2013 - 09:03 AM, said:

Because it doesn't seem to occur to them that perhaps people with lots of posts turn into angry crankypants specifically because the devs ignore them.

I actually had high praise for these devs and their communication a long while back, in beta. That communication slowly dribbled off to nothing.

Then we were facing massive game-breaking issues. Huge outrage about the Gaussapult. Huge outrage about PPCs, the Awesome, and Large Lasers. Huge outrage about guided missiles.

All of these issues still stand. There's been a couple of token tweaks here or there, but they came many, many months and many, many patches after the first complaints. There have been plenty of excellent ideas on how to fix these problems, and it's knowing that we'll never see any new dynamics to change things up) that hurts people the most.

What exactly is the holdup? If half a dozen people working for MWLL that aren't getting paid any money can release patches on a regular basis and actually implement new features like a HUD overhaul, what are the paid professionals doing? I must be missing something because unless IGP is a bureaucratic nightmare, what really stops the devs from working on something new and releasing it in a timely manner?

I don't like to sound bitter or angry. I love being enthusiastic about the game I play, and I love talking about positive things on the forums.

But I am just not content right now. And I think in part is that because of the way the Devs - or the Community Team - community. There are some that really stand out positively to me. Thomas Dziegielewski for example may not post often, but when he posts, he seems to have some quite insightful remarks that help me understand more about what is going on.
Unfortunately he's not the "Balance Guy", the guy that I really wish would tell us so much. From the balance topics, we get only marginal information, and it usually boils down to "I've cocked up some terrible build in my mind that could be broken, so I don't think we can fix all the other builds that are bad", and half the time it's only on reddit instead of here. Maybe there is actually a brilliant mind (or even more than one) behind saying this, that has a much better overview of the problem - but his comments certainly don't show this to me. And that has me worried and disappointed.

It could all just be a communication issue, and nothing actual substantial, but it has been going on so long that I tend to get strong doubts.

There are other type of complains I find laughable. For example, calling the dev team "lazy" is insulting and most likely far from the truth. My overall impression from all the game companies is that the people there work like crazy, hours I wouldn't accept for a "normal" job. But maybe games really are "anormal" so that it feels worth it. I just write photobook design software, that's a fun job, but I need my free time afterwards. If I was designing the next Baldur's Gate, I might not be concerned by a 50+h week.

[Fenix0742]

BerryChunks, on 23 January 2013 - 10:03 AM, said:

You can also imagine it another way. If you continue to play for whatever fun you get out of it, but never spend a dime, they're going to lose money through you consuming resources.

No. As this is a Free to Play game, they've already budgeted for free players, and the only resource you'd be consuming would be bandwidth, something they have enough of to cover peak load times. By playing, you're actually providing them with a resource: a warm body to fill out a team for paying customers looking for matches; in fact this is partly why F2P is so successful.

[Greyfyl]

Fenix0742, on 23 January 2013 - 08:40 AM, said:

It isn't "we ignore people who post a lot, and listen to those who post less frequently"
It's "When you say something is ruining the game and then play 8 hours a day, we think you might be exaggerating. However, the guy who makes one post saying 'the new player experience sucks, uninstalled' and then actually quits FOREVER makes us pay attention."

Actions speak louder than words here: if you're not satisfied, stop giving them money every week. Did you ever see any of those emails from the Star Wars Old Republic MMO, where an NPC was begging the player to come back? Revoking your patronage is your most powerful tool as a consumer. The Minimum Viable Product business model BANKS on your lack of willpower to walk away. You don't need MWO, but MWO needs you. If you just keep throwing a tantrum on the fourms, and keep feeding them quarters, of course they're going to dismiss your complaints. As they say, words are wind.

I agree 100% and haven't given them a dime since I paid my founders fee. I don't like their decisions, I don't like their attitude towards the playerbase, and quite frankly the game has huge issues that I don't see them being able to fix anytime soon because for whatever reason they are just not making progress anywhere except adding content that I can buy.

I would love to buy some paint jobs for my mechs that I know I will be keeping, but I'm not paying what I consider to be utterly ridiculous prices that they have set up now. Same for the hero mechs. I can buy 2 or 3 good games on Steam for what they want for hero mechs. Obviously people are paying these prices so I doubt they will come down. The question is, are there enough people paying these prices to keep the game afloat?

Edited by Greyfyl, 23 January 2013 - 10:44 AM.

[Dagger6T6]

I'm not taking things! how dare you accuse me of stealing... it was really uncalled for

[PANZERBUNNY]

The things the new people are complaining about, older players have been crusading against for months.