16 replies to this topic

[ElLocoMarko]

So, CTF-4X, standard 210 engine, double heat sinks, and Endo-Steel internals. Help please!

I want to minimize cost meaning I do not really want to pay for a biggger (or XL). I dislike the slowness (turning and twist - GAH!) and that isn't going to change much. Ideas?

(edit)
Thanks Gigastrike for the effective looking quad AC/2 build.
I imagine a dual Gauss sniper will get tried as well - I've never snipered but I do own a zoom module. PLay tips would be welcome.

Edited by ElLocoMarko, 21 January 2013 - 09:02 AM.

[MasterBLB]

Double AC10 brawler - STD engine 255 2xAC10+4t of ammo,2 medium lasers,1 ssrm2+1t of ammo,Endo Steel,DHS.

[Murku]

Or 250std, DHS, endo, AC10x2, SRM4 and either a LL or LPL. Snap fire the SRM, use the duration of the laser to find a location and converge, then dual AC strike, applying a little lead if required.

Edited by Murku, 21 January 2013 - 08:44 AM.

[Elizander]

ElLocoMarko, on 21 January 2013 - 08:25 AM, said:

So, CTF-4X, standard 210 engine, double heat sinks. Help please!

I want to minimize cost meaning I do not really want to pay for a biggger (or XL) engine and I do not really want to pay for endo. I dislike the slowness (turning and twist - GAH!) and that isn't going to change much. Ideas?

Quad AC/5s or quad AC/2s will do you good. You can chain fire the AC/5s for some fun time and just group fire the AC/2s. Those ACs are cheap and I don't think you need to upgrade anything else.

[Gigastrike]

4xAC/2s are cheap as heck. Here's a build that uses your engine: CTF-4X

If you don't want to upgrade to endosteel yet, you can take out the medium laser and a couple heat sinks.

Edited by Gigastrike, 21 January 2013 - 08:51 AM.

[ElLocoMarko]

I'm good for owning duplicates of most of the guns. I had a triple AC/2 dragon once

Gigastrike, on 21 January 2013 - 08:49 AM, said:

4xAC/2s are cheap as heck. Here's a build that uses your engine: CTF-4X

I tried this build and I have like half the ammo and heat sinks. How did you do that?
Ohh.... endo internals really turns the tables.

Yeah OK... I better get endo. I'll flip that up in my original post and give you credit.

I imagine I'll be trimming some (torso) ammo after I find out that I don't live long enough to do 1100 points of AC/2 damage (7ton * 75 shots * 2 damage). A good game for me in any mech is 600 points damage.
I wish the game would allow me to add some standard heat sinks in addition to the doubles. I'm low on crit space and high on heat.

Edited by ElLocoMarko, 21 January 2013 - 09:24 AM.

[Ryebear]

4xAC2 is always a hot build. I tend to find upping the engine size, while counter intuitive, sometimes saves you space in heatsinks and you can make the weight back with FF (you should already have endo).

4 AC5s on chain fire are preferable since they are never hot, you get decent ammo per tonne and 4 of them can be chain fired with no break.

[ElLocoMarko]

I will have to get Endo Steel. Most of these rely on the 6.5 tons it frees up (mostly for ammo)

Dual AC10 brawler: I like the detailed play style tips. Thank you.
Quad AC5: I didn't think it was possible without an XL Engine, but I see it now.
Quad AC2: Gotta try and see if I can core an atlas (side torso) before I overheat. First I have to find one that doesn't have a pain reflex.
Dual Gauss: It's a Gaussphract! It might teach me to aim better

[Ursh]

I've mastered the Flame, leveled up a Dragon 5N and 1C to do it.

Honestly, the Flame is the only dragon I really liked.

The cataphracts are more fun in their own little way, although I've only really messed around with the 2x and 1x.

[Wrenchfarm]

Not all that cheap, but THIS is how I currently run my 4X.

I love the punch of 2xAC10s and the truck load of ammo to back them up. Why bring an auto cannon boat if you're gonna click dry half way through the fight? The SRM4 pack lets you do increased damage up close and gives you a nice scatter weapon to help with lights (the bane of your existence.)

The machine guns are almost an aesthetic choice. I'm not going to tell you some fish tale that they actually do great damage or anything, they don't. But they do help you gauge a scout's lagsheild and are very satisfying to blast away with up close. Between the cannons, the SRMs and the guns, if nothing else you make a hell of a racket.

You could put some lasers in their place, but I don't like that. With the 250 engine and the super low heat weapons, this build doesn't need ANY heatsinks. You get to save that tonnage for weapons, ammo, and speed. I think even a pair of MLAS would probably pump up the heat to the point where you would need a few sinks.

Despite the goofiness, this build does work well for me. You have the capability to do tremendous damage with the equivalent of an AC20 hit, but with better range, reload, and ammo count.

[TexAce]

I would alter Wrenchfarms and go with this: CTF-4X

Edited by TexAss, 21 January 2013 - 03:25 PM.

[Limekiller]

Again, its not cheap, but I am a big fan of my current 4x build: CTF-4X

Yep! It's a Gaussaphract! rofl.

You could replace the SSRM2 with a SRM4 if you wanted, I think you'd just need to strip 16 pts of armor off.

[MasterBLB]

ElLocoMarko, on 21 January 2013 - 08:25 AM, said:

(...) I imagine a dual Gauss sniper will get tried as well - I've never snipered but I do own a zoom module. PLay tips would be welcome.

To be honest,sniping in MWO is not the same like in other games.You don't have good enough zoom to make headshots,and even if you hit someone with 2 gausses it won't kill him instantly.Besides,bullets fly so slow it's really hard to hit moving target.
But sure,long range guns are nice to hit distant,standing still targets,like LRM boats.

Instead, play rather as somelike 2nd-3rd line brawler at distance ~350-400 m away of brawl.Use your gausses to attack weakened by close combat brawlers parts of enemies,this way you'll dispose them quickly.

But you won't be able to afford gausspult quite a while,as it requires 255XL engine to have some speed.Not to mention that single gauss costs 600,000 cbills.

[Fuggles]

4 ac2s is cheap but you'll overheat without DHS which isnt cheap. I run with 15 DHS and 550 rounds in mine.

A cheaper alternative would be the 4x ac5s or some form ac10 build with mlas and streaks. I've tried all these and the most fun builds revolve around 4acs. The energy/missle hardpoints just suck in the 4x.

I found 2x uac5s 2x ac2s or 4x ac2s the best.

[ElLocoMarko]

I really liked the idea of center torso weapons of the 4X. In the CTF-1X, I finished many a game as a weaponless smoking center torso. The ability for this variant to pound down opponents and maintain fighting after full torso loss appealed to me.

But in trying all the loadouts above I discovered that its arm-aimed ballistics were just awful. And it isn't my first time with arm ballistics. I played all three non-hero Dragons quite well. But it seems like the invisible arm "catch-up" time was far slower. I suspect the "catch-up" speed is linked to max speed just like torso twist. Aiming ahead of a target and holding that aim while waiting for the invisible "catch-up" was intolerable and got my center torso shredded.

So, I sold it in order to go back to having fun and making money. It will be a long time before I have the C-Bill balance to buy a third phract, but in the meantime I have all my Dragons, the Ilya and a 1X to actually enjoy. If you aren't having fun, you must be doing it wrong!

[ElLocoMarko]

I get torso lag as it is nicely expressed by the torso aim point + versus the arm aim point 0.
But I feel like I was seeing arm lag with ballistics that I don't get with lasers. I aim way ahead of my target and half my shells hit the hill behind them.

Is this just convergence? I have to lead a nearby moving target by 2-3 body lengths and if they are in the wide open... my system calculates convergence far behind them and fires at such an open angle that half of my weapons cannot hit?

(That actually makes a lot of sense - and it sucks)

Just found this... Great... I sold a mech at signficant loss because the game engine was making me feel like I sucked.

Lord Jay, on 05 November 2012 - 03:17 PM, said:

This is a common misconception.


Convergence is when you fire from two points (like right and left arms) and the weapons adjust so that the rounds will hit the same point on your target at range. On WW2 era planes that had the weapons in both wings, the weapons would be set so that the rounds cross at 300-400 meters. This was fixed convergence and set the optimal firing distance.

In MW:O you can engage at various ranges so the weapons must converge dynamically. Pinpoint adjusts the time it takes for your guns to dynamically adjust to your targets distance so that all your shots hit the same point under the reticle.

Dynamic convergence happens fast in MW:O so it may seem instant but it is there.

Unfortunately since it uses the reticle, convergence is a bit broken for ballistics in MW:O. Because with ballistics you need to lead your shots you are not actually aiming at your target when you fire. So your guns set convergence range for the ground behind your target instead of what you actually want to hit.

Edited by ElLocoMarko, 23 January 2013 - 10:52 AM.

[Ryebear]

I like throwing a flamer in a CT slot to add to the overwhelming factor of 4 AC5s