40 replies to this topic

[Lt Zwicka Greengold]

This is a Beta !!!!.. there is no PRECISE roadmap inn a Beta. PGI has done a great job of keeping everybody informed but there are people who expect more.. WoOt, there is a difference between development beta serves that they use in house for building the programs and the "Beta" version of the game that we play. They are using us for lots of statistics gathering, crash reports and general feedback. If they thried to develop on the general public beta servers we would be down most of the time as they tried various things out and forced crashes to test data integrity and loading limits. This game is going to take several YEARS to develop so get used to it (or come back in 2016 or 17)

[locilocisu]

Lt Zwicka Greengold, on 29 January 2013 - 02:53 PM, said:

This is a Beta !!!!.. there is no PRECISE roadmap inn a Beta.

That's where you're terribly misinformed. Beta testing is generally understood by the software development community is where things are feature complete. Not bug free, but feature complete. And by feature complete, that means it has all the feature that the complete full release is intended to have. I doubt the current state is actually feature complete as we have seen the drafts and plans for Community warfare ages ago, and that was promised to be a feature.

http://www.codinghor...imes-gamma.html

So no, we're not playing a beta version of MWO, if anything it's almost an alpha. But hey, anyone can name anything they want without having to follow any convention. But if you're going to use terms like beta test and such, it only has meaning if your reader and yourself have the same understanding of what it is.

Edited by locilocisu, 29 January 2013 - 03:14 PM.

[Gremlich Johns]

Alaric the Arcane, on 23 January 2013 - 02:31 PM, said:

PGI ****** up again.

Not likely, with all of the game balancing needed, rather than put it out piecemeal and take the chance that NONE of it will work, it is prudent, while still development, to patch when they KNOW it will work.

Putting out something half-a$$ed or complete, which would you complain less about?

[Grugore]

locilocisu, on 29 January 2013 - 03:13 PM, said:

That's where you're terribly misinformed. Beta testing is generally understood by the software development community is where things are feature complete. Not bug free, but feature complete. And by feature complete, that means it has all the feature that the complete full release is intended to have. I doubt the current state is actually feature complete as we have seen the drafts and plans for Community warfare ages ago, and that was promised to be a feature.

I can play it and have fun doing it. That's good enough for me. Everything works, more or less, and it has all the FEATURES it needs to play the game. There will never be a full release, like you mentioned. By your definition, every MMO is still in beta since they are still adding features to them. This game will never be complete. Get used to it. It will evolve over the years; always different but still the game I love. Thank you, PGI. Keep up the good work.

[Thorstine]

@locilocisu- Did you read the "Release Candidate" section? "No feature development or enhancement of the software is undertaken". Ya, were not there yet now are we.

Edited by Thorstine, 29 January 2013 - 04:19 PM.

[Elder Thorn]

edit: nevermind - i should go to sleep

Edited by Elder Thorn, 29 January 2013 - 04:20 PM.

[SpiralRazor]

Grugore, on 29 January 2013 - 04:15 PM, said:

I can play it and have fun doing it. That's good enough for me. Everything works, more or less, and it has all the FEATURES it needs to play the game. There will never be a full release, like you mentioned. By your definition, every MMO is still in beta since they are still adding features to them. This game will never be complete. Get used to it. It will evolve over the years; always different but still the game I love. Thank you, PGI. Keep up the good work.

Grugore, on 29 January 2013 - 04:15 PM, said:

I can play it and have fun doing it. That's good enough for me. Everything works, more or less, and it has all the FEATURES it needs to play the game. There will never be a full release, like you mentioned. By your definition, every MMO is still in beta since they are still adding features to them. This game will never be complete. Get used to it. It will evolve over the years; always different but still the game I love. Thank you, PGI. Keep up the good work.

Mm...no....Only F2P titles have this weird permanent Beta status thing going on...and really, people only tolerate it because they are dumb and will fork money for a buggy mess of a product.

[Melcyna]

SpiralRazor, on 29 January 2013 - 08:01 PM, said:

Mm...no....Only F2P titles have this weird permanent Beta status thing going on...and really, people only tolerate it because they are dumb and will fork money for a buggy mess of a product.

He is correct however in that every MMO continuously add features in a step by step ongoing process...

for the obvious reason being that often they don't quite realize the need for it until the situation comes up.

This applies to every single MMO games in existence thus far.

Which is somewhat ironic because in some cases, some ppl ended up wanting the state of the game prior to the addition of the new feature.

or in a few extreme cases, MOST ppl want the state prior to it... like what happened to SWG and what killed it.

[D1G17AL]

SpiralRazor, on 29 January 2013 - 08:01 PM, said:

Mm...no....Only F2P titles have this weird permanent Beta status thing going on...and really, people only tolerate it because they are dumb and will fork money for a buggy mess of a product.

I can tell you've invested a lot of money into this game, or rather time, which is really not much of a difference in this day and age. You have over 2k posts, you must obviously care about this game. I don't think you should be so quick to call people dumb for forking over money for something that they want to see succeed.

[MEGABOT 5]

Stop being a bunch of whiny nerds and just enjoy this game.

If you're bored, spend 6 days a week at the gym so when May rolls around, you're fit as hell to show off you beach bod to the ******* at the beach with all the free time you have from not crying on the forums.

[Raze905]

Victory, on 24 January 2013 - 11:47 AM, said:

I dunno. Hearing the "all systems nominal", made the fanboy in me squee.

All I hear is "all systems.. NOMNOMNOM" haha makes me laugh everytime

[ConnorSinclair]

Alaric the Arcane, on 23 January 2013 - 02:31 PM, said:

PGI ****** up again.

PGI is to developing, as CSR is to fighting Connor ******* Sinclair

[Mercules]

Wo0t, on 29 January 2013 - 02:15 PM, said:

A little off topic but I just read a post of Bryan Ekman's from the link in an earlier post with this tidbit. I know this has been talked about SO MUCH, but are we not the beta testers? Why have separate "test servers"?

PGI needs to clearly state what stage this game is at and act accordingly. This game feels nothing like a beta. What are we testing for really? There is so much more to implement - it's almost more of a Alpha phase to me, on top of the fact that it is open or "live" to the public which is even more confusing?! Plus they're happily taking our money all along the way. Now don't get me wrong, crowd-funding can be extremely successful and MWO is a prime example, but someone in development clearly has to indicate what phase this game is at and actually treat it as such. Enough of this MWO with a beta logo while having no indication it is actually meant for open beta testing.

End of rant, thank you for your time reading my gibberish.

PGI clearly states where the game is at:

locilocisu, on 29 January 2013 - 03:13 PM, said:

That's where you're terribly misinformed. Beta testing is generally understood by the software development community is where things are feature complete. Not bug free, but feature complete. And by feature complete, that means it has all the feature that the complete full release is intended to have. I doubt the current state is actually feature complete as we have seen the drafts and plans for Community warfare ages ago, and that was promised to be a feature.

http://www.codinghor...imes-gamma.html

So no, we're not playing a beta version of MWO, if anything it's almost an alpha. But hey, anyone can name anything they want without having to follow any convention. But if you're going to use terms like beta test and such, it only has meaning if your reader and yourself have the same understanding of what it is.

You forget that an Open Beta is for testing the code with the public. That doesn't mean other features will not be added it means that it is USUALLY feature complete. If the Beta Test points out that there must be a way to say export data in a different form, that feature might just be added and a new Beta run with the updated version.

Also, none of the Alpha/Beta nomenclature is set in stone or defined, the industry sort of adopted it from earlier practices and uses the terms in different ways from company to company.

[Major Scumbag]

Wow I all see is complain, complain and more complaining. You guys need to calm down and give them a break. Fixing issues in software takes some time and they have weekly update. Most games have monthly patches. How about give them postive feedback instead. Just in the last couple months. We have seen ECM, Lagshield and improvements in the UI. I played WOW and they will take over a year to even address and issue. That is a monthly fee of 14.99 and still there is bugs that need to be fixed. Yes it does seem sometimes that we are getting the short end of the stick. But remember they are catering to thousands of different people that all have there own belief how it should be.Put the shoe on the other foot. How would you feel if you are working and trying to make a difference and all you get is grief. I am just glad I can play a mech game online.

[Vassago Rain]

It was a momentary madness!

[Iron Jim]

It seems pretty obvious to me that they're using (at least partly) Agile Software Development. Each two-week iteration adds a new feature or set of features to the product. Previously released features are considered "complete" though they may be refactored to take into account new features or to fix code smell. For people used to the old-fashioned "design-build-test-release-done" method, this can be confusing.

[Wo0t]

Mercules, on 30 January 2013 - 06:19 AM, said:

PGI clearly states where the game is at:

Clearly you cannot read. As I had said in my first post "Enough of this MWO with a beta logo while having no indication it is actually meant for open beta testing." So yes I can see there is a "Beta" Logo attached to the MWO title. It doesn't really mean anything to me - that was my point.

I understand when people say games that have been released continually add content and I agree this is a must! Perhaps it is all a matter of perception of what a "Beta" is these days. I'm used to the fact that with a closed beta they are still fixing a lot of issues and require a small group of testers to find other bugs and try new features implemented. Once the company is satisfied with a small sample group of testers and has the majority of key systems in place they open the beta up so they can stress test servers, test for larger bugs and get general feedback for any last minute changes. Usually, when an open beta is announced, the game is close to being released. Call me crazy but that is what I thought MWO was doing.

The landscape of online games has changed dramatically with the emergence of the F2P model. I love what MWO has done with this game so far and the potential is unreal. I continue to play on a daily basis and enjoy every game. I also think that MWO has been extremely successful with it's crowd funding model. However; to no longer have any wipes of game data, once you activate your premium time there is no turning back, having to pay close to $15-$25 for a hero mech all the while still dealing with an incomplete game in a "Beta" phase is a little confusing to me. And I have to ask, when the game is finally released what is going to happen to all the hard work and money spent on mechs? If you let everything carry over it will be extremely unbalanced for the people just starting the game, and if you don't that will be a signifcant loss to the Beta testers that invested so much. Something to think about.

Anyways, these are not complaints. These are observations made by someone who has bought into a game in many ways and would like to know a little more about their business plan. It should be shared with the people who continually dedicate themselves both with their time and money.

Edited by Wo0t, 31 January 2013 - 09:10 AM.

[Zagum]

I just paid WOT $100 for gold there and they keep adding content, not promised features. There is a difference. This game is Alpha at best.

[mekabuser]

hopefully theyre adding my idea of showing a screen shot of your mech as it looked after the battle, be it a smoldering wreck or standing without a scratch over a broken enemy.

[Mercules]

Wo0t, on 31 January 2013 - 09:07 AM, said:

Clearly you cannot read. As I had said in my first post "Enough of this MWO with a beta logo while having no indication it is actually meant for open beta testing." So yes I can see there is a "Beta" Logo attached to the MWO title. It doesn't really mean anything to me - that was my point.

No, I read that fine. However, you can't deny they let you know what they consider the state of the game to be with that one word on their logo." When the word vanishes you will know that PGI considered the game to no longer be in Beta. PGI has even gone a step further and told you what they consider the various stages to be on these very pages you are frequenting. So really any confusion as to the state of the game is your own and not PGI's fault. Countless times they have stated that when they feel the core features they want in the game are in they will go to Release instead of Beta. So.... this is Beta and it is clear now, right?