39 replies to this topic

[Firefly]

Aaaand apparently the word that starts with a "j" and rhymes with "turk" is censored.

[CaveMan]

Amro_One, on 05 November 2011 - 09:17 AM, said:

Really, why are people joining Mercs. and Factions before any sort of news of mechs or game play is released.
There is more Role playing in here then D&D.

You say that like it's a bad thing?

[Colaessus]

CaveMan, on 05 November 2011 - 09:32 AM, said:

You say that like it's a bad thing?

Your all going to complain when you find out the Devs did something game related and not Battletech universe related.

[Demongirl]

I'm not understanding your dislike of joining a faction...Could you please elaborate?

[Kumakichi]

Maelik Crowe, on 05 November 2011 - 04:16 AM, said:

What do you think the target player base needs to be for the game to be profitable? Can you squeeze them all into the existing Houses and Companies or Clans? I doubt it. Either the existing structure needs to become MUCH more flexible or we will have to be able to accept rising new Houses, Mercs and Clans not defined in the literature. It's just true. Everyone who plays will want to rise, everyone who starts high won't want to fall.

If it's formal challenge for position or allowing upstarts, something is going to have to give. Just my opinion

Point taken and its a valid point. I see a LOT of epeening going on in the house forums. I can appreciate that it must be intimidating to newcomers at some level. I had bad experiences back in 1991 when I first was introduced to the game. Even back then there were people displaying an elitists kind of attitude. I think this is a problem in the gaming community in general and not exclusive to the mechwarrior series. I've been seeing this for years in MMO's now. Some groups wont even give a newcomer have a chance. But I think newcomers just need to learn for themselves, just as we all did that when you run into that sort of situation its best to keep moving on (i.e. if you had your heart set on being in house steiner, not to pick on that house, and it was full of primidona's then look for a new house or merc unit to try and be a part of).

And being realistic about who the target crowd should be to make as large a profit as possible I think Microsoft had the right idea. You have to lure fraggers (quake, modern combat, battlefield 3, etc...) to come play MWO. While the mechwarrior community is loyal and passionate about the game it just doesn't compare in size to the fragging community. And as much as I disliked that MW4 could have easily been called MechQuake I also appreciate that the game has to be profitable in order to keep games like that to continue to be developed. Personally I'd rather see much more of a sim than fragger.

[Jack Gallows]

Amro_One, on 05 November 2011 - 09:17 AM, said:

Let the old farts have their moments of internet E-peen stroking.

Once this game starts the newer generation of gamers are going to wreck their 20 year old gaming group in seconds.
All they will have left will is their friends.

Really, why are people joining Mercs. and Factions before any sort of news of mechs or game play is released.
There is more Role playing in here then D&D.

U Mad Bro?

We're all just trying to have a good bit of fun, and this forum just helps concentrate a lot of people who haven't had a place to congregate in a long time for something they love.

I'm hoping that we can bring in all the new people too, and make one big healthy community regardless of age or familiarity with the franchise.

There's really no need to try to call people out or demean them for their enjoyment, so I hope that you find a better place on these forums and come to enjoy it as we do, without such disrespect.

Edited by Jack Gallows, 05 November 2011 - 10:06 AM.

[rollermint]

I won't fault anyone from trying to have their own bitsor space for fun within their own circle of friends and community. It will become a problem however if there are elitism (and you know for sure that some will do) towards other players not within their circle. It can be quite off putting.

Well personally I would actually favor them clamping down on canonical units and characters as NPC only. Problem solved.
Saves everyone from a lot of drama.

[Jack Gallows]

rollermint, on 05 November 2011 - 10:46 AM, said:

Well personally I would actually favor them clamping down on canonical units and characters as NPC only. Problem solved.
Saves everyone from a lot of drama.

It just seems like it's going to be a bit odd, with so many people registering canon names of people or units. Like...what if more then one person wants to run the Wolf's Dragoons? You KNOW it's going to happen.

[Firefly]

Jack Gallows, on 05 November 2011 - 10:49 AM, said:

It just seems like it's going to be a bit odd, with so many people registering canon names of people or units. Like...what if more then one person wants to run the Wolf's Dragoons? You KNOW it's going to happen.

I addressed this earlier. Typically in most games, the reality is that it becomes a case of first-come/first-serve. If Piranha Games takes the generally-unprecedented step of locking out all of the True Unit Designators for canon units, that will resolve the problem but it will also tick off a huge portion of the playerbase. I can see why such a move would be beneficial, for a variety of reasons: chief among them, the whole NPC issue where missions come down from on high or where the story-driven timeline and lore is concerned. The biggest issue that comes to mind is merc units called Clan Smoke Jaguar, for example, running around before the Clans even appear. Or where the self-appointed player leadership of House Davion, for example, decide to go invade the Tharkad planet despite the existence of the Federated Commonwealth, whilst the story-driven lore news releases say that the Federated Suns forces are actively fighting House Liao, even though both Laio and Davion players are actually ganging up on the Marik players.

[rollermint]

Jack Gallows, on 05 November 2011 - 10:49 AM, said:

It just seems like it's going to be a bit odd, with so many people registering canon names of people or units. Like...what if more then one person wants to run the Wolf's Dragoons? You KNOW it's going to happen.

Well...exactly. Its going to get a lil silly very fast to have multiple Wolf Dragggoons, Wulf Draguunz and all the other number of creative misspellings. All claiming to be the authentic Wolf's Dragoons. And what if the game already contain Wolf Dragoons as a NPC faction from the start?
Its simply the average fantasy Lagoliz, Aragoons and Gimi-a-lily all over again.

Why not just create a brand new company and character from scratch and achieve your own glories, craft your own legends and unit legacies instead of coat-tail riding on an existing famous units? I would actually think people would respect you a lot more for that. Its not exactly a bad deal if you ask me. We can already align our chars/companies to factions from the get go.

[Dihm]

You're all welcome to join the fight with the FRR, we don't have a huge "history" to worry about

[Jeremiah Rose2]

I hope that the developer creat a system of houseunits and named mercs. A player join this Units and will moved with them like in the story from planet to planet(unkown units can creat and moved). In war a lot of units will get crashed and the players need to search a new in the house or a merc. And if thery are promoted to higher lvl they can join the big named units like the sword of light or the Davion Guards.

And the same for the named mercs

but for new founded mercs it should like that they get contracts form the houses and fight in their names free like how pays best gets the unit.

[PewPew]

I don't think the game itself is going to make players put a lot of investment in their allegiance. 5 Houses and other groups is a LOT of built-in division in a community. Think about WoW with 2 factions.
What can factioning potentially affect?
- What side of the battle map you start on
- Amount of interaction with other factions
- Willingness to change factions, if joining a house is a commitment
- Availability of in-game options, like mechs, etc.
- Many more I haven't thought of

Now this worked in WoW with 2 factions, but a lot of it didn't matter since the world was HUGE, and each server had enough players that it didn't matter too much. MWO will have a MICROSCOPIC fraction of the amount of players, and dividing the playerbase 5 or more times is just unwise. A system that divides the community too much (one that many of the fans here want) IS, with little debate, going to hurt the community. Especially the new-player community, which is incredibly important to a game developer.

MechWarrior has an awesome premise. It has a huge appeal. I'm willing to bet a large number of the current fans now got into BattleTech because... well, because robots and lasers. If you look at the history of MechWarrior, however, the franchise has done quite poorly. Sure, a lot has to do with licensing foul-ups and poor marketing, but a lot of it is the community. You can't just say that newer, more casual players will simply adapt and create their own Mech Corps. People want to be part of the game, too. They want to experience the dynamic that is the 5 houses, the clan invasion, whatever, just like the way people wanted to feel an allegiance to the Alliance or Horde even without understanding the full story of the Warcraft universe. They just don't want to make it something that is obsessed over, as Mech fans often do. This kind of obsessing/nerd behavior is what scares new players away. DnD, MechWarrior, LotR, and plenty of nerdy interests are REALLY cool at first, but people are often turned off when they find out how dedicated you have to be to be a fan.

TL;DR Battletech contains a lot of depth. Fans are very dedicated to it. This kind of extreme obsession can be a turn off to newcomers, or more casual players. The game mechanics will more likely cater to a simpler crowd.

[Exilyth]

The fanatical belief that one has to choose and stick with one faction (and only one) has been dividing the fandom since 25 years. Never mind the clan/inner sphere/periphery divide, or the divide into different eras (pre/post star league/succession wars/clan invasion/civil war/jihad/republic), different game systems, e.t.c. ...

[Vaneshi SnowCrash]

Maelik Crowe, on 05 November 2011 - 04:16 AM, said:

What do you think the target player base needs to be for the game to be profitable? Can you squeeze them all into the existing Houses and Companies or Clans?

Perpetum was doing pretty well with 15k - 20k subscribers, EVE has turned a 3 man band in to a small multi-national on substantially less than a million active accounts. Star Trek: Online fell from 1 million+ to less than EVE and remained profitable as far as we know. So long as 20,000 people all pay £9.99 a month (in one form or another) I think MWO will be quite profitable.

A single house contains a multitude of planets, if every terraformed planet is Earth like and has Earths current population (7 Billion) then... I don't think there will be much of a problem with space.

[Maelik Crowe]

Having had the time to think about it, and I admit, my first post was reactionary, a lot of people have the same concern that I did and still do.

The devs have set up a system of 6 Houses, and then another for Mercs.

While I agree with the poster who had the first come/first serve rational, in some aspects I COMPLETELY disagree. It is, as another poster said, just a matter of time when given an open framework and claiming is naming that you will have multiple groups claiming House status under the same name.

I could go out and be the Founding Member of any historic merc group I wanted to, right now, and no one could say boo.

I'm not worried really, this is all beta chat, this is the kind of insane argument that makes people who makes games say, hey, ***. It's good in that it highlights a problem.

I still say that the dinos, the old school BTech people, and I was of you, are going to have to lighten up and let the game be fun. You might have held a cherished dream of one day being the Master of Draconis, but to the newbs, you're a bit of a prik,

Let this evolve, let the game be fun for everyone. Hell, we're fighting over factions, clans, units, and Houses before anyone other than the fish have seen code.

And if you get stuck in your 'We're the ONLY 'X' than you will end up eaten in the long run.

Please, be friendly to the newbs, it was my original post idea, please help make the game we all wanted and waited for happen.

Getting a hierarchy set up and labeling people Kings, Princes and Leaders is, IMHO, a bit rushed.

In the end, no matter how rabid or dedicated you are, remember this:

The game HAS to make money and to do so some feelings are gonna get hurt. I'm cool with that, I've waited as long as any to see this happen and I don't harbor any illusions that it will fall on strict historical lines. Fine.

In the great words of Demongirl, give me 'giant robots stomping around and wrecking stuff' and add the flavor of history, a reason to fight.

We are Alpha Bichfest, lets hash it out now so it wont be an issue later.

[Program 024]

Well said. I say we just have fun with the game when it comes out. In the mean time, we should just wait and see how things will develop. Although suggestions do have a place

[BarHaid]

Well said indeed!

[Jack Gallows]

I don't plan on being mean to anyone who is new to the game/lore, or who wants to be the 500th Phelan Kell/etc. In the end I'm in this to have as much fun as they are, and I know who's really who.

I also plan on probably making my own unit, so I can craft my own lore and histories without having to step on anyone's toes.

[Kyll Long]

Maelik Crowe, on 05 November 2011 - 08:28 PM, said:

Having had the time to think about it, and I admit, my first post was reactionary, a lot of people have the same concern that I did and still do.

The devs have set up a system of 6 Houses, and then another for Mercs.

While I agree with the poster who had the first come/first serve rational, in some aspects I COMPLETELY disagree. It is, as another poster said, just a matter of time when given an open framework and claiming is naming that you will have multiple groups claiming House status under the same name.

I could go out and be the Founding Member of any historic merc group I wanted to, right now, and no one could say boo.

I'm not worried really, this is all beta chat, this is the kind of insane argument that makes people who makes games say, hey, ***. It's good in that it highlights a problem.

I still say that the dinos, the old school BTech people, and I was of you, are going to have to lighten up and let the game be fun. You might have held a cherished dream of one day being the Master of Draconis, but to the newbs, you're a bit of a prik,

Let this evolve, let the game be fun for everyone. Hell, we're fighting over factions, clans, units, and Houses before anyone other than the fish have seen code.

And if you get stuck in your 'We're the ONLY 'X' than you will end up eaten in the long run.

Please, be friendly to the newbs, it was my original post idea, please help make the game we all wanted and waited for happen.

Getting a hierarchy set up and labeling people Kings, Princes and Leaders is, IMHO, a bit rushed.

In the end, no matter how rabid or dedicated you are, remember this:

The game HAS to make money and to do so some feelings are gonna get hurt. I'm cool with that, I've waited as long as any to see this happen and I don't harbor any illusions that it will fall on strict historical lines. Fine.

In the great words of Demongirl, give me 'giant robots stomping around and wrecking stuff' and add the flavor of history, a reason to fight.

We are Alpha Bichfest, lets hash it out now so it wont be an issue later.

Actually most of us have faced this in multiple versions. Whether from EGA to the 3025 EA vision or from ISWars to MWLL. Generally this community handles this well. Most everyone is friendly to newbies. The conflicts that sometimes arise are from people between versions say MW4 Leagues and MPBT or one of the Mechcommander based games and the shooters. They'll always be some conflict. Generally though were good about working them out. If ya notice a lot of the old timers are running retired or just claiming affiliation right now. Were patient we'll wait to see how things prove out and for those who want to be leaders they'll step up and prove themselves, but that goes for anyone out there. I don't know of any house where you can't have an important role if you show your up for it. As was said in another post BT is a big universe .