95 replies to this topic

[Itchypantz]

Mechwarrrior, I just want you to know. I started playing this game in May 2012 as a closed beta member. I was very happy for the priviledge. I played the heck out of MWO for months. I ground it out with several mechs to learn how they work and how the game is played and I became a pretty formidable MechWarrior. During this time I also made a whole whack of new friends! I found them on the Official Unofficial MWO Teamspeak server. We played together night after night, for hours on end. It was a blast! Of course, I did like our win percentage, which was around 95%. Yep, we played as an 8-man premade most of the time. And why not? We were playing a team-oriented game, as a team. We didn't always have 8 players. Sometimes we had 5 or 6 and sometimes even less. Our win percentage never really declined no matter how many we had, until we were 3 or 4, at which point, even our high skill level could not affect the outcome when the other 4 or 5 guys went out in single file, spread out over the battlefield, only to get knocked off one by one, followed by our group being swarmed and overrun by the enemy. This was not common, thank goodness, as I had made many friends and did not have to run less than 6 players per group very often.

The forums started to blow up with a bunch of crying about "Premades Pug-stomping". Eventually, MWO bowed to the lowest common denominator and broke up "premades". Now our once large group is small and fractured. Most of my friends have become nearly as disenfranchised as me. We can no longer play together. We try. We make two groups and attempt to "synch-drop" where both group leaders press LAUNCH at the same time. Sometimes we are lucky and get to play together, but mostly we are seperated. At least more often than not, we get to play AGAINST each other, but that is not what we came together to do. We came together to PLAY TOGETHER, as a TEAM, in a TEAM-ORIENTED game.

It really chaps me that MWO has come to this. Is it my fault that I made friends? Is it my fault that teamwork and tactics work? No. It is that type of game! It is a game where teamwork ALWAYS wins the day. Alas, teamwork was OP. Now, the game is lacking one major ingredient that I need in order to enjoy playing a video game: TEAMWORK. I do not play online to play alone against unknown individuals. I play online to play WITH OTHER PEOPLE AND TO SOCIALIZE WHILE DOING SO.

How could this game be fixed? How could the devs address the issue of an entirely pug side getting wasted by a premade side that is in constant communication with each other? Well, they could include voice comms for everyone. This is not an unfamiliar feature in online games. Actually, it is a very common feature in online games. Devs realize the importance of communication in building teamwork and community. Devs also realize that promoting teamwork and community are integral to promoting the continued success of their game! After much debate and stubbornness from MWO to NOT include voice comms, the devs gave us C3. It is a solution to the non-comms issue that was making things very hard for pugsides, just not a very good solution. No one uses C3. It is a very short-sighted and narrow-minded attempt at a solution.

Back at squre 1, with no real solution for the pug-stomping that teamwork and tactics create, the devs simply took teamwork out of the game. Now, of course, we can only drop as a group of 4 or less. There is the option of going out as a premade 8, but you will only be able to fight premade 8's. This limits competition greatly. It is not a very good solution either, as my friends tend to come and go over the few hours that I get to play. We will have 8, then two will go, then two will come, then 3 will go, then 1 will come and we our numbers flucuate. We do not get to drop as a premade 8 very often, even if we wanted to. Taking teamwork out of this team/clan oriented game is also very short-sighted and narrow-minded. It is not a solution either. It is just a parameter. Due to narrow parameters, pugs now get their wish: no organized teams or clans to play against.

I paid double what a regular game costs for a free-to-play game. Why? Because I was proud to be a Founder of such a great team-oriented game! Mech Warrior changed the rules on me after-the-fact and I am no longer interested in it. I thought MechWarrior was about CLANS. Clans are about having large numbers of people organized and able to provide teamwork; the teamwork required to create highly skilled matches. I have not seen any really close or skilled matches in a long time. That is because clans and groups of friends are now fragmented.

Thanx MechWarrior. You tried. I think you have an awesome game, it is just not all that it can be. It is much less. I have found other games that I like better and that promote teamwork. I will play MWO from time-to-time, as I do enjoy the company of the friends I did make, but the dumbing-down has really turned me off. No teamwork = No Itchypantz.

Chow for now.

ps.
Troll away, pugs. I might check back to see what you all have to say. I won't care, but it will be entertaining.

pps.
The loudest voices; the ones that have been appeased were only the few who spoke up. They were the ones who like to complain. The voices that do not like to complain don't get heard. I don't like to complain, so you have not heard me until now. Remember, it is the smallest percentage of players who actually read the forums and an even smaller percentage who type in them. It is an even smaller percentage who raise their voices when they do. It is the raised voices who got their way; a fraction of a fraction of a fraction of the total population.

[smokefield]

everyone is waiting for a real matchmaking.

take a break if you dont like it now...come back when they implemented it

[Adamski]

I wouldnt mind them adding a Battlefield style communication system, where you designate buttons for specific commands like "need assistance at [grid location]" or "enemy spotted at [grid location]" with the usual built in lockout for people that are spamming it.

[Ghogiel]

Um.. you want 2-8mans back in the PUG queue because you think that would be more competitive?

[BerryChunks]

noone disagrees with you. Do you understand the inequality of Premades with very well done setups stomping pugs?

The problem is lack of ability for people to choose their own lobbies and/or who they get matched with.

That problem could be fixed by PIG in the future. Wait it out and stop whining.

[GalaxyBluestar]

TL;DR

yeah understand the game you wanted to play isn't as filled with 8 mans anymore etc. i think you won too much and drove them to pugs.

come back in a whole bunch of months and check in to see if it's changed for you're liking. sorry for your loss.

[Brilig]

Community Warfare looks like it will fix most of your issues. Check out this post. http://mwomercs.com/...evs-30-answers/
It gives a pretty good picture of what is coming down the pipe. A lot of the issues you have are addressed in there.

We probably wont get away from having to drop with lone wolf players unless we have a full group of friends to play with. However it looks like we will be able to play with odd numbers of friends without leaving anyone out.

Changes are coming. What we have now is a partial fix to try and keep people happy. I have my own issues with it, but it works well enough to get me by. This year should see Community Warfare getting implemented in pieces. Hopefully we will have it all sooner rather than later.

[Fake Inception]

well thought out and polite post, just another drop in the torrent of complaints and unhappy players. Yeah check back, but in the meantime, lots of games that will better cater to your gaming itch.

[Ewigan]

How i read it is that you WANT your 8man back against PUGs, so you feel better?

Or did i miss something there? :S

[Chavette]

I hope one day you find the 8man party button. I also hope you get matches against us and get owned proper.

[Snowhawk]

smokefield, on 31 January 2013 - 12:40 AM, said:

everyone is waiting for a real matchmaking.

take a break if you dont like it now...come back when they implemented it

Well... thats right. But there is still the word "when" Maybe in 2 years pgi will be able to create a fair matchmaker...

[Vechs]

I normally don't dismiss feedback out of hand, so this is rare for me.

But yeah, you were stomping people using 8-mans VS pugs. I really think you just want your easymode back.

I play on the public TS almost exclusively, because I just don't PUG anymore. That said, I like being limited to 4-mans, and even then we usually roll the enemy team. I get to talk to other players and get my teamwork fix without feeling like it's complete cheese-mode.

And really, 4-man premade on TS is already a decent advantage -- 8-man VS pugs is just... wrong. I've done a few sync drops on TS with 4 mans before, and I find it distasteful. I'm honestly glad when the syncs fail and the other guys give up and go back to 4-mans.

There is nothing stopping you from being in the same TS channel with another 4-man and just chatting with them about your games if you want to be sociable and be with your friends.

[Blackfang]

Hey Itchy, maybe I've misunderstood your post but why don't you just create an 8 man group and drop against other 8 man groups? Surely that would 1) allow you to play with your friends in the manner you want and 2) will help you increase skill by playing against other coordinated teams. Would that not be better for you than trying to drop your 8 man team against PUGs?

Edited by Blackfang, 31 January 2013 - 01:16 AM.

[Thirdstar]

Itchypantz, on 31 January 2013 - 12:34 AM, said:

ps.
Troll away, pugs. I might check back to see what you all have to say. I won't care, but it will be entertaining.

Not going to troll you. Just going to sadly shake my head.

[Jock Blaine]

Itchypantz, on 31 January 2013 - 12:34 AM, said:

We try. We make two groups and attempt to "synch-drop" where both group leaders press LAUNCH at the same time.

The teams are limited to 4 people, if you agree with reasons behind it or not. That limit is one of the game rules. And you try to get around that by synch-dropping. Getting around the rules is cheating. So, in short your whine comes down to: You can't easily pug-stomp any more, so you try to cheat. On top of that, you are actually complaining about that your cheating doesn't always work.
Well, it explains why 8-vs-8 isn't a solution; you might actually have opposition.

[Xtrekker]

Yeah...

Quote

Of course, I did like our win percentage, which was around 95%. Yep, we played as an 8-man premade most of the time.

...and...

Quote

There is the option of going out as a premade 8, but you will only be able to fight premade 8's. This limits competition greatly.

So, you define "competition" as an organized 8-man team running a 95% win train on people who are still trying to figure out 1) how to play and 2) if they want to join this community? Then you seek sympathy as you whine about fairness interfering with your socializing?

Team dynamics come later. Now is about hashing out proper mechanics and building a player base.

Sorry sir, but I hope you find another game and leave this one to people who actually care about its future instead of infecting it with cancerous selfishness and poor sportsmanship.

[Fatarsemonkey]

I think I know what you mean, You like the feel you get when you raid like WoW and as a team you hone your skills. When I first heard there was going to be MWO I thought how good could this be, Imagine jumping into a planet that has trash mobs and bosses like a raid, battle grounds for those who like pvp, I thought it was going to be World of Mechwarrior but the game has turned out to be World of Tanks 2 and don't get me wrong it is a fine game but it could have been so much more.

[The Mech behind you]

If I didn't misunderstand your post you're unhappy with the situation that you can't easily stomp PUG groups with your 8-man premade anymore? And you quoted yourself that the PUGs should learn to organize and play as a group instead of QQ on the forums about the premades being OP?

Ok, if that happens and all the other players are organized who will your 8-man premade stomp then? How will you get a 95% winning rate if the other players are equal to your team? Something tells me you won't be happy with the ELO system because you have to fight players that are on your level and there won't be easy kills for you anymore.

Anyways maybe you should just wait for the ELO system and test it. Meanwhile you could do some (for you) more enjoyable things like burning ants with your magnifying glass

[One Medic Army]

I really have no sympathy for anyone who sync-drops 4+4mans rather than running 8mans. Either join the 8man queue, drop with 4, or drop 4+PUG vs 4+PUG sync if you really must have 8 people all chatting together in the same game and can't stand the 8man queue.

[Edustaja]

I'm perplexed.

I played in the public comstar TS during the up to 8-man vs pugs. It was not really a competition, more like stomping dead rabbits. 95% win-rate was standard across the board even with ad-hoc teams.

With the right 4-people you can still achieve a win rate of over 85 it's still the easy mode unless you come across another team. Synch-dropping two four man teams is just ******** and not worth the hassle.

The real game at the moment is in 8 man teams. You can win with most compositions, even though there are some that work a lot better. Good teams who work well together dominate as it should be. Scheduling common times with your friends to drop together works too. You just need a bit larger pool than eight to account for RL-issues. I'ts always a rush and you really need to work for the wins.

I'm not in the tournament teams but I've seen a lot of corps drop out due to not getting enough people to run at a certain time. Larger corps and dedicated teams can make things happen on a regular basis so watch out for those.

The clan meta is there you just need to man up and not expect to win all the time.