343 replies to this topic

[Vassago Rain]

JokerVictor, on 07 February 2013 - 09:41 AM, said:

Well that's great to say, any suggestions? Like, what was your team running at the time?

It was in the ghetto right now. We just closed and killed them. The only mechs of note on my side were my cat, a raven, and a trial cicada that stole all the kills.

[Ghogiel]

They sure can be fun to play.

I played a game an hour ago, I jumped, first shot of the game right into some poor guys head. Dropped him before he could even torso twist an inch.

Felt goodman.

[Source Control]

I usually just call in their position to the Drop Ship. A few moments of large explosions in the distances and a firey rain of death later, It's all over for them after that.

Or I like to build a large wooden badger and hide inside it while my lance mates offer me up as a gift.

[Dom Cobb]

Set up a firing line at the ridge along your base, and let them come to you.
Or get a spotter and LRM their ***** into the ground.

[MaddMaxx]

Greyfyl, on 07 February 2013 - 09:48 AM, said:

MW4 says hello. I would suggest PGI do something quickly, it should be VERY difficult to aim accurately while using jump jets. If this game devolves into the pop-tarting contests that were prevalent in MW4 I won't be hanging around much longer.

And yes, I saw this tactic being used by 'teams' for the first time last night as well.

Add in some ECM and jumping Spiders and things can get dicey real quick. Best advice is to find where they set up at then send a base harass, they will have to respond to that, then take advantage as best as possible.

P.S. Agreed, If the Pop Tarts do become prevalent, it will also spell my demise and I won't wait as long getting out this time, as I did, stupidly, the last...

Edited by MaddMaxx, 07 February 2013 - 10:21 AM.

[Praehotec8]

Make everyone use joysticks =D. If you can jumpjet, aim PPCs from range that quickly, precisely, and repeatedly, well....you deserve to win. I saw this tactic on frozen city, and while it's good I do think proper flanking spotters with LRM support ought to work well at removing these guys. Even with JJs, they aren't moving enough to get away from LRMs.

[Tice Daurus]

Apnu, on 07 February 2013 - 09:43 AM, said:

I saw them last night, didn't bother me. I did the same thing I did in MW4 with poptarts.

1) Battlefield awareness. Know where they are.

2) use cover to get close and put them down hard. Terrain is your friend.

^THIS. Sun-Tzu's Art of War says (and I'm probably paraphrasing it and getting the wording wrong) that a battle should not be fought on the enemy's terms. Always get the enemy to battle you on your terms, never the enemy's. The trick is to force them to come to you and stay hidden in cover as much as possible as you try to use the cover to approach and get closer to them to close the battle. Then getting close, use close range weaponry to take them down and focus fire on them.

Using these tactics will help you greatly.

[Livewyr]

Not as big a threat in this game.. since you can actually hit them.. and they can't aim nearly as well unless someone is spotting for them.
(No Perma Lagshield for everyone)
(No 3PV)
(No Active Radar to give constant red-box)

[verybad]

I've used UAC5 Catap's like this a bit. Havn't had time to play since the new patch because i'm busy in the week, but I look forward to having more options on the field.

[CarnifexMaximus]

I click a mouse button to shoot, I press space bar to hit the jjs. I don't really see what is wrong with pressing both buttons at the same time. JJs are far less powerful than in past MWs. I don't think this will be that big of a problem in the grand scheme of things. I had this discussion with a buddy last night. I simply fail to see why poptarting is cheap. One has to actually aim instead of waiting for a lock or close into 130m or 60m when I know my SRM garbage will always hit perfectly. Arm mounted ppcs are not exactly easy to hit with. Is there some kind of handbook on appropriate ways to use my JJs? Granted, I totally know what people mean about the sudden proliferation of gauss/PPC 3Ds. In one month from now there will likely be some other build that is the topic of controversy and discussion. Had one particularly frustrating match against a whole team doing this last night. I think the hill/ridge on frozen city brings out the worst in people.

[verybad]

Tice Daurus, on 07 February 2013 - 10:23 AM, said:

^THIS. Sun-Tzu's Art of War says (and I'm probably paraphrasing it and getting the wording wrong) that a battle should not be fought on the enemy's terms. Always get the enemy to battle you on your terms, never the enemy's. The trick is to force them to come to you and stay hidden in cover as much as possible as you try to use the cover to approach and get closer to them to close the battle. Then getting close, use close range weaponry to take them down and focus fire on them.

Using these tactics will help you greatly.

Approaching them under cover isn't battling them on their terms. Although this IS a good method of keeping them out of the best cover themselves.

Using cavalry to disrupt them while you approach with heavier mechs will also work.

[Bilbo]

CarnifexMaximus, on 07 February 2013 - 10:33 AM, said:

......Had one particularly frustrating match against a whole team doing this last night. I think the hill/ridge on frozen city brings out the worst in people.

That is why it is never a good idea to assault the ridge directly. There are two routes around it with ample cover.

[Kaboodle]

Was doing it on my 3D when it came out to great effect, no one whined then. Idk why it'd be any different now....

[verybad]

CarnifexMaximus, on 07 February 2013 - 10:33 AM, said:

I click a mouse button to shoot, I press space bar to hit the jjs. I don't really see what is wrong with pressing both buttons at the same time. JJs are far less powerful than in past MWs. I don't think this will be that big of a problem in the grand scheme of things. I had this discussion with a buddy last night. I simply fail to see why poptarting is cheap. One has to actually aim instead of waiting for a lock or close into 130m or 60m when I know my SRM garbage will always hit perfectly. Arm mounted ppcs are not exactly easy to hit with. Is there some kind of handbook on appropriate ways to use my JJs? Granted, I totally know what people mean about the sudden proliferation of gauss/PPC 3Ds. In one month from now there will likely be some other build that is the topic of controversy and discussion. Had one particularly frustrating match against a whole team doing this last night. I think the hill/ridge on frozen city brings out the worst in people.

It's not cheap. The people complaining about it are the same ones that were still complaining about legging in MW4 when it was not any more effective than other tactics.

There are a group of people that thing anything but CODing is cheap. Ignore them.

[Taemien]

Poptarting was an interesting tactic in MWLL. I say interesting because like any other tactic, it can be countered. Typically what was done was getting a Raven or other Narc capable mech behind them, narc and watch the missiles destroy them behind their cover.

Narcs work a little differently in MWO and probably aren't needed. Get an ECM mech behind them. Don't even have the ECM mech fire at them, just close enough to target them (so they aren't detected by the poptarters). And have the LRMs come down.

[Bilbo]

Kaboodle, on 07 February 2013 - 10:37 AM, said:

Was doing it on my 3D when it came out to great effect, no one whined then. Idk why it'd be any different now....

There are more of them now because of the change to both JJ's and PPCs. I don't expect to see them in such force going forward. Like all the shiny new builds they'll be used less often when the next thing is found.

[JokerVictor]

CarnifexMaximus, on 07 February 2013 - 10:33 AM, said:

I click a mouse button to shoot, I press space bar to hit the jjs. I don't really see what is wrong with pressing both buttons at the same time. JJs are far less powerful than in past MWs. I don't think this will be that big of a problem in the grand scheme of things. I had this discussion with a buddy last night. I simply fail to see why poptarting is cheap. One has to actually aim instead of waiting for a lock or close into 130m or 60m when I know my SRM garbage will always hit perfectly. Arm mounted ppcs are not exactly easy to hit with. Is there some kind of handbook on appropriate ways to use my JJs? Granted, I totally know what people mean about the sudden proliferation of gauss/PPC 3Ds. In one month from now there will likely be some other build that is the topic of controversy and discussion. Had one particularly frustrating match against a whole team doing this last night. I think the hill/ridge on frozen city brings out the worst in people.

Oh hi there Carnifex, you were on my team last night... on frozen city. Yes, we got murdered. Again, this isn't about whether this is cheap or not. I just wanted to know what strategies work to counter it.

We clearly went about that in entirely the wrong way. We tried to suppress them, and failed horribly. We should have either gone through the cave or tried to maneuver out to the far right to spread the fire out. Instead we sat there and died. Lesson learned.

[TrickyGilligan]

Ran into this in 8 mans the other night. Group of 3 -3Ds all with the ERPPC/Gauss/JJ build. We were in mostly fast close range mechs, and took quite a bit of damage on the approach. We thought once we were in close we had it, but that wasn't the case at all. Gotta give props to the other team, they spread out and used their JJs to great effect, making many of our close range weapons worthless. We took a few of them with us as we went down, but overall it went pretty poorly.

Next drop, we're up against the same team. This time we decided not to play their game and just fought our way directly towards their cap. Once we were in the cap zone they were forced to come brawl with us, and we managed to (barely) win the ensuing melee.

So, I think the best tactic is to go around. Charging at them certainly didn't work. If they're all the way back camping their base I can see that being a problem, but thankfully the cover around the bases generally isn't that great.

[Nicholas Carlyle]

I think I ran into a group of Goons doing this while I was trying to earn exp on my new Cata IX.

It is seriously brutally effective against PUGs. I forsee a lot of threads about this, because most of the maps are perfectly set up for it's use.

I don't think it's impossible to overcome, but it will definitely require coordination.

[MischiefSC]

You really only need to hit it once or twice to learn the trick and counter to it. It won't even be a fad long enough to warrant many threads. You'll get these poptart teams who start getting LRMed or counter-sniped out of the air, or flanked and rolled and it'll end pretty quickly. These are just mechs with 4-8 less tons of weapons and armor than everyone else in return for 1 relatively meager trick.