119 replies to this topic

[Mack1]

As a PUGGER with over 900 games under my belt I have been asking for premades and puggers to have seperate queues as it's really hurting this game. It's no fun at all as a solo player and we all know some people due to IRL stuff simply can't join a premade.

So I teamed up with 4 guys that I know from youtube and we played about 20 odd games, winning almost all of them, this is just one random game that we played to show you exactly how easy it is when just 4 of you have VOIP.

[One Medic Army]

Well, I'll say that video is a great example of several things.
Team which clusters together will beat a team which isn't.
One team seemed to unfortunately get a number of lower skilled players (going by damage dealt, it's possible they were all unlucky though, especially how spread out they were).
ECM is a definite area where premades on voice have an advantage. Without the verbal call the commando would have been able to keep running around un-noticed.

It's also worth noting that there was very little verbal coordination (apart from the bit with the commando) and no real calling of targets, pretty typical of voice groups I've been part of (outside of 8mans).

I give you credit for not running any cheesy builds, and doing it only with Stalkers and a non 6xSRM6 'pult.

Edited by One Medic Army, 09 February 2013 - 02:54 AM.

[The Amazing Atomic Spaniel]

Entertaining as always - but needs more of your usual incandescent rage and swearing .

[Mack1]

One Medic Army, on 09 February 2013 - 02:53 AM, said:

Well, I'll say that video is a great example of several things.
Team which clusters together will beat a team which isn't.
One team seemed to unfortunately get a number of lower skilled players (going by damage dealt, it's possible they were all unlucky though, especially how spread out they were).
ECM is a definite area where premades on voice have an advantage. Without the verbal call the commando would have been able to keep running around un-noticed.

It's also worth noting that there was very little verbal coordination (apart from the bit with the commando) and no real calling of targets, pretty typical of voice groups I've been part of (outside of 8mans).

I give you credit for not running any cheesy builds, and doing it only with Stalkers and a non 6xSRM6 'pult.

We really did not need to be chatting tactics much as we all stuck together most of the time, when I overheated a team m8 was right behind me covering, it's a huge advantage.

RocketDog, on 09 February 2013 - 02:59 AM, said:

Entertaining as always - but needs more of your usual incandescent rage and swearing .

This was one of my serious videos, I don't do many lol

[KinLuu]

Seperate queues or same number of premades on both teams.

Sounds like a rather easy fix.

[Pkunk]

It's a good vid because it shows that simply yelling "help" over voip is so much more effective than when using ingame chat. I makes alle the difference.

[Groumph]

Agree. That's not fun for the poor random team who get pwned, and for the premade that just steamroll without any challenge.

Need a fix asap to prevent ragequit.

[Gen Kumon]

The sad thing is, you don't even have to be on TS for a match to work out like this. You just need at least 3 or 4 people who are willing to stick together, cover each other, and actually read the freaking chat. Sadly, this doesn't happen very often. There are a fair number of decent pugs, but since they're not trying to play together, they get scatted one or two to a match, stuck with the other players who act like this is a single-player game. Some of those will learn and improve. Many won't. As is, you've discovered the reason I don't pug...I like knowing that I'll have at least a couple competent teammates, rather than relying on blind luck. Maybe over the long run of a year or two, most players will wise up and we'll get proper teamwork out of pickup groups...but I won't be betting on that outcome, personally.

Again, it's not some magical property of voice that gave you the advantage. It's that you had an actual team, while the people you were fighting against just saw each other as expendable meatshields.

[Redshift2k5]

We don't need separate queues. Not all premades are good and not all pugs are bad, you'd still see the same kind of thing happening.

Feb 19th will bring a matchmaking phase 3 which will stratify the players based on their relative win:loss, giving new and unorganized players enemies with a similar skill level, resulting in fairer fights for everyone.

Later, private matches (recently confirmed!) will allow high-skill teams to ditch the queue entirely and reach higher levels of play

[Joseph Mallan]

Mack1, on 09 February 2013 - 03:01 AM, said:

We really did not need to be chatting tactics much as we all stuck together most of the time, when I overheated a team m8 was right behind me covering, it's a huge advantage.

If you didn't need to chat tactics because you stuck together then maybe you rolled the other team cause you were just better tactically?


EDIT:
A K2 and three Stalkers staying together and pummeling every thing in sight can be done without comms Mack1. The enemy team was at a disadvantage from the count down. Those 4 Mechs would make short work of even other four man teams, if you have good coordination.

Edited by Joseph Mallan, 09 February 2013 - 05:48 AM.

[ferranis]

Redshift2k5, on 09 February 2013 - 05:25 AM, said:

Later, private matches (recently confirmed!) will allow high-skill teams to ditch the queue entirely and reach higher levels of play

I am not concerned about the true highskill teams, they are only few and already dominate the 8v8 queue. If i get owned by them in a pug game - whatever, maybe i will learn something from it.

For the rest well... see 8vs8 queue for comparison.

The pugstomper and 'low/mid skill but wins everytime because there are 4 of us sticking togehter' crowd needs to be sepperated from pug games. (no offence, but its the truth. In 99% percent its not your skill that grants you your high k/d or w/l - its because you run in a group)

Edited by ferranis, 09 February 2013 - 05:49 AM.

[ConnorSinclair]

Mack You're terrible


annendum, MEAN WHILE IN KONG WHERE WE ACTUALLY DO STUFF



LOOK GUYS A1 IS BALANCED
JUST SHOOT THE EARS OFF GOD
PAUL SAID ITS FINE
DON'T NERF ME BRO

Edited by ConnorSinclair, 09 February 2013 - 06:07 AM.

[ConnorSinclair]

Mack1, on 09 February 2013 - 03:01 AM, said:

This was one of my serious videos, I don't do many lol

And it ******* shows.

[_ufon_]

I agree we need to balance the teams more, I have also many games and not yet in any clan or team, in that way you end up with bunch of other people in a team against well organized clan teams, this is not fun and I am not alone who thinks if they do not change it probably we will not play anymore because if you always loose the game. Teams should play against teams, solo players in mixed teams maybe somehow skill balanced....
ufon

[ConnorSinclair]

ufonCZK, on 09 February 2013 - 06:31 AM, said:

I agree we need to balance the teams more, I have also many games and not yet in any clan or team, in that way you end up with bunch of other people in a team against well organized clan teams, this is not fun and I am not alone who thinks if they do not change it probably we will not play anymore because if you always loose the game. Teams should play against teams, solo players in mixed teams maybe somehow skill balanced....
ufon

This has already been addressed and is coming in matchmaking.

FIXING THE A1 HOWEVER....

[Joseph Mallan]

ConnorSinclair, on 09 February 2013 - 05:56 AM, said:

Mack You're terrible


annendum, MEAN WHILE IN KONG WHERE WE ACTUALLY DO STUFF



LOOK GUYS A1 IS BALANCED
JUST SHOOT THE EARS OFF GOD
PAUL SAID ITS FINE
DON'T NERF ME BRO

So its the Mech and not you that is awesome? Such Humility Connar!

[ConnorSinclair]

Joseph Mallan, on 09 February 2013 - 06:39 AM, said:

So its the Mech and not you that is awesome? Such Humility Connar!

I do admit, to a degree I am probably offsetting the experience a bit, HOWEVER

I hardly try when I run these things, the catapult is by far the most over powering mech I have ever piloted.
And the original Gigga N[gga uses 2 clan UAC20's and 1 medium pulse.

Splat Cat has 90 damage, 90 kph, full armor, and 3 kinds. JJs, AMS or Artemis.

also,


A1 COMPLAIN HIJACK THREAD

Edited by ConnorSinclair, 09 February 2013 - 06:45 AM.

[Joseph Mallan]

ConnorSinclair, on 09 February 2013 - 06:44 AM, said:

I do admit, to a degree I am probably offsetting the experience a bit, HOWEVER

I hardly try when I run these things, the catapult is by far the most over powering mech I have ever piloted.
And the original Gigga N[gga uses 2 clan UAC20's and 1 medium pulse.

Splat Cat has 90 damage, 90 kph, full armor, and 3 kinds. JJs, AMS or Artemis.

also,


A1 COMPLAIN HIJACK THREAD

We could take three Phracts and do what you have here. Or three Hunchie-4SP so long as we stay close and ambush players. Concentrated fire wins... often. By your definition My D-DC is way OP. As id My Phract-3D

[Wraith05]

I'm ok with setting matchmaker to even out groups on each side of a match and fill in with solos after say 3 mins have passed without finding another group.

I'm ok with giving solo drops more tools at there disposal to let them coordinate like you did. Because lets be honest for most part this wasn't a VOIP issue but was because you 4 went into the game knowing you were going to work together and did. If you get those rare games of solo dropping where you are able to coordinate 3 other solo drops to work and follow you, you usually have the same results.

I'm ok with tweaking/building the ELO system so that it gives a slightly inflated ELO when grouped so you are paired with solo drops that have higher individual elos than any given member of the team.

I'm ok more non VOIP tools such as quick commands, target my target options and easily made macros for chat.

But I am not ok with seperate queues. A lot of people like to group up but not play serious mode 100% of the time. It is one reason why you don't see many 8 mans in the 8 man queue. We are just pugs using VOIP so I don't want to be forced into play the 2-4 FotM builds anytime I want to group just to be competative. Same as you don't want to be forced into a group to be competative.

I really think we can find a middle ground here that will make you competative while still allowing groups to play pick up games.

[_ufon_]

just now played the game, 6 premades in 1 team, 0 in another, results: we lost 8:1 (BTW I killed 1 mech)...
once more this is not fun and it happens.... I hope matchmaking comes very, very soon!!!