26 replies to this topic

[Garfuncle]

Just got back into Mech Warrior, but have been a fan since Mech Warrior 3. I really like the Centurion AL for its all-rounded nature and I'm trying to build her into a formidable med-long range laser boat. I'm a bit rusty so I'm looking for some help.

Specs so far:

49.9 tons

64.8 speed

46 out of 200 firepower

1.26 heat effiecency

320 standard armor (reduced left arm armor and slightly in the legs for extra weight)

Endo Steel structure

2 med laser in torso

2 Large laser on the right arm

LRM 10 with 2 ammo

Double Heat sinks 15

STD Egine 200

Edited by Garfuncle, 16 February 2013 - 04:36 PM.

[Konril]

That's probably not a bad place to start your first mech, or as a budget option. Personally, I don't think I could stand being so slow in a medium mech. But I am aware that the engine is the most expensive piece of equipment in the mech, so swapping one isn't always affordable.

The one thing I can think that might be trouble is the LRM system. It's not your "main" armament, which is good. However, ECM systems have this habit of making LRMs useless without the proper support. So unless you have a partner that can TAG, I would strongly suggest you consider carrying one yourself. That would mean picking a laser to drop, though.

[Garfuncle]

Quote

But I am aware that the engine is the most expensive piece of equipment in the mech, so swapping one isn't always affordable.

What engine should I be looking at if I do want to change away from the 200? I've been looking for something that is generally the same weight and power class while still keeping the build of the mech the same, while improving speed and possibly heat, if that's possible.

Quote

The one thing I can think that might be trouble is the LRM system. It's not your "main" armament, which is good. However, ECM systems have this habit of making LRMs useless without the proper support. So unless you have a partner that can TAG, I would strongly suggest you consider carrying one yourself. That would mean picking a laser to drop, though.

I mostly use the LRM as something to keep pressure long-range as I fire with the twin-linked Large Lasers. The most ECM I've encountered is on light mechs, but those aren't too much of a hassle given how easy they are to hit with lasers and keep track of with the range of motion the Centurion has.

[Bounty Dogg]

How bout this? Same build, but with a little more close range functionality without losing any steps in the long range department. Advisory: this build is a bit hotter than you may be used to, but still within tolerable levels, provided you have 4 weapon group buttons available:

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...f49fa67f2c799ba

[Raso]

It's a good, solid build.

If you're insistent in making a mid to long range mech you could consider PPCs on the arm. Granted they are heavier and hotter than the large lasers but the damage is all dealt up front rather than having to hold the beam on target for a whole second. Granted you WILL lose closer range effectiveness but depending on your play style it could improve your effectiveness.

You will want to, at some point, try to fit a larger engine in your Cent. They are great mechs but mediums need to be as fast as they can. For mid to long range, especially, you want to be able to keep your distance and be able to position yourself in the most optimum locations.

On the other hand you could try something more like this CN9-A. The gauss makes you less dependent on the need for heat sinks. If add when your gauss rifle blows you can fire your medium lasers all day..... except that when your gauss rifle blows there his a good chance it will take out your side torso and totally ruin your day. You might wish you trade some ammo for a CASE, but you're already a little low on your ammo so that might not be wise. Still if you're not brawling and you use cover to just expose your arm when you fire it could be a pretty fun build.

[Konril]

The XL 260 is 1.5 tons heavier than the standard 200, but comes with 2 more heat sinks in the engine. It is also the largest engine that will fit in the AL. However I imagine that is not the answer you are really looking for, since the XL sabotages the "zombie" ability of the Centurion class. But that's part of what I say by "if you don't mind being so slow." Personally, while I was mastering them, I put a standard 250 in and worked with a "bralwer" set up featuring 2 SRM6s, 3 medium lasers, and a TAG, then 2 Streak SRM 2 and 3 medium pulse lasers for a while, before ECM was implemented.

I do have a thing for TAG, but that might be a better topic for a different post. But part of that is the fact that it is really hard to actually use 4 or more energy weapons efficiently except for small lasers.

Here is the rub. Medium lasers generate 4 heat per shot every 4 seconds. Large lasers generate 7 heat per shot every 4.25 seconds (1 second duration + 3 or 3.25s recharge). With a standard heat sink cooling at 1 heat every 10 seconds, it is going to take 10 per medium laser, or 16.5 per large laser to stay perfectly cool. 2 mediums + 2 large and you really need 57 standard heat sinks, or about 34 double heat sinks to be able to use it all 100%. That's more than will actually fit in the chasis, let alone in a mere 50 tons. 15 doubles will get you about 38% of the cooling you need to fire constantly.

From a DPS perspective, you are going to be overheating quickly if you fire all four lasers. You are better off using 1 large and the 2 mediums instead of everything. Alternatively, you can just use the 2 large lasers and wait to use the medium lasers until the arm falls off. At range, using the LRM 10 with a single large laser will get you a better DPS simply from the fact that the LRMs are more heat efficient.

There is a counter argument that suggests that doing a lot of alpha strike damage is good in engagements where mechs are constantly popping in and out of cover. But the way I like to build my own machines, I would be more than happy to drop one of the large lasers for a TAG, extra ammo, and a bigger LRM launcher. Compare for yourself.

2 Large Laser LRM10 AL: http://mwo.smurfy-ne...ed0a53667e5a1ac
1 LL, TAG, and more missiles: http://mwo.smurfy-ne...bf4a55fdc2e9933

[Dirus Nigh]

I had a similar build as the OPs, except I took out the LRMs and put in a bigger engine. I was faster with better heat sinks, and no risk of ammo explosions.

Edited by Dirus Nigh, 16 February 2013 - 08:46 PM.

[Stingz]

[Stays true to stock] Artemis for 3-second locks, 255 for the very needed speed.

Runs like ice, barely heats up on Caustic, swap the L.Las for an ER Large if you want.

Edited by Stingz, 17 February 2013 - 07:32 AM.

[Kempner]

Garfuncle, on 16 February 2013 - 05:10 PM, said:

What engine should I be looking at if I do want to change away from the 200? I've been looking for something that is generally the same weight and power class while still keeping the build of the mech the same, while improving speed and possibly heat, if that's possible.

The only alternative would be an XL engine, but that takes spots in the side torsos so you're more likely to get taken out.


To be honest.... admittedly I'm a pretty new player, but... don't be totally wedded to a weapon loadout. Having a higher speed (from 250 or 260 STD engine) has helped my Centurions enormously. No, can't have quite as much other stuff, but it means staying alive longer because you can rush past enemies or get away from them. Staying alive longer means inflicting more damage before the end of the match or your death.

[4lex]

I play my CN9-AL like this. Its a long range flanker disrupter. Let the fight start, and then move to the side of the map the opponent don't control. Move into position causiously to avoid enemy splat, dragon or pretty baby. Find a good spot 300-400m away from the opponent, with an angle that allow you to shoot them while they are covering up from your team. BEFORE you start shooting figure out an escape plan that provide lots of cover to run back to your team if the **** hit the fan. Shoot a mech, if he dont notice you keep shooting it, when he notice you its time to mess with they'r head . Switch to chain fire and shoot every mech you see to get alot of attention on you, then move into cover. Keep harassing them as long as they don't come for you. And when they send a DRG or HBK or some thing like that to you down, you got a 300 - 400m head start to leave . Light will catch up with you but you've got streak and laser to deal with them.

Ive had alot of fun playing that way. I encourage you to try many different build and find one that fit your play style.

Edited by 4lex, 17 February 2013 - 08:16 AM.

[Ravennus]

4lex, on 17 February 2013 - 08:06 AM, said:

I play my CN9-AL like this. Its a long range flanker disrupter. Let the fight start, and then move to the side of the map the opponent don't control. Move into position causiously to avoid enemy splat, dragon or pretty baby. Find a good spot 300-400m away from the opponent, with an angle that allow you to shoot them while they are covering up from your team. BEFORE you start shooting figure out an escape plan that provide lots of cover to run back to your team if the **** hit the fan. Shoot a mech, if he dont notice you keep shooting it, when he notice you its time to mess with they'r head . Switch to chain fire and shoot every mech you see to get alot of attention on you, then move into cover. Keep harassing them as long as they don't come for you. And when they send a DRG or HBK or some thing like that to you down, you got a 300 - 400m head start to leave . Light will catch up with you but you've got streak and laser to deal with them.

Ive had alot of fun playing that way. I encourage you to try many different build and find one that fit your play style.

I was looking at something like that, but 1 less DHS an no streaks.
You can still fit in a standard 250 engine, and zombie it up if it comes down to it.

I solo drop, and just don't trust streaks unless I have ECM.
Also, the only Cent I would consider an XL engine on would be the D, as you can get a much better top speed.

Comes down to playstyle for sure, though.

[Wrenchfarm]

Go to a 250 engine. 250 is important for a laser-boat because of the way DHS works in this game.

DHS just dropped into crit slots cool at a rate of 1.4x a standard heatsink. However, the ones that come INTERNAL to the engine cool at the true 2.0x rate. With a 250 engine you get the full 10 true double heatsinks (you get one heatsink with every 25 points of engine power, caps at 250, after that it opens up slots every 25 where you can opt to drop in a sink). So if you want to run lasers, you need to be as cool as possible, and the best way to get there is with a 250 engine.

You can drop the LRM10, slot in a STD250 engine, Endo, 2xLLAS, and 2xMLAS with 17 DHS (heat efficiency of 1.46). This is a great laser brawling build. Runs cool with a modest amount of discipline and does surprising damage for a medium.

You can use an XL250 to keep the LRM10, 2 tons of ammo, and 16 DHS. Or be real smart and use two LRM5s for the same payload but less weight and recycle time (yay for being smart!). This gives you an extra ton to play with, but no crit slots to use for it. But at least you can keep maximum armour on the legs.

I try to avoid using XLs on the Cent though. Cents are such tough zombie mechs it seems a shame to ruin that advantage. Especially just for a relatively small LRM payload. SRMs though... Might be a nasty surprise for someone in a brawl.

[roastpuff]

I would actually recommend a PPC rather than the LL or ERLL for the AL in a sniper configuration.

The PCC makes it easier to pop off shots from afar, and the fact that you don't have to hold it on target makes life a lot easier as well. Increase the engine size, learn how to shoot while strafing across from cover to cover and you have a good opportunity to put 10pts of damage on a 'Mech while not having to maintain a constant lock. Also when they implement the EMP function for the PPC, that would be useful to your team as well.

[NRP]

I've been running my AL as a PPC boat:

STD250
2 PPCs
2 MLs
Endo + FF
DHS

It's basically an energy version of the YLW. It's fun, but I really miss the SRMs when it's zombie time.

[Wrenchfarm]

NRP, on 17 February 2013 - 01:36 PM, said:

I've been running my AL as a PPC boat:

STD250
2 PPCs
2 MLs
Endo + FF
DHS

It's basically an energy version of the YLW. It's fun, but I really miss the SRMs when it's zombie time.

It seems like that would run super hot! No room for heatsinks with Endo and FF.

[NRP]

It's not too bad. I think the HE is something like 1.26 or so. The FF doesn't really help much, it just allows me to reclaim some leg armor.

Like all PPC builds I've tried, its effectiveness is dependent on how good your team is. I can't do much on my own, especially when I'm the center of attention.

[Ravennus]

Wrenchfarm, on 17 February 2013 - 01:37 PM, said:

It seems like that would run super hot! No room for heatsinks with Endo and FF.

I don't think it would be that bad. PPCs are only 8 heat now, and you can fit in 14 DHS.
Especially if you are staying at range and not firing the MLAS, that should be more than enough.

Just don't go looking for a brawl.

[roastpuff]

I'll just post my build in here as well, for a 9AL energy boat.



The other way to do it (losing the streaks) is to go with 2 MPL in the CT and PPC+MPL under the arm, and toss in an extra heat sink.

[Monkey Bone]

You should upgrade to at least std250 for those extra internal double heatsinks. And more speed is never bad.

[Oni Ralas]

2ERPPC's
2Mlas
2SSRM2 w/ 1ton ammo (just enoigh to keep lights from direct engaging over and over)
DHS/ES
STD200

Slower than I'd like, but you won't be in the direct fight. You take up position along side a bigger mech and just rain down ERPPC death continually. Anything that comes within 270m, you can tap with mlas+Streaks as heat allows. Don't go nuts with the trigger button of you'll find yourself shutdown.

For the AL, I can't find anything better than PPC's. The chassis is ignored quite a bit on the field, which is fine - lets you flay mechs with PPC precision, assuming you are a good shot. It's a lot of fun to pilot, I like if ar more than the backstabber mlas+srm6 zombie variants out there. I run it and my (new fav) YLW with much success.