75 replies to this topic

[Pater Mors]

MonkeyCheese, on 29 May 2013 - 03:18 PM, said:

My spider 5D 103 matches, 98 kills 39 deaths, 2.51 kdr. Lately as I have finally gotten into my grove with this mech I have been pulling 300s-500s in the damage department.

Im Australian with 280ish ping and these stats have been mostly recorded after the lagshieldfixes/state rewind stuff has been implemented.

Im not that great but Its my best performing mech and also my favorite to drive.

Worthless??

Yeah I know. I saw you in a match on Frozen City last night in my Catapult and thought, "What's the bet MonkeyCheese is the one that kills me?"

7 minutes or so later, I'm a smoking wreck watching a Spider dance across my corpse.

Moonkeeeey! *shakes fist*

[PanzerMagier]

I remember when DHS, endosteel,FF and all that statistically benefited light mechs more than anything else. I remember back when lights had lag shield.

You know what response I got from them? "L2AIM NOOB HA HA QQ AWEEEEEEE!"

The golden age of broken mechanic light mechs is over. And I'm very happy about it.

they were never meant to be miniature gunboats. If you got used to playing them like that. Tough luck.

[Jasen]

It just dawned on me that most of us aren't talking about the same gameplay...

Not talking about solo dropping and pugs.. talking about 8 mans and yakno... actual balance and role warefare and ****.

Noone cares that you dance around in a troll mech in pug drops and beat people in your ELO bracket...




EDIT:

PanzerMagier, on 29 May 2013 - 03:24 PM, said:

I remember when DHS, endosteel,FF and all that statistically benefited light mechs more than anything else. I remember back when lights had lag shield.

You know what response I got from them? "L2AIM NOOB HA HA QQ AWEEEEEEE!"

The golden age of broken mechanic light mechs is over. And I'm very happy about it.

they were never meant to be miniature gunboats. If you got used to playing them like that. Tough luck.

So you think that light mechs should be worthless because some pugs abused em? Please don't make assumptions about my gameplay.

Edited by Jasen, 29 May 2013 - 03:35 PM.

[MonkeyCheese]

Pater Mors, on 29 May 2013 - 03:21 PM, said:

Yeah I know. I saw you in a match on Frozen City last night in my Catapult and thought, "What's the bet MonkeyCheese is the one that kills me?"

7 minutes or so later, I'm a smoking wreck watching a Spider dance across my corpse.

Moonkeeeey! *shakes fist*

Yes that was my best match of the night. If it was you in that one. I had like 4 kills and 498 damage and won the game by killin off the remaining 2 mechs.

[Asakara]

I believe having a pair of light mechs in an 8 man is helpful. They act as scouts, flankers, base cappers (both to decoy and for the win), cap stoppers, and harassers. Also, they can bring firepower to any part of the battlefield quickly.. Much faster than the assault force. Finally, in some cases they can pull out a win for the team when everyone else is dead due to their speed and maneuverability, provided they have a skilled pilot on board.

Corvus Syndicate has some good light pilots like Voss, DDDs, and especially Tweekn. I would be surprised if they also felt there was no worth in taking a light mech or two in an 8 man.

[Pater Mors]

MonkeyCheese, on 29 May 2013 - 03:46 PM, said:

Yes that was my best match of the night. If it was you in that one. I had like 4 kills and 498 damage and won the game by killin off the remaining 2 mechs.

Haha nice. Pretty sure that was the one. I saw you when you were about 600m out from me on our side of the dropship and took some pot shots at you with PPC's which missed. Then I engaged a Stalker and by the time I was finished there I was pretty messed up. Perfect prey for a Spider.

[Chavette]

No! Bigger mech are even more useless because I fail even harder! Buff themmmmmm qqqqqqqqq

[El Bandito]

Jasen, on 29 May 2013 - 02:14 PM, said:

Please tell me in as few words as possible, PGI, what you plan to do to make lights worth playing? EDIT: Reply from below posted here to stop the mouth breathers from whipping out their epeens because they cannot comprehend the question. ---- I think this may help, lately I've been feeling like I'm crawling through molasses. I'm pretty certain there has been a game speed change.. or maybe they scaled everything down. It is hard to explain, but I've been demonstrating amongst our corp for a bit and we all seem to agree that even when I'm moving 150+ across their screen.. I'm barely moving. I assume they may have scaled down the speed EXACTLY because of MASC coming. They were having problems with things moving faster than 150, so if you slow 150 to 100... now your problem magically goes away. I'm guessing with MASC and rocking 200kph, it will feel like the old 150 and that may make it work again. But either way, thats leading me to wonder what the point of the lights are at this moment. With no dedicated info roles, not being faster than the fastest mediums... Basically, you get a few more module slots for a lot less punch, less armor, less c-bills. I mean lets make the pro and con list with a good medium as comparison: Pro: slightly smaller frame (not that it even matters in actual gameplay) slightly faster in numbers (barely a difference in actual movement speed) (~5 ton savings on drop weight which don't even matter) Con: less armor less damage less everything Also, there is no dedicated role for lights. Scouting is barely needed in the first place with the combination of small maps and big maps having very few "alleys" of attack... (that and big maps aren't even that big.. you can see 70% of alpine standing in 1 of many spots). Then consider that they aren't faster than mediums that have the same bonuses.. (3M for instance). No reason to bring that light outside of leagues (that are pretty cobbled together as it is). Just a simple question people, quit being so dramatic. What is coming for lights to make them worth playing... or... special if you will.

And here I thought people complained that Mediums are trash compared to Lights.

One of you must be wrong then.

[FupDup]

El Bandito, on 29 May 2013 - 04:12 PM, said:

And here I thought people complained that Mediums are trash compared to Lights.

One of you must be wrong then.

Mediums are trash compared to everything. Lights have better speed and size. Heavies have better armor and weapons.

[El Bandito]

Jasen, on 29 May 2013 - 03:30 PM, said:

It just dawned on me that most of us aren't talking about the same gameplay... Not talking about solo dropping and pugs.. talking about 8 mans and yakno... actual balance and role warefare and ****. Noone cares that you dance around in a troll mech in pug drops and beat people in your ELO bracket... EDIT: So you think that light mechs should be worthless because some pugs abused em? Please don't make assumptions about my gameplay.

That's no excuse. This game revolves around PUGs most of the time. Balancing for the sake of almost non-existent 8 mans is something not needed ATM.

Perhaps when CW is implemented...whenever that is.

Edited by El Bandito, 29 May 2013 - 04:15 PM.

[El Bandito]

FupDup, on 29 May 2013 - 04:13 PM, said:

Mediums are trash compared to everything. Lights have better speed and size. Heavies have better armor and weapons.

So Jasen is wrong here.

[blinkin]

i thought about coming in here and adding something, but the fires are already burning at maximum brightness.

i like my ERPPC jenner. it deals plenty of damage. my experience tells me lights are mostly fine. streaks need some attention though: http://mwomercs.com/...__fromsearch__1

[Asmudius Heng]

Lights need a greater role that is not directly related to killing other mechs because they will not be good that that and should not be good at that compared to other mechs. Not useless, but they should not be prime mech killers of other mechs well above thier weight.

The role of scouting is not great and should be improved with better communication and also the addition of passive and active sensors. This would allow better flanking of lights also that dont have ECM.

What they REALLY need though is two things.

1. Tonnage limited drops so you dont feel like you are always facing down 4 or more assaults.
2. Better game modes that have objectives that are better served with lights/mediums.

The game modes and how you incentivise players to downgrade their tonnage is a major issue. There is nothing you can do for lights to make them on par as killers and it should not be done ... when i drive a light i want to be fearful when facing a lot of bigger mechs. However I want to feel VALUED not just by my own estimation of abilities, but by the game itself.

Where are my objectives beyond the red square? Where are my tools to make scouting and indirect fire awesome? Where are my advantages of running a cheaper and easier to deploy mech?

The strengths and reasons to run lights in this setting and culled to near non existance.

[Digital Ninja]

PanzerMagier, on 29 May 2013 - 03:24 PM, said:

I remember when DHS, endosteel,FF and all that statistically benefited light mechs more than anything else. I remember back when lights had lag shield.

You know what response I got from them? "L2AIM NOOB HA HA QQ AWEEEEEEE!"

The golden age of broken mechanic light mechs is over. And I'm very happy about it.

they were never meant to be miniature gunboats. If you got used to playing them like that. Tough luck.

I could hit other lights just fine. There was no such thing as a lag shield. You just can't aim.

Soy, on 29 May 2013 - 02:19 PM, said:

Please tell me in as few words as possible, why the **** you think you're entitled to have PGI respond to your asinine question on a stupid forum.

Please tell me in as few words as possible why you think you're entitled to be an asinine ********* to someone for asking a question.

Edited by Digital Ninja, 29 May 2013 - 04:40 PM.

[El Bandito]

Digital Ninja, on 29 May 2013 - 04:38 PM, said:

I could hit other lights just fine. There was no such thing as a lag shield. You just can't aim.

You just won the prize for the Biggest Liar of this day. All your previous comments are rendered useless by this lie.

[Jasen]

Asakara, on 29 May 2013 - 03:52 PM, said:

I believe having a pair of light mechs in an 8 man is helpful. They act as scouts, flankers, base cappers (both to decoy and for the win), cap stoppers, and harassers. Also, they can bring firepower to any part of the battlefield quickly.. Much faster than the assault force. Finally, in some cases they can pull out a win for the team when everyone else is dead due to their speed and maneuverability, provided they have a skilled pilot on board.

Corvus Syndicate has some good light pilots like Voss, DDDs, and especially Tweekn. I would be surprised if they also felt there was no worth in taking a light mech or two in an 8 man.

If you know so much of Corvus you'd know that I am also a light pilot for them. So either that's cold, or you don't understand what I'm saying.


So to reiterate..

Why bring a light when you can bring a medium?

(I left why bring a medium when you can bring a heavy and why bring a heavy when you could bring a 3xERPPC1XGauss highlander to another thread)


I dunno, we all know there is **** balance, I was asking specifically about lights. I don't know of anything coming down the pipe whatsoever that benefits specifically lights. I was asking.. in a balance forum...

Community really sucks here.


However, if you want to know. Corvus pretty much only drops league cards in 8 mans, so the only reason you see lights and mediums in the current game is because of that reason. I doubt we would run many lights or mediums if it wasn't required. And yes, that's fail... but lends more to the exact problem I'm talking about.

Edited by Jasen, 29 May 2013 - 05:07 PM.

[blinkin]

El Bandito, on 29 May 2013 - 04:45 PM, said:

You just won the prize for the Biggest Liar of this day. All your previous comments are rendered useless by this lie.

from what i have seen lag shield is mostly gone NOW, but claiming it NEVER existed is just absurd.

[InRev]

Mr Jasen sir

Jasen, on 29 May 2013 - 05:02 PM, said:

If you know so much of Corvus you'd know that I am also a light pilot for them. So either that's cold, or you don't understand what I'm saying.


So to reiterate..

Why bring a light when you can bring a medium

Well for one, they're smaller. I know that seems like a silly response but it helps a lot. Just the size of their model is a huge boon. If you avoid just a single PPC shot because your hitbox is so small, that offsets any extra armor that a medium may have. Chances are, you will avoid more than just one shot.

Additionally, a lot of lights can also carry firepower equivalent to a medium, however there is a cost: heat efficiency. This points toward a playstyle in which you hit, heat up, and run away to cool down. If you are a light, never commit, never get stuck in. Just survive. The longer you live, the better. Honestly, there is no rush. Wait for your team to commit, and in the mean time, take little nibbles.

Going along with the never commit angle, lights have more speed than mediums. Use your speed to go places where the bad guys don't expect. If they can see you, you are in trouble. Be unseen. ECM helps with this at long to medium ranges. Try not to dodge fire. Try to avoid even being shot at at all. Don't shoot from the same place more than once. Take a shot and move on. Seismic helps to ensure that you do not over-commit as well.

You have a tactical role as well. After your sides are duking it out, go for cap and cap it until you see someone coming, then bug out. This gives you a head start in case the battle starts going wrong AND pulls someone from the fight. Try not to get in a slugging match on cap though.

Finally, lights can identify where the bad guys are going and allow your team to set up some kind of defense or flank. They can screen to make sure your team doesn't walk into a wall of PPCs and Gauss.

Lights have a lot of roles. They aren't the circle-strafers of doom like in previous builds but they are far, far, far from useless. Now you just have to play up to their very unique strengths in a different way. My first suggestion is to just try to survive as long as possible. Always try to be last man standing.

HTH.

[Asakara]

Jasen, on 29 May 2013 - 05:02 PM, said:

If you know so much of Corvus you'd know that I am also a light pilot for them. So either that's cold, or you don't understand what I'm saying.

...

Or maybe I was in Death's Hand Brigade with Voss, DDDs, and Tweekn from August 2012 to April 2013... Of course you were there too from January to April IIRC.

Edited by Asakara, 29 May 2013 - 05:15 PM.

[El Bandito]

None of the true mediums (Cicada is a pseudo light) have ECM. I prefer ECM lights and Cicadas over any mediums in my team. At least when **** hits the fan, they have the speed and smaller profile to get out of the furball.

My A1 never failed to kill and chase down any mediums. Mostly because medium pilots somehow think they can stay and fight--unlike smarter light pilots.

Edited by El Bandito, 29 May 2013 - 05:24 PM.