108 replies to this topic

[Bishop Steiner]

and how I would have preferred to see the Crab and Dire Wolf move...
http://vid1279.photo...zpsfc3c0e6b.mp4

[ExoForce]

This! You can feel how the ground shakes under him. We have but* shaking mechs (sigh).

Astonishing walk animation! So powerfull.

[ExoForce]

When I watch those videos and think about it, proper walking would also reduce HUD screen shaking (flash animation) that can lead to increased FPS and hit detection?

[Russ Bullock]

will make sure the art team at least reads the thread to file away any items they agree with etc

[Joseph Mallan]

Major Tryhard, on 28 December 2014 - 11:08 AM, said:

You are confused, that's the Atlas

I would love for my Atlas's Milk Shake to move like that! If it helped to distract a few shots at me...It'd be worth it!

[LordKnightFandragon]

Navid A1, on 06 January 2015 - 11:16 AM, said:

The game had this before.

As they wanted to implement 12v12, they removed it. They said its going to be an extra load both on cpu and data transfer, Because the position of hitboxes in this game matters on every individual body part and server and client should stay perfectly synchronized at all times, as a slight lag can result in different leg states in server and client.

I wonder now that they moved hitreg and everything to server side. can't they implement the IK system back again?



IK system or not, when i look at direwolf/warhawk/stalker/summoner arm/stormcrow/kitfox toes/king crab butt/... i know PGI needs new animators.

whats IK? But yeah, the whole standing properly on the terrain, that is pretty awesome, we need more immersion, not less. And yeah, 8v8 is so much better...who was advocating for 12v12? I never played in 8v8 much......would be alot better then 12v12, 4 fewer mechs to curb stomp the team with, 4 fewer mechs with which to Focus fire, 4 fewer mechs to clog up the chokepoints, allowing for slightly more freedom of movement.....4 fewer mechs with which to be {LT-MOB-25} in the mouth bads who cant even move the mech right, much less fight someone...

[Navid A1]

Russ Bullock, on 28 January 2015 - 11:52 AM, said:

will make sure the art team at least reads the thread to file away any items they agree with etc

Thanks russ.

[Tennex]

Russ Bullock, on 28 January 2015 - 11:52 AM, said:

will make sure the art team at least reads the thread to file away any items they agree with etc

<3 Russ

[Catalinasgrace]

Oh man please please please... I'll give a kidney to get some of these animation redone correctly. I agree 100% they look completely rushed...

Direwolf, Gar, Crab, Kitfox, adder are the worst of the bunch...

Direwolf, Gar, and Crab move and bounce WAY too much, legs move too fast IMO for the speed and weight. There is zero chance a pilot could ride in those let alone pilot one (if it was real)...

The Adder and Kitfox have no feet animations as listed before...


Soooo, who do we have to bribe to fix this stuff?!?!?! lol...

[Enrique Barahona Ramos]

Hey guys, let me address some of the concerns and observations made here.

It’s true that some mechs need a TLC pass, that’s evident in the DWF and WHK, part of the problem stems from the fact that they were released in a pack so there’s less animation man-hours available to work in them, as opposed to other mechs released individually.

The wonky behavior of the DWF in slopes is a mix of code and animation issues, we’re looking into this. Regarding its “prancing and bouncing”, I have to agree that for its weight class is way too much, and the same goes for other mechs mentioned in this thread.
Bear in mind that animators also try to give each mech a distinctive motion where possible, as the more mechs are released the harder it is to make them stand out in the crowd.
Back in the day, it was really easy to spot a Trebuchet out of an incoming lance. Nowadays a distinctive silhouette is not enough to distinguish who is who in a crowded battlefield, so we try to make up for that with animation (to the extent that is possible to do that with a hulking walking tank).
Albeit the DWF weighs 100 tons, you still need to make sure the anim cover the distance when it runs @ 50kph. So the speeding up of the animation compounds the kinks and bounces and makes them all the more evident.
Anyways, we’ll give the mechs mentioned in this thread a good revisiting, so they move and look the part.

The ground detection (a.k.a runtime leg IK) is a source of frustration too for us since the start.
When we first started to implement it, the first hurdle we encountered is that the sheer size of the mechs made the built-in ground detection inaccurate.
Once coders got around it and got it working (as the cool pic of the hunchback shows), the problem became the overhead in raytracing two feet times a dozen plus mechs, which is what you regularly see on-screen in a regular match.

Coders again sought solutions to deal with that bandwidth problem, but then kinks would appear such as legs still flexing after re-entering level ground, which looked a lot worse than not having the IK at all. So it was a matter of choosing the lesser of two evils, which is why IK is off for the time being. This is a bummer (understatement of the year so far), and as animators are very fastidious about their work, you can be sure we’re the first to be very frustrated by this issue.

This doesn’t mean we’re still not looking for a solution. In the meantime, every new mech is still rigged with the bells and whistles needed to detect ground, for when the time comes to flick the switch back on.

Enrique Barahona Ramos

El Señor Animador.

[Sigilum Sanctum]

Thanks for the update Mr. Ramos! I'm eager to see what can be done.

[Navid A1]

Thank you so much Mr. Ramos.

So glad that this is an active topic between the animators and coders. I'll eagerly look forward to any improvements.
Also, i think that the direwolf silhouette (for example) is distinct enough, even from afar. So a smoother animation will be most welcome.

Thanks again.

Edited by Navid A1, 28 January 2015 - 06:55 PM.

[LordKnightFandragon]

When can we see a rescaling of mechs? The DWF and WHK are not as tall as an Atlas....and the WHK is not as wide as a DWF, neither is the Nova. Heck, the DWF and WHK are both shorter then a TBR and Summoner and barely taller then a Mad Dog...

[White Bear 84]

Sarlic, on 28 December 2014 - 11:06 AM, said:

Why?

Like every time I see a crab or atlas walking in front of me be all like...

.

Edited by White Bear 84, 28 January 2015 - 07:07 PM.

[ExoForce]

White Bear 84, on 28 January 2015 - 07:07 PM, said:

Like every time I see this I imagine a crab or atlas walking in front of me...

I need a brake..

Edited by ExoForce, 01 February 2015 - 09:22 AM.

[Tennex]

Enrique Barahona Ramos, on 28 January 2015 - 06:18 PM, said:

Hey guys, let me address some of the concerns and observations made here.

It’s true that some mechs need a TLC pass, that’s evident in the DWF and WHK, part of the problem stems from the fact that they were released in a pack so there’s less animation man-hours available to work in them, as opposed to other mechs released individually.

The wonky behavior of the DWF in slopes is a mix of code and animation issues, we’re looking into this. Regarding its “prancing and bouncing”, I have to agree that for its weight class is way too much, and the same goes for other mechs mentioned in this thread.
Bear in mind that animators also try to give each mech a distinctive motion where possible, as the more mechs are released the harder it is to make them stand out in the crowd.
Back in the day, it was really easy to spot a Trebuchet out of an incoming lance. Nowadays a distinctive silhouette is not enough to distinguish who is who in a crowded battlefield, so we try to make up for that with animation (to the extent that is possible to do that with a hulking walking tank).
Albeit the DWF weighs 100 tons, you still need to make sure the anim cover the distance when it runs @ 50kph. So the speeding up of the animation compounds the kinks and bounces and makes them all the more evident.
Anyways, we’ll give the mechs mentioned in this thread a good revisiting, so they move and look the part.

The ground detection (a.k.a runtime leg IK) is a source of frustration too for us since the start.
When we first started to implement it, the first hurdle we encountered is that the sheer size of the mechs made the built-in ground detection inaccurate.
Once coders got around it and got it working (as the cool pic of the hunchback shows), the problem became the overhead in raytracing two feet times a dozen plus mechs, which is what you regularly see on-screen in a regular match.

Coders again sought solutions to deal with that bandwidth problem, but then kinks would appear such as legs still flexing after re-entering level ground, which looked a lot worse than not having the IK at all. So it was a matter of choosing the lesser of two evils, which is why IK is off for the time being. This is a bummer (understatement of the year so far), and as animators are very fastidious about their work, you can be sure we’re the first to be very frustrated by this issue.

This doesn’t mean we’re still not looking for a solution. In the meantime, every new mech is still rigged with the bells and whistles needed to detect ground, for when the time comes to flick the switch back on.

Enrique Barahona Ramos

El Señor Animador.

Thanks for the update!

glad to see that PGI hasnt given up on IK! with hopes of adding it someday

But will we get Kit Fox/Adder feet animations? 2 birds with 1 stone

Edited by Tennex, 01 February 2015 - 09:29 AM.

[ExoForce]

GFX dept, dont forget to make the back of the cabin solid to reduce sun reflection on HUD (FPS, FOV..)
http://mwomercs.com/...ost__p__2550634

Edited by ExoForce, 01 February 2015 - 09:33 AM.

[Siriothrax]

Enrique Barahona Ramos, on 28 January 2015 - 06:18 PM, said:

*snip*

Enrique Barahona Ramos

El Señor Animador.

What are the odds we can get the janky, potentially hitbox breaking jumpjet animations on several mechs looked at? For example, the Timberwolf has some pretty mad hops. It quickly becomes an issue when people are spamming the JJ key to throw off incoming fire.

Edited by Siriothrax, 02 February 2015 - 12:18 AM.

[Tarogato]

Enrique Barahona Ramos, on 28 January 2015 - 06:18 PM, said:

When we first started to implement it, the first hurdle we encountered is that the sheer size of the mechs made the built-in ground detection inaccurate. Once coders got around it and got it working (as the cool pic of the hunchback shows), the problem became the overhead in raytracing two feet times a dozen plus mechs, which is what you regularly see on-screen in a regular match.

Really happy to see dev responses in here, thanks so much! <3

This is a really huge topic, but it's been suggested occasionally before: how feasible would it be to scale everything down? Scale the mechs, the maps, the assets, the measured distances, etc. It's a lot of work, but would there be a chance in hell that it would actually help with some issues? We seem to have a lot of trouble with MWO simply because mechs are huge, and we're using first-person-shooter engine which is intended for efforts an order of magnitude smaller than Battletech scale. Instead, make mechs only twice the height of a person, and adjust everything around that so that we're working with smaller internal numbers. Would it make a difference?

[mrbright]

Perhaps the devs could use a height map to reference leg ik and a normal map to calculate foot alignment? Could cost less than ray tracing?