49 replies to this topic

[Davers]

Prophetic, on 06 March 2015 - 07:03 AM, said:

Seems like HK is rubbing off on people.

You usually have to pay extra for that kind of action.

[Novawrecker]

Davers, on 08 March 2015 - 11:55 AM, said:

You usually have to pay extra for that kind of action.

We only charge clanners and purple chickens this extra premium

[Chef Kerensky]

MischiefSC, on 04 March 2015 - 01:53 PM, said:

A spider and a stalker or erll bm + a dragon/tbolt combo so that you've got 2xecm on every wave. If you don't have ecm every wave you are doing it wrong. The raven is alright but there are just so many valid uses for a ecm JJ light and the spiders broken hotboxes are not an advantage to be ignored.

More recent experience has shown that ECM isn't the be-all end-all for anti-clan CW depending on the strategies and builds used, but 4 times out of 5 it's a smart idea anyway and it alleviates a lot of headaches if your team is not proficient at avoiding lrms by other means or you want to make it more difficult for the enemy to call targets. Don't expect it to be a magical cure for streakboats - most run active probes and clans generally have enough ECM for someone to counter yours, and that's only going to get worse once wave 3 lands.

Remember that you can't match clanners pound for pound on tonnage-to-damage ratios, but you can outpoke them because your lasers have a much shorter burn time. Take advantage of that when you find your Stalker 4N up against a laser vomit Madcat with a foothill and several hundred meters between the two of you.

Bear in mind that most of this advice runs pretty exclusive to IS-vs-Clan fighting, which is still a very different beast from IS-vs-IS fighting.

Edited by Chef Kerensky, 11 March 2015 - 07:54 AM.

[MischiefSC]

Chef Kerensky, on 11 March 2015 - 07:53 AM, said:

More recent experience has shown that ECM isn't the be-all end-all for anti-clan CW depending on the strategies and builds used, but 4 times out of 5 it's a smart idea anyway and it alleviates a lot of headaches if your team is not proficient at avoiding lrms by other means or you want to make it more difficult for the enemy to call targets. Don't expect it to be a magical cure for streakboats - most run active probes and clans generally have enough ECM for someone to counter yours, and that's only going to get worse once wave 3 lands.

Remember that you can't match clanners pound for pound on tonnage-to-damage ratios, but you can outpoke them because your lasers have a much shorter burn time. Take advantage of that when you find your Stalker 4N up against a laser vomit Madcat with a foothill and several hundred meters between the two of you.

Bear in mind that most of this advice runs pretty exclusive to IS-vs-Clan fighting, which is still a very different beast from IS-vs-IS fighting.

The perks of ecm run in two flavors - against low Elo or pug units it protects you from lrms. Against solid 12man teams it inhibits accurate focus fire.

Long range anti-clan builds only work in a 12man. Pugs will bring a mix of loadouts and you can't focus fire with enough long range umph to keep them out of their optimal range. Less than 10 and cool running brawlers are safer - if your team isn't too ***** to get kissing distance.

[Vlad Ward]

Considering 127% of Pugs bring 4 LRM boats to CW, staying at range shouldn't hurt them any. In fact, trying to brawl or push through gates while the pugs on your team jerk off two squares back can be really aggravating.

[MischiefSC]

Vlad Ward, on 11 March 2015 - 01:46 PM, said:

Considering 127% of Pugs bring 4 LRM boats to CW, staying at range shouldn't hurt them any. In fact, trying to brawl or push through gates while the pugs on your team jerk off two squares back can be really aggravating.

The cold hard brutal truth is that you need to simply ignore the LRM pugs on your team for the first wave. For the 2nd wave you use them as a distraction, because when the Clanners move forward to butcher them like the fattened cows they are you do your light rush out the other gate. Their brutal and humiliating death will buy you more time and likely be their biggest contribution to your team.

[CruiseMissileCowboy]

Benjamin Davion, on 05 March 2015 - 08:57 PM, said:

And Calon, I've put out the same call on the AFFS website. We need to get our guys together on the regular and starting doing this for real.

HHoD 1st Bat told the rest of their members they win 80% of their CW matches.
Now they continually ask for help...because they lose 80% of their matches.

[Benjamin Davion]

CruiseMissileCowboy, on 15 March 2015 - 08:10 AM, said:

HHoD 1st Bat told the rest of their members they win 80% of their CW matches.
Now they continually ask for help...because they lose 80% of their matches.

Oh, did another disgruntled former HeadHunter make their way to Smoke Jag? Name change, huh? Pretty sure I still know who this is. Well, for the first 2-3 weeks, yes, 1st Batt did win 80% or more of our CW matches. Opposition stiffened, and now we need to adapt. Don't know what your beef is, but I don't really care. Good day.

[Aylward]

Would probably be better to take this discussion to the AFFS forums.. Don't worry, our little smoke jag buddy there with 23 posts on his new alt account wont miss it.. he seems to be a member there too.. He was telling the kuritas all about how we're talking about training, tactics and mechs there (Gasp...as if, right?) and we were totally weak and they should pounce on us now.. Sounds like you came pretty close there, Benjamin..

[Tasker]

Benjamin Davion, on 19 March 2015 - 12:56 AM, said:

Oh, did another disgruntled former HeadHunter make their way to Smoke Jag? Name change, huh? Pretty sure I still know who this is. Well, for the first 2-3 weeks, yes, 1st Batt did win 80% or more of our CW matches. Opposition stiffened, and now we need to adapt. Don't know what your beef is, but I don't really care. Good day.

Have seen you make fun of own group DURING A DROP in all chat. So any surprise that players leave Davion and badmouth you back?

[Benjamin Davion]

Tasker, on 19 March 2015 - 07:58 AM, said:

Have seen you make fun of own group DURING A DROP in all chat. So any surprise that players leave Davion and badmouth you back?

Tasker, I recall the exact incident you're referring to. We performed horribly in a drop. You caught us flat flooted on our first wave, and from there on everything fell apart. I had pilots in missile boats and other useless mechs, pilots wandering off to areas other than they were ordered. It was a mess. A strategy that had worked before (though admittedly against teams less skilled than NKVA) failed, and it seemed to be because people weren't listening to calls or predrop organization. So, what I said, exactly, was: 'This is what happens when my team doesn't listen. Well played, NKVA'. That was not badmouthing, that was pointing out exactly what happened, and my guys understood that because we then spent quite a while going over exactly what went wrong. As a leader, I call out my pilots when they screw up, and I call myself out even more when I make a bad call. There's no other way for a team to improve.

[MischiefSC]

Benjamin Davion, on 19 March 2015 - 01:20 PM, said:

Tasker, I recall the exact incident you're referring to. We performed horribly in a drop. You caught us flat flooted on our first wave, and from there on everything fell apart. I had pilots in missile boats and other useless mechs, pilots wandering off to areas other than they were ordered. It was a mess. A strategy that had worked before (though admittedly against teams less skilled than NKVA) failed, and it seemed to be because people weren't listening to calls or predrop organization. So, what I said, exactly, was: 'This is what happens when my team doesn't listen. Well played, NKVA'. That was not badmouthing, that was pointing out exactly what happened, and my guys understood that because we then spent quite a while going over exactly what went wrong. As a leader, I call out my pilots when they screw up, and I call myself out even more when I make a bad call. There's no other way for a team to improve.

I expect Radio or CMetz or whoever in 22AL is calling the drop to jump on my **** with both feet if I go full idjit on a drop. Nothing wrong with that. Depends on your rapport with your team though. I wouldn't always do that with a pug drop of course but if it's your own team and they make a bad, well, they need to know that there are some basic standards.

[YCSLiesmith]

Benjamin Davion, on 19 March 2015 - 01:20 PM, said:

Tasker, I recall the exact incident you're referring to. We performed horribly in a drop. You caught us flat flooted on our first wave, and from there on everything fell apart. I had pilots in missile boats and other useless mechs, pilots wandering off to areas other than they were ordered. It was a mess. A strategy that had worked before (though admittedly against teams less skilled than NKVA) failed, and it seemed to be because people weren't listening to calls or predrop organization. So, what I said, exactly, was: 'This is what happens when my team doesn't listen. Well played, NKVA'. That was not badmouthing, that was pointing out exactly what happened, and my guys understood that because we then spent quite a while going over exactly what went wrong. As a leader, I call out my pilots when they screw up, and I call myself out even more when I make a bad call. There's no other way for a team to improve.

you should look into positive coaching methods, its how i coach my irl team

[Vlad Ward]

Being nice to other teams while being total jackoffs to your own members seems a tad backwards imo.

[MischiefSC]

Saying 'this is what happens when my team doesn't listen' isn't being a *******. If that's what it takes for you two to feel hurt and abused when you've intentionally dicked around for a match, well, okay? I'd expect to hear a 'wtf were you doing guys? You want to roll troll builds in pug queue we can go do that but derping in CW isn't cool, you're all better than that' and hearing that in public chat would have made me a bit ashamed and there are times when I've *intentionally* been bad where I should have been.

Not the same thing as just having a bad game. Sometimes you just show up with a bucket full of suck. Happens, no hard feelings. Intentionally sandbagging the team happens sometimes too and it's not unreasonable to get a smack upside the head for it.

[Kwea]

Tasker, on 19 March 2015 - 07:58 AM, said:

Have seen you make fun of own group DURING A DROP in all chat. So any surprise that players leave Davion and badmouth you back?

Isn't that where NKVA came from? LOL.

Considering who this is I'd be more ashamed if he approved of us.

[Benjamin Davion]

YCSLiesmith, on 19 March 2015 - 02:12 PM, said:

you should look into positive coaching methods, its how i coach my irl team

Generally I'm a pretty friendly leader. Every now and then I come down hard to make a point. Happened to be one of those times.

[Kerc Kasha]

Kwea, on 19 March 2015 - 04:44 PM, said:

Isn't that where NKVA came from? LOL.

Considering who this is I'd be more ashamed if he approved of us.

nobody in nkva is boring enough to have played davion

[YCSLiesmith]

Kwea, on 19 March 2015 - 04:44 PM, said:

Isn't that where NKVA came from? LOL.

Considering who this is I'd be more ashamed if he approved of us.

NKVA is a silent monk brotherhood. we all took the vows together ten years ago now, and have lived in quiet contemplation of the infinite since then. One day a few months ago one of our brothers, reached a new stage of enlightenment. he meditated without pause for days, neither eating nor drinking, chanting the praises to the buddha that are our only permitted speech.

On the second day of the last month of the year of the horse at the hour of the Dragon he opened his eyes and spoke to us for the first time in ten years. "Lets join House Kurita and pwn Davion Noobs" he said. "Yes, Scoops" we replied in unison.

[MischiefSC]

YCSLiesmith, on 20 March 2015 - 03:40 AM, said:

NKVA is a silent monk brotherhood. we all took the vows together ten years ago now, and have lived in quiet contemplation of the infinite since then. One day a few months ago one of our brothers, reached a new stage of enlightenment. he meditated without pause for days, neither eating nor drinking, chanting the praises to the buddha that are our only permitted speech.

On the second day of the last month of the year of the horse at the hour of the Dragon he opened his eyes and spoke to us for the first time in ten years. "Lets join House Kurita and pwn Davion Noobs" he said. "Yes, Scoops" we replied in unison.

A bunch of school kids who couldn't figure out how to talk to members of the opposite sex without getting sprayed with mace doesn't count as a secret brotherhood of quiet contemplation. If you're all quiet, only speaking to each other because nobody else talks to you that doesn't count. Siddhartha was no otaku.