42 replies to this topic

[Cyberpunk Eevee]

I've been out of the game for a while, and will be training again soon to start playing once more.

I've got a build sitting in my smurfy mechbay that I called Harassing Support. I'm going to need some input to have an idea about its viability.

Can't remember all the reasons for everything, but some are obvious.

2xSmall Pulse Laser
DPS:Heat ratio

NARC, TAG, BAP, ECM

Not sure about the armor layout, but I remember it working okay.

XL 285 to get over the 130KpH hump, but still have some room for plenty of armor and a decent chunk of ammo.

I played around with the idea of 2 NARCs, more Narc ammo, less AMS ammo...

Suggestions and reasoning are greatly appreciated.

[Repasy Cooper]

Cyberpunk Eevee, on 18 April 2015 - 11:46 AM, said:

I've been out of the game for a while, and will be training again soon to start playing once more.

I've got a build sitting in my smurfy mechbay that I called Harassing Support. I'm going to need some input to have an idea about its viability.

Can't remember all the reasons for everything, but some are obvious.

2xSmall Pulse Laser
DPS:Heat ratio

NARC, TAG, BAP, ECM

Not sure about the armor layout, but I remember it working okay.

XL 285 to get over the 130KpH hump, but still have some room for plenty of armor and a decent chunk of ammo.

I played around with the idea of 2 NARCs, more Narc ammo, less AMS ammo...

Suggestions and reasoning are greatly appreciated.

Armor looks good. I would say that 1 ton of narc ammo is fine, and an additional narc launcher is an EXTREME waste of space. I would also consider switching from small pulse to medium lasers. Make use of some of that heat efficiency.

[Omi_]

Is this for playing in PUG games? I would say that having NARC + TAG is quite overkill. If you're doing NARC, you probably don't need TAG. Also, if I were you, I would take a larger engine (probably XL 295).

I dropped the AMS and one-half ton of NARC ammo. Generally speaking, I would say that 24 rounds is much too much ammo for 12 enemy mechs. No disrespect intended, but if you're missing shots, you should just work on picking your shots or working on your aim.

Additionally, I swapped the Small Pulse for Medium lasers, since the RVN-3L's quirks give you more bang for your buck when using Mediums anyway.

Here's my revised loadout: RVN-3L

EDIT: AMS dropped because bigger engine is better for survival. And as Repasy said, I would also personally only bring one ton of NARC. I purposely only dropped the half ton because I figured you were used to having 2.

Edited by Hornsby, 18 April 2015 - 12:21 PM.

[TheArcher]

I'm happy with my RVN-3L: 3xML, 1xSRM 4 + 1t ammo, NARC + 1t ammo. ECM, 295 XL, no extra DHS. (No tag, no BAP)

It rarely gets kills, but it helps the rest of the team live longer+do more damage. I mostly PUG.

[ShadowbaneX]

Why bother with Beagle when you've got ECM. Drop it for something more useful. I go with NARC, 1t of ammo, and 3 MPLs.

[Cyberpunk Eevee]

Repasy, on 18 April 2015 - 12:05 PM, said:

Armor looks good. I would say that 1 ton of narc ammo is fine, and an additional narc launcher is an EXTREME waste of space. I would also consider switching from small pulse to medium lasers. Make use of some of that heat efficiency.

Alright. Thanks for the input.

Hornsby, on 18 April 2015 - 12:19 PM, said:

Is this for playing in PUG games? I would say that having NARC + TAG is quite overkill. If you're doing NARC, you probably don't need TAG. Also, if I were you, I would take a larger engine (probably XL 295).

I dropped the AMS and one-half ton of NARC ammo. Generally speaking, I would say that 24 rounds is much too much ammo for 12 enemy mechs. No disrespect intended, but if you're missing shots, you should just work on picking your shots or working on your aim.

Additionally, I swapped the Small Pulse for Medium lasers, since the RVN-3L's quirks give you more bang for your buck when using Mediums anyway.

Here's my revised loadout: RVN-3L

EDIT: AMS dropped because bigger engine is better for survival. And as Repasy said, I would also personally only bring one ton of NARC. I purposely only dropped the half ton because I figured you were used to having 2.

It's for a blend of PUG and organized games. NARC & TAG, two ways to a similar, stacking outcome. I've been in situations where NARC was useless, such as spotting enemies under ECM when I couldn't get a bead on the mech with ECM.

No disrepect taken. It's not me missing shots with the NARC, it's allies not always firing when I NARC.

Quirks?

I like AMS, but if I can outrun a missile, I guess I won't need it.

TheArcher, on 18 April 2015 - 12:52 PM, said:

I'm happy with my RVN-3L: 3xML, 1xSRM 4 + 1t ammo, NARC + 1t ammo. ECM, 295 XL, no extra DHS. (No tag, no BAP)

It rarely gets kills, but it helps the rest of the team live longer+do more damage. I mostly PUG.

Seems nice, but I actually enjoy the support tools more than combat. Playstyle difference, I guess.

ShadowbaneX, on 18 April 2015 - 01:16 PM, said:

Why bother with Beagle when you've got ECM. Drop it for something more useful. I go with NARC, 1t of ammo, and 3 MPLs.

Because it extends sensor range and reduces target info time.

[bad arcade kitty]

i don't think you need tag and narc at all especially together
i would drop them both
so, i would build it as a maximum support this way (note that i'm a noob so take it with a grain of salt :3)
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...02d0756f6e30ab1

[Omi_]

Quote

It's for a blend of PUG and organized games. NARC & TAG, two ways to a similar, stacking outcome. I've been in situations where NARC was useless, such as spotting enemies under ECM when I couldn't get a bead on the mech with ECM.

When I say that TAG and NARC are redundant, I mean it's nigh impossible for one light mech to use both efficiently. NARC at the front line requires ducking and weaving, which is fundamentally contradictory to the steady piloting that most benefits TAG. It absolutely stacks, but it's best (and usually recommended, for their own sakes) that LRM boat that should also bring a TAG laser along. They'll be able to focus it on whatever it is that they chose to shoot at and you can use the spare tonnage for another medium laser.

Quote

No disrepect taken. It's not me missing shots with the NARC, it's allies not always firing when I NARC.

This is the root of why I asked if this was for PUG games. Generally speaking, LRMs are very effective at killing newer players who haven't learned how to mitigate them, and that tends to skew their balance towards being less effective in organized games. In essence, the more organized your LRM network, the more likely your enemies will know how to mitigate your work by keeping in cover, eliminating the scouts and closing distance.

It also tends to push down your "skill", because 60% of the game you play won't leave you with much opportunity to really do much. There is this old adage around here that says "if you want to improve, don't use LRMs". It's kind of sad, and I personally wish the LRMs could just get buffed back into mainstream competitive use.

Even if Rock is underpowered in Rock-Paper-Scissors, it can still have a place in the meta because it hard-counters Scissors, but being a Rock-boat in such a world will yield lesser reward than either a Scissor-boat or a Paper-boat^LOL.

Quote

Quirks?

Most mech variants (like 99%) have special efficiency with certain equipment which sets them apart from each other. The quirk list for the RVN-3L are as follows:

ADDITIONAL STRUCTURE (LL): 8.00
ADDITIONAL STRUCTURE (RL): 8.00
MISSILE COOLDOWN: 7.50%
LASER DURATION: -7.50%
NARC BEACON RANGE: 50.00
NARC BEACON DURATION: 10.00

Laser duration here means that all laser weapons take less time to deal their full damage, so essentially it's a DPS buff as well as a minor fire rate buff, since "duration" and "cooldown" are combined to determine net rate of fire.

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...ght_innersphere

Edited by Hornsby, 18 April 2015 - 06:41 PM.

[Insects]

ShadowbaneX, on 18 April 2015 - 01:16 PM, said:

Why bother with Beagle when you've got ECM. Drop it for something more useful. I go with NARC, 1t of ammo, and 3 MPLs.

Extends radar range, counters ECM (seems to be debate about this when used with ECM but I dont see a problem?), finds powerdown cowards, puts enemy UAV on radar for teammates, gets target info quicker.
If you are playing scout and support then you really should have it.

[TercieI]

To be perfectly blunt, "support" mechs aren't really useful. If you want to run NARC, run 3ML alongside it for some punch. Better builds on the 3L are 2ERLL or 3ML/2SRM4.

[bad arcade kitty]

3 erll mean ghost heat if alpha and no ecm though

[MonkeyCheese]

Tag and narc can work wonders for your team and your cbill income (if your team cooperates and has lrms) but honestly just 2spl is a joke of an offence and you better hope you never find yourself away from your team because myself and im sure anyone else with speed would rush your build no matter what their firepower is, even my spider 5v. even if you you are trying for a support playstyle making yourself look so lets say "tasty" and not any kind of threat is not a good thing. I have a had plenty of matches in my 171kph 2ml 2mpl hero commando where I can tell when someone chickens out of an engagement with me because of my firepower. If you really must go focus on a "support" build you need to specialize in something and have at least some form of offence.

AMS and BAP are kinda not really worth the tonnage on a large engine ecm carrying light if you had no ecm sure but you have that wonderful magic box on your 3L raven so you will be fine (you just need to know when to counter an enemy ecm), also tag and narc can work together but tag is more of a longrange/sneaking behind enemy lines tool where narc is the in your face run and gun kind of tool.

There are plenty of builds that fit with a tag but with the way the ravens leg hitboxes are these days (they were made larger at one point) you dont really want to be standing around pointing a red beam at someone. I would say keeping the speed, ecm and narc would be the way to go but drop the bap, ams and tag and focus on weapons that fit well with that run and gun kind of gameplay that works well with narc such as rounding a corner/rock/building blapin a round of narc and fast weaponry then retreating to cover again.

I would say 3mpl and narc http://mwo.smurfy-ne...999d574ebc8675a
or 3spl srm4 with 1ton and the narc http://mwo.smurfy-ne...dd39ae439e564e0

Edited by MonkeyCheese, 19 April 2015 - 03:27 AM.

[mailin]

<p>bap combined with ECM loses the ability to counter an enemy ecm, so the only benefit is increased sensor range and target info. You'd be better off losing BAP and ams. That will free up some weight for better weapons and maybe heatsinks if you're worried. Or, a bigger engine.</p>
<p> </p>
<p>Having said all that, the only way to really tell if it works for you is to try it out a few times, make one change and then try it out again. What works well for some may not for others.</p>
<p> </p>
<p>Personally, I really like TAG versus narc. For a couple of reasons, tag weighs less, doesn't require ammo and you can light up many targets at once if you find a good spot. The down sides to tag are that you need to keep it on target, and the enemy can trace the laser back to you. Also, with tag, you or someone on your team needs to lock the target in addition to tagging it.</p>
<div style="left: -1000px; top: 56.29px; width: 1px; height: 1px; overflow: hidden; position: absolute;"> </div>


whoa

[Chocowolf Sradac]

looking at the build I too wlll chime in to swap the small pulse for medium lasers and just do 1 ton of narc and for regular pug matches having both narc and tag is a bit overkill especially for a raven

if you wanted to do tag you could swap the narc over to an srm 4 or 6 to have abit more punch on there and still be able to spot for friendlies with the tag

[Cyberpunk Eevee]

So much input, a lot of it saying similar things.

I'll update the build when I get home, but it looks like, at the very least, AMS and one ton of NARC ammo is getting dropped for bigger engine.

Still iffy about beagle. It supposedly, it also pings enemy uav. Supposedly. I'll have to check that out.

Definitely going up in lasers. May try to squeeze both faster engine and a secondary weapon system.

Thanks for all the input so far!

On tag+narc: I have managed to persuade two friends into joining, and one likes the idea of artillery/LRM boating. Think I'll be set. seriously though keep the input coming it'll help me name the best support I can.

Yes I'm dead set on supporting, it's fun for me, regardless of meta.

[Omi_]

Cyberpunk Eevee, on 19 April 2015 - 08:18 AM, said:

So much input, a lot of it saying similar things.

I'll update the build when I get home, but it looks like, at the very least, AMS and one ton of NARC ammo is getting dropped for bigger engine.

Still iffy about beagle. It supposedly, it also pings enemy uav. Supposedly. I'll have to check that out.

Definitely going up in lasers. May try to squeeze both faster engine and a secondary weapon system.

Thanks for all the input so far!

On tag+narc: I have managed to persuade two friends into joining, and one likes the idea of artillery/LRM boating. Think I'll be set. seriously though keep the input coming it'll help me name the best support I can.

Yes I'm dead set on supporting, it's fun for me, regardless of meta.

Sounds like you've got a solid plan! If by a second weapon system you mean anything in addition to medium lasers, I wouldn't recommend it. With Narc, you're suddenly out of so much spare tonnage that anything more than quirked lasers will leave you wanting.

[Void Angel]

If you really want to use TAG at long range, I'd use This Build. My reasoning is that you do not want to be using TAG at close range with that small engine, so the long-range build synergizes. If you'd rather be faster and have close range firepower, go with This One.

[Cyberpunk Eevee]

A few updates here.

Dropped: AMS, 1t NARC ammo, 2xSmall Lasers, BAP

Boosted: Engine to 295, armor shifted slightlly

Added: SSRM2 w/1ton, 2xMedium Lasers.

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...ba0acf61636d071

[DrSlamastika]

This is mine setup of 3L, you can also drop armor to 6 on left arm, and drop to 14 on head, then you can add a half tone of SRM ammo. If you need it

Edited by DrSlamastika, 19 April 2015 - 01:44 PM.

[Cyberpunk Eevee]

It looks nice, but it seems like it was built for combat support and not for pissing off enemies