127 replies to this topic

[Mystere]

Mister D, on 24 October 2016 - 02:07 PM, said:

Fix hitreg first, then start the debate about JJ's.

Just my opinion.

I say go for the lower-hanging fruit. JJs are easier to fix than hit reg.

Edited by Mystere, 24 October 2016 - 02:11 PM.

[Angel of Annihilation]

Hell yeah they should. I have over 12,000 MC worth of Hero mechs that I bought specifically because of their jump capability that having been sitting in mech bays rusting way since that friken nerf. I would love for my Heavy Metal to be able to actually mount 10 friken tons of JJs and have enough thrust to actually reach the top of one of the ridges on Canyon Network rather than to just be able to hover over small rocks. I might even play my Dragonslayer again if JJs actually worked for it. Hell I might even start mounting JJs on mechs larger than 50 tons again.

God I was so fricken upset and mad when they neutered JJs in this game. I loved them. Hell I actually spent hours and hours in the training grounds learning to be an expect using them and could pull off all kinds of crazy leaps to gain tactical advantage. Almost nothing PGI has done has annoyed me more than destroying JJs as a viable option for heavier mechs. Hell I can think of about 10 mechs I would absolutely have to own right now, if JJs were back to normal. I would even buy the Night Gyr this second if JJ were back to normal.

Ok I think you get the picture. I want JJs back to normal or hell even improved over what they were back in closed beta.

[Requiemking]

Viktor Drake, on 24 October 2016 - 02:20 PM, said:

Hell yeah they should. I have over 12,000 MC worth of Hero mechs that I bought specifically because of their jump capability that having been sitting in mech bays rusting way since that friken nerf. I would love for my Heavy Metal to be able to actually mount 10 friken tons of JJs and have enough thrust to actually reach the top of one of the ridges on Canyon Network rather than to just be able to hover over small rocks. I might even play my Dragonslayer again if JJs actually worked for it. Hell I might even start mounting JJs on mechs larger than 50 tons again.

God I was so fricken upset and mad when they neutered JJs in this game. I loved them. Hell I actually spent hours and hours in the training grounds learning to be an expect using them and could pull off all kinds of crazy leaps to gain tactical advantage. Almost nothing PGI has done has annoyed me more than destroying JJs as a viable option for heavier mechs. Hell I can think of about 10 mechs I would absolutely have to own right now, if JJs were back to normal. I would even buy the Night Gyr this second if JJ were back to normal.

Ok I think you get the picture. I want JJs back to normal or hell even improved over what they were back in closed beta.

You aren't the only one. Many of my jump-capable mechs have had their's stripped away because of how useless they are. Also, Poll results currently indicate that the majority want the JJ nerf to be undone, with the current statistics being 78.12% for, 18.75% against, and 3.12% indifferent.

Edited by Requiemking, 24 October 2016 - 02:25 PM.

[Deathlike]

Please rid of our balance overlord Hoverjets™. Full stop.

[Appogee]

Requiemking, on 24 October 2016 - 01:38 PM, said:

Problem is, people want mechs like the EXE and the Victor to be not useless.

EXE already isn't useless. I load mine up with SPLs and couple of ERLs and it wrecks face. It has some of my best stats in Assaults.

Victor is useless because the dolts at PGI nerfed its agility to be worse than an Atlas. If it had its agility back, so that it turned, acc'd and dec'd like an actual 80 tonner should, it would be a good, fun Mech to pilot again.

Better JJs aren't needed for either of those Mechs.

Requiemking, on 24 October 2016 - 01:38 PM, said:

the Kite has a weaker jump than the Summoner and the Catapult, yet you don't have a problem with that.

Ok, so now I have a problem with the Summoner and Catapult.

Leave poptarting dead. It almost destroyed the game last time it was around.

And this at a time when pop-lurming is becoming a thing thanks to the Hunstman.

No. Just no.

[C E Dwyer]

Yes I think they should be

[C E Dwyer]

Appogee, on 24 October 2016 - 02:44 PM, said:

EXE already isn't useless. I load mine up with SPLs and couple of ERLs and it wrecks face. It has some of my best stats in Assaults.

Victor is useless because the dolts at PGI nerfed its agility to be worse than an Atlas. If it had its agility back, so that it turned, acc'd and dec'd like an actual 80 tonner should, it would be a good, fun Mech to pilot again.

Better JJs aren't needed for either of those Mechs.


Ok, so now I have a problem with the Summoner and Catapult.

Leave poptarting dead. It almost destroyed the game last time it was around.

And this at a time when pop-lurming is becoming a thing thanks to the Hunstman.

No. Just no.

But poptarting isn't dead, the Night Gyr does it quite well, the Summoner, Huntsman, Hunchback IIc and the Nova excel at it, and should Ed become a thing will be able to do it inside the ED penalty, with a 30 pin point, because the change drags ERPPC up to a full 15 damage, not 10+5

[Appogee]

Cathy, on 24 October 2016 - 02:49 PM, said:

But poptarting isn't dead, the Night Gyr does it quite well, the Summoner, Huntsman, Hunchback IIc and the Nova excel at it, and should Ed become a thing will be able to do it inside the ED penalty, with a 30 pin point, because the change drags ERPPC up to a full 15 damage, not 10+5

Good. So we are in agreement then. There is no reason to redo Jump Jets.

[Simbacca]

Jump Jets

=More on mech higher it goes AND faster the acceleration. Thus players who spend the tonnage for proper Jump Jetting gain the benefit. As originally part of the nerf was to deal with mounting a single JJ for manoeuvre purposes.

=To deal with poptarting - the aiming point jitters around. Thus extreme close range poptart attacks will be unaffected, but sniping poptarting (which was the true problem) is remains ineffectual.

[Requiemking]

Appogee, on 24 October 2016 - 02:51 PM, said:

Good. So we are in agreement then. There is no reason to redo Jump Jets.

Except, by leaving JJs the way they are, we not only condemn most of the jump-capable Assault mechs to the trash bin, but also any others that might come along in the future. As it stands, the EXE is a half-decent laserboat at best because it sacrifices a great deal of space on hardlocked JJs. Mechs like the Victor and the Highlander had nothing else going for them beyond that mobility, and the optional JJ pods on the Whale are never used because the tonnage can be better used for other things.

[Lyoto Machida]

Appogee, on 24 October 2016 - 02:44 PM, said:

EXE already isn't useless. I load mine up with SPLs and couple of ERLs and it wrecks face. It has some of my best stats in Assaults.

Victor is useless because the dolts at PGI nerfed its agility to be worse than an Atlas. If it had its agility back, so that it turned, acc'd and dec'd like an actual 80 tonner should, it would be a good, fun Mech to pilot again.

Better JJs aren't needed for either of those Mechs.


Ok, so now I have a problem with the Summoner and Catapult.

Leave poptarting dead. It almost destroyed the game last time it was around.

And this at a time when pop-lurming is becoming a thing thanks to the Hunstman.

No. Just no.

Stop living in the past. Even if those glory days poptart kings of the past (VTR/HGN/CTF-3D) were restored to how effective they were back then, I doubt they'd be the most concerning targets on the other team in 2016.

Besides...from the voting on here, it looks like most people voting disagree with you about leaving JJs as is.

[Requiemking]

Lyoto Machida, on 24 October 2016 - 04:34 PM, said:

Stop living in the past. Even if those glory days poptart kings of the past (VTR/HGN/CTF-3D) were restored to how effective they were back then, I doubt they'd be the most concerning targets on the other team in 2016.

Besides...from the voting on here, it looks like most people voting disagree with you about leaving JJs as is.

Popular opinion so far is that JJs need to be fixed.

[Otto Cannon]

Improving jump jets is not the same as allowing poptart supremacy.

In fact hoverjets are more suited to poptarting than proper mobility jump jets.

Make jumping fast and sudden, and you automatically make it harder to aim and fire. Giving jets a longer cooldown in exchange for greater flight distance would likewise discourage poptarting. But at the same time you restore their tactical use for mobility.

[RestosIII]

Appogee, on 24 October 2016 - 02:51 PM, said:

Good. So we are in agreement then. There is no reason to redo Jump Jets.

So... Assault 2 ton HoverJets are fine?

[Glaive-]

Can we have MWLL jumpjets pls

With slam-you-into-your-seat level of thrust/speed, balanced by high heat and long hang-time in the air due to inertia.
Having the direction control that that game's JJs had would also be awesome. Gives them a ton of versatility for actually getting places (their main intended use).

[El Bandito]

I do not mind improving JJ thrust, but I do not want the old days back, where mechs could jump well even when equipping a single JJ. Therefore, I propose that JJs become increasingly potent the more JJs you equip. For example 3 JJs will offer 4-5 times more thrust than a single JJ. Then people are gonna have REAL FUN with the 12 JJ Spider-5V.

[Mystere]

Appogee, on 24 October 2016 - 02:44 PM, said:

Leave poptarting dead.

No. My Heavy Metal begs to disagree.

[DAYLEET]

I don't know how poptart would do in the game has it is now... Would be superior to everything(again) but a moving group, and i mean TS/Guild group not ragtag voip.

Making JJ better would bring poptart back in full swing for those who can do that at all weight thats for sure. It would dominate again since it is much better than moving from cover to cover or just poking and what do we do now beside poking once weve arrive at the center of most map?

Think of all the new maps we got last year, all good for poptarting fro mthe defensive position we use now for normal defence/poking. The moving forward happens mid/end-game after a side has the upper hand. This would do nothing versus a good group who attack (i mean constantly push). Poking is all we get in pubs, a KD3 who only poke wouldnt look so good anymore. Those who keep pushing would probably still be the monster that they are now.

I was poptarting with four JJ of my BJ2 and it was fine. Good enough to make it possible for four jump before replenishing but weak enough to prevent me from poptarting anywhere i want and just keep it up constantly. You need timing to get high places or to not falloff the edge or out of cover. For meds they are in the right place. Its good that meds have this.

I do have a problem with JJ and its mostly apparent with Lights but the "bug" is wit hall weight class. Center_legs_on_torso only works half the times in the air and that fkup any dogfighting you can hope to do with lights. Many times you hit the ground and your leg never centered and now you run against something or toward the enemy and ur toast because of that.

Edited by DAYLEET, 25 October 2016 - 06:47 PM.

[Steinar Bergstol]

El Bandito, on 24 October 2016 - 09:11 PM, said:

Then people are gonna have REAL FUN with the 12 JJ Spider-5V.

Up, up and away! To infinity and beyond! Bang! Zoom! To the moon!

That might actually make me break out my Spider 5V again just for the pure hillarity of it (yes, it still has 12 JJs installed)

[Sarsaparilla Kid]

Seems to me, though, that the JJ nerf hurt more IS mechs than Clan mechs...where everyone can name more IS variants that are garbage now compared to other IS mechs with ground-based quirks and to most Clan mechs. Since I was an FRR loyalist, I only played IS mechs, and when they gimped IS mechs with JJs and released the Clan mechs (pre-nerfs, pre-quirks), I took a long break.