63 replies to this topic

[Lord Jay]

This question is for all the people who get to play far more than I do...

What is the impact of Artemis on SRMs?

I'm guessing it is not nearly as dramatic as the LRM changes or there would be whines about it already. ;-)

But to hear nothing makes me think the effects are virtually non-existent.

So anyone notice any reason to use Artemis on SRMs?

[Lord Jay]

Might as well close this thread since somebody else posted the exact same question while I was typing this one up...

http://mwomercs.com/...54-srm-artemis/

[Sir Prometheus]

Need to move onto a new Awesome for exp reasons, thinking of getting the QR with the 4 missile hardpoints, and just going hardcore SRM brawler, see if I can take out Atlas's at close range (I can currently, with my med pulse build).

My Major question is does anyone know how much Artemis helps? 4 tons and 4 slots to upgrade 4 SRM 6's doesn't sound like a big deal, particularly for such a low-heat build, but I'd hate to pay the c-bill cost blind.

[MustrumRidcully]

SRMs used to be, at some point in Closed Beta, as precise as they are now with Artemis. I think they may be too imprecise by default without Artemis, but I think they help a lot, and if you consider an SRM brawler, I would definitely suggest Artemis for SRMs.
(Beware though that the Awesome's large head hit box makes it a good target at close range).

[Sir Prometheus]

Thanks....I've been running an awesome basically since starting. I get a lot of Center torso damage (same as everyone else) but have never had trouble with head dmg.

[Huntsman]

The grouping for srms with artemis is supposed to be tighter, but tbh I'm not sure there's much of a difference. I'm sorta using my imagination to see any difference at all frankly.

[Asatruer]

I cannot really quantify how much it helps and pretty much only have anecdotal evidence, but I find that it helps enough with my dual SRM6s on my HBK-4SP. Dropped two MLs, added the Artemis FCS, and have been pretty happy. The tightening of the cluster makes the SRM volleys noticeably better when brawling at close ranges, and even increases the effective range since it takes longer for the clusters to spread out far enough to make it not worth shooting.

The one thing that I do find a little annoying about adding the FCS is that it is harder for me to score hits on speedy lights than it was before, but on the plus side, when I do they are more deadly. I cored a Raven with one volley to the back as it was trying to run away from me, without the FCS, it would have gotten away.

[Valore]

Better with Artemis.

If it gives you an idea, its between how LBX used to be, and how it is now.

That said, I think most SRM boats are LRM boats who realised that post-hotfix, using Artemis LRMs is basically the equivalent of using gold plated bullets, i.e. costly without justification.

[multiplesanta34]

Does TAG have the same effect on SRMs?

[Nolium]

multiplesanta34, on 09 November 2012 - 11:03 AM, said:

Does TAG have the same effect on SRMs?

It should't, since they're not guided.

[Mr 144]

multiplesanta34, on 09 November 2012 - 11:03 AM, said:

Does TAG have the same effect on SRMs?

I always run TAG on my HBK, so it's hard for me to say, as I TAG everything out of force of habit. I can tell you, with TAG+Artemis, a single SRM6 will have almost ballistic trajectory and is useable for the first time at longer ranges. I personally think it's worth it, but like I said, I run TAG always anyhow.

I'm not suggesting SRMs are accurate or anything at range, but given a free pot-shot at a powered down mech at 180m, I can confidently land all 6 missles on target with a high chance of multiple single section hits. This was all but impossible pre-artemis.

Nolium, on 09 November 2012 - 11:08 AM, said:

It should't, since they're not guided.

From the MWO wiki, as it's next to immpossible to search for TAG on the forums...dumb 3 letter restriction...but I know it's been mentioned here as well, just can't find it.

Quote

Target Acquisition Gear is an infrared laser for the purpose of guiding LRMs onto the target, thereby increasing the hit rate and damage, while also reducing lock on time. In the current stage of beta, it also slightly tightens the grouping of SRMs and increases accuracy of Streak SRMs slightly. The TAG Laser uses one energy hardpoint.

Mr 144

Edited by Mr 144, 09 November 2012 - 11:19 AM.

[Skaulic]

Artemis has made SRM6 an attractive option again for brawlers. Using just two of them, I find there is the added simple satisfaction to be had from obliterating light mechs that have overheat shutdown and face the full brunt of weapons that the lag shield normally protects them from.

[Agent 0 Fortune]

to quote the dev's, SRM's with artemis are 23.61% tighter grouping than non-artemis SRMs at 63.11% range with a 7.09% deviation, but only against mechs with a 72.88% or greater hitbox standarization, and only when within a 24.63% tollerance of netcode optimized efficiency. However, it is possible that users will note an overall degredation of performance as the splash damage has been reduced 47.55%, and when combined with the above stated grouping modifications produce 16.34% less damage overall at ranges exceeding 18.47% maximum range, but a 32.14% more damage to a single hitbox locations (excepting those outside standard deviation specifications).

[Sir Prometheus]

Agent 0 Fortune, on 09 November 2012 - 11:24 AM, said:

to quote the dev's, SRM's with artemis are 23.61% tighter grouping than non-artemis SRMs at 63.11% range with a 7.09% deviation, but only against mechs with a 72.88% or greater hitbox standarization, and only when within a 24.63% tollerance of netcode optimized efficiency. However, it is possible that users will note an overall degredation of performance as the splash damage has been reduced 47.55%, and when combined with the above stated grouping modifications produce 16.34% less damage overall at ranges exceeding 18.47% maximum range, but a 32.14% more damage to a single hitbox locations (excepting those outside standard deviation specifications).

So while those are interesting numbers, I'm having trouble interpreting what they mean in practical terms. Atremis SRMS have slightly less splash dmg than regular SRMs?

[Mr 144]

Sir Prometheus, on 09 November 2012 - 11:28 AM, said:

So while those are interesting numbers, I'm having trouble interpreting what they mean in practical terms. Atremis SRMS have slightly less splash dmg than regular SRMs?

lol...confusing indeed. I interpret it as the same as my in-game experience. Previously, when taking pot-shots at anything over 90m, I aimed for the mech. Now, I aim for the specific section. If you like the shotgun approach, don't use artemis. If your twitch and aim is good and want more precise damage at the expense of *splat*...then artemis is for you. Both practices are equally viable IMO.

Mr 144

[Asatruer]

Nolium, on 09 November 2012 - 11:08 AM, said:

It should't, since they're not guided.

If SRMs were dead-fire, then the FCS would not help them either, but since the Artemis IV Fire Control System is a guidance system that utilizes an infrared laser designator and tight-beam microwave transmitter, it sounds an awful lot like a TAG does it not? Though with the upgrade to Artemis FCS, the ammo is also upgraded. In TT, FCS launchers did not need to upgrade the ammo to make use of the system, but in in MWO we do.

In MWO SRMs are are not guided, but SRMs in TT are direct fire, but not dead fire.
In TT there was also dead-fire missiles, for both SRM and LRM systems, that removed the guidance systems for larger warheads that did more damage per missile, but less missiles were likely to hit. It is as if PGI gave us dead-fire SRMs without the damage boost. If SRMs worked in like TT, they would have lock-on just like LRMs, but Streaks would still be better because Streak is supposed to guarantee all rather than some of the missiles hit various parts of the target mech.

If PGI added the ability to upgrade our standard SRM ammo to follow a laser designator, then mounting a TAG rather than the FCS in each missile pack should work. Honestly, LRMs should not gain benefit from TAG either without being upgraded to Semi-Guided LRMs but those are not available till 3057. Though since TAG in this era would be kind of useless without Arrow IV or other artie, PGI gave it a use.

Now, NARCs in this time period could be used in conjunction with SRMs and LRMs equally, but yet again, the SRMs and LRMs would have to be special twice as expensive ones.

[Bilbo]

Having run 3 SRM6s on my D-DC throughout closed and open beta, I can say they are again evil with Artemis. The difference is quite noticable.

[Stormur Herra]

Switching from SRM6s to Artemis SRM4s (yay, the joy of trying to cram weapons into a 25 ton mech), I managed my first solo kill on an Atlas (he was a bigger noob than me), and definitely see tighter grouping.

I could almost swear that the SRMs sometimes curve slightly towards the target, though i think that's a trick of the angle at which my arm is firing them. (Also, only noticeable at 100+m)

[Sir Prometheus]

Well, this is really meant as a High-dmg low-heat approach to brawling with other heavies and assaults. SO precision (punching through chest armor) would be a lot more important than shotgunning. Not to be snotty but keeping jenners off my back is my wingman's job.

Currently I run a AWS-9M (except I ditched the XL engine and DHS, added endo, it has little resemblance to the original) with 2 ER PCCs for long range sniping (and the 4x zoom upgrade....everyone hates it but it works well for me) and 4x Medium Pulse lasers. THe PPCs let me do some consistent-low dmg to people at the 1000-1200 meter range. (strategic value is often just that it makes a gauss atlas back off a ridge-line)

4 Medium Pulses let me pretty consistently beat up atlas's, but I do overheat (so do they), I have 30 Heatsinks.

I have to get a new Awesome for exp reasons, and I'm thinking a AWS-QR might do the trick. Will probably look like 4 x SRM 6 + artemis in the torso, and a large laser in the right arm just so I'm not useless at longer ranges.

3 slots, 4 tons per artemis SRM 6 (plus ammo) doesn't seem too bad, total of 12 slots 16 tons. Would generate 60 dmg as an alpha strike (but more likely to chain)......that seems pretty likely to knock an Atlas on his butt.

[3rdworld]

Tag only helps at longer ranges...if the target isn't moving. SRMs will converge at a spot designated by tag if you shoot directly at it, they will not alter their course to hit the target. So TAG just improves the grouping if it was already going to hit.

Artemis seems to make SRMs as good as they were before the nerf (as far as spread goes), but the delay is still pretty bad with SRM6s.