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Now That The Cataphract 4X Exists, We Can See The True Power Of The Ac5.


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#1 Lefty Lucy

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Posted 21 November 2012 - 09:34 AM

So, the AC5 has actually been one of the most efficient ballistic choices in the game since they tweaked AC firing rates. I think people have simply been hesitant to adopt them because they don't have the same "stream of shells" effect that the AC2 does, and they don't have the "damn that's a hard hit" effect as AC20 or Gauss.

However, their DPS/ton is better than every ballistic other than the AC2, but they have an excellent 5:1 damage/heat ratio, where the AC2 is only 2:1.

Now that we have a chassis that can effectively "boat" the AC5, I think we are finally seeing its true power.

I personally think it could be better balanced if it generated an extra heat per shot.

#2 flunkorg

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Posted 21 November 2012 - 09:35 AM

Gauss rifles where soooooo yesterday...

#3 Jaded Jasper

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Posted 21 November 2012 - 09:37 AM

The AC 5 is a subpar weapon even on a Cataphract X. Try instead 2xUAC5 + 2xAC2.

#4 Leetskeet

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Posted 21 November 2012 - 09:37 AM

Hey that's cool and I'mma let you finish, but Quad AC/5 Cataphracts suck

Edited by Leetskeet, 21 November 2012 - 09:37 AM.


#5 MustrumRidcully

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Posted 21 November 2012 - 09:38 AM

Also, there weren't any mechs that could "boat" 4 of them. If you have the choice between 2 AC/5s and 2 Gauss Rifles, you are well off with the Gauss Rifle. Hard point limitations can screw the perception of balance - if certain "OP" combos cannot be build effectively, it won't happen, even if the potential is there.

Just as a reminder on damage efficiency, in case you somehow managed to miss one of these charts:

Posted Image

You'll notice the AC/5 is about the level the Gauss is in terms of damage to weight efficiency. (THis is accounting for ammo needs, heat sink requirements to fire the weapon for 20 respectively for 90 seconds.)
If you can take only 2 ballistic weapons, you're still getting more out of a Gauss Rifle, simply because it delivers more damage (3.75 DPS vs 2.94), but if you can choose between 2 Gauss or 4 AC/5s.. (Or just 3 AC/5s, really)... THings change.

Spoiler

Edited by MustrumRidcully, 21 November 2012 - 09:44 AM.


#6 SmithMPBT

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Posted 21 November 2012 - 09:40 AM

I'm supposed to be able to fire 2 weapons groups separately and drive my mech with the X2 UAC5 X2 AC2 build?

#7 Purlana

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Posted 21 November 2012 - 09:42 AM

I will bet money on my AC/20 Cat over a AC/5 boat any day of the week.

#8 Khavi Vetali

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Posted 21 November 2012 - 09:52 AM

View PostSmithMPBT, on 21 November 2012 - 09:40 AM, said:

I'm supposed to be able to fire 2 weapons groups separately and drive my mech with the X2 UAC5 X2 AC2 build?

Bit dickish saying this, but if you have trouble with this perhaps you should stick to streakcats.

#9 SMDMadCow

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Posted 21 November 2012 - 09:56 AM

View PostSmithMPBT, on 21 November 2012 - 09:40 AM, said:

I'm supposed to be able to fire 2 weapons groups separately and drive my mech with the X2 UAC5 X2 AC2 build?


you don't have 2 mouse buttons?

#10 Applecrow

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Posted 21 November 2012 - 10:06 AM

The (U)AC/5 Phract is damn nasty, BUT it does have serious drawbacks, like just about every other mech.

(other than lights + lagshield)

Skill will always > loadout anyway.

#11 SmithMPBT

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Posted 21 November 2012 - 10:15 AM

View PostSMDMadCow, on 21 November 2012 - 09:56 AM, said:


you don't have 2 mouse buttons?


I guess my sarcasm would have come through if it was said verbally. ;)

#12 MorsMortis

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Posted 21 November 2012 - 10:21 AM

My Fatlas Brawler has been munching on phracts all day, quite tasty!

#13 Reoh

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Posted 21 November 2012 - 10:24 AM

View PostPurlana, on 21 November 2012 - 09:42 AM, said:

I will bet money on my AC/20 Cat over a AC/5 boat any day of the week.


Depends how close the Ac20cat is and what long range weapons I have. ;)

#14 Urza Mechwalker

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Posted 21 November 2012 - 10:28 AM

When they implement 12 v12 you will be nuts to use a full ballistics setup. If you are the last mech alive in your team you will not have any bullets to shoot.


They need to fix the PPCS ( HALVE their heat generation) and things will fall in the expected places.

#15 Karyudo ds

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Posted 21 November 2012 - 10:37 AM

View PostLefty Lucy, on 21 November 2012 - 09:34 AM, said:

Now that we have a chassis that can effectively "boat" the AC5, I think we are finally seeing its true power.


Pffft... Jagermech?

I have a feeling they might get tweaked a bit by then of course. I guess on the plus side I see fewer Medium Laser boats...

View PostUrza Mechwalker, on 21 November 2012 - 10:28 AM, said:

When they implement 12 v12 you will be nuts to use a full ballistics setup.


I've noticed they've been rather mum about that. Hope you're right though.

#16 wanderer

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Posted 21 November 2012 - 10:42 AM

I admit, I'm considering twin AC/5 + twin AC/2, just to help keep the heat down a bit vs. quad AC/2's but have a high ROF. Which is kinda amusing to me, it means in MWO the Jagermech actually makes sense.

#17 Vasces Diablo

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Posted 21 November 2012 - 10:43 AM

Earlier in Beta, I was rocking a dual Ultra AC 5 Catapult. God help anyone who got caught in the open. I consistently produce the most damage per match for my groups.

#18 Tuhalu

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Posted 21 November 2012 - 10:47 AM

View PostVasces Diablo, on 21 November 2012 - 10:43 AM, said:

Earlier in Beta, I was rocking a dual Ultra AC 5 Catapult. God help anyone who got caught in the open. I consistently produce the most damage per match for my groups.

Before UAC5 jamming, I played a few games with 4 of us rocking 75kph cats with 2x UAC/5. One time, we saw a Catapult through the trees in Caustic Valley and cored him in about 3 seconds flat without even stopping on the way to the enemy base (yes, I know there were 4 of us, still bloody impressive!). With the changes to the jamming rules, expect to see builds with UAC/5 back in force ;)

#19 Lefty Lucy

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Posted 21 November 2012 - 10:54 AM

View PostUrza Mechwalker, on 21 November 2012 - 10:28 AM, said:

When they implement 12 v12 you will be nuts to use a full ballistics setup. If you are the last mech alive in your team you will not have any bullets to shoot.


They need to fix the PPCS ( HALVE their heat generation) and things will fall in the expected places.


*If* they implement 12 v 12, you'll probably see 4X with 2 ML.

#20 MadPanda

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Posted 21 November 2012 - 11:02 AM

View PostJaded Jasper, on 21 November 2012 - 09:37 AM, said:

The AC 5 is a subpar weapon even on a Cataphract X. Try instead 2xUAC5 + 2xAC2.


You will not be able to fit in enough ammo for a balanced match. Your ammo will only be enough for clear stomps of the enemy. Any opposition and you will notice yourself out of ammo half way of the round. And yes I own the 4X model, this is not speculation but tried and tested.

I should mention that 5x AC5 or 5x AC2 are the two builds that can somewhat have a reasonable amount of ammo to get through a round without running out. Having single ammo type is key.

Edited by MadPanda, 21 November 2012 - 11:05 AM.






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