155 replies to this topic

[Machinae Mortis]

New options have been added at respondents' request. Please delete vote and revote if so desired.

Edit: I've added Voidsinger's option because it seems like the best idea proposed so far. It's brilliant and is rooted in the TT rules. Also seems to have a lot of pull with some posters here. You can find more information in his thread here:

http://mwomercs.com/...streak-control/

I've also added "Leave them alone" as an option despite the devs saying that this is a done deal. I will update more options if requested by multiple people.


It's already been stated that the change is coming:

http://mwomercs.com/...ost__p__1478707

So how do you think it should be implemented?

I left out "a combination of the above" because I didn't think it would be statistically beneficial. If this ever was used as evidence of what the community wants combinations could be reviewed internally. Also, since the current state of SSRM's are a product of a combination buff, I'm guessing a combination nerf is probably less likely as they don't want to repeat the error in the other direction.

An "All of the above" answer would garner bias from people fed up with it.

Impact concussion (screen shake) is probably going to be lowered independent of the nerf.

Personally, I think that the accuracy should be diminished. Firing while you're facing the other direction is kind of silly and sums up why people dislike them so much. Previously, you had to fire in the direction of your target to land a hit and had to lead your target if you wanted to guarantee a direct hit. Though the skill curve might be slight, I'm a proponent of anything that increases skill required. There's a big difference between having to lead your target slightly and not even having to have him in your sights.

Damage I feel is a second best option mostly because I feel strongly about the accuracy being ludicrous.

I don't really feel rate of fire is a good option, but I included it because I saw it recommended elsewhere. Rate of fire doesn't account for the fact that just one volley from an A1 can be monstrous and that it doesn't impact in/out combat whatsoever.

Honestly, I was fine with how they were before so I would be happy with a complete reversion (this would equate to accuracy/damage). They should continue to be useful in the vs light fights while not being so ridiculous that they're mounted as the sole weapon.

As a last note, I realize that any one of these options go against TT, but it was stated a nerf is coming. It's safe to assume we're working outside the box now.

Anyway, try to keep it constructive. The change is coming. I'm just curious what other people feel it should be (and why).

Edited by Jlad, 25 November 2012 - 07:26 PM.

[MustrumRidcully]

I vote for a reduced rate of fire. SSRMs are supposed to only fire when a hit is guaranteed, and otherwise had the same to-hit characters as SRMs. THis seems to be best represented by a reduced rate of fire. How low their rate of fire would need to be to be balanced, I don't know. Maybe by 1 to 2 seconds?

I just hope they don't end up overnerfing again. WOuldn't be surprised if they first find a bug that leads to the SSRM getting more precise than planned, or dealing more damage than planned, and then still nerf the damage... But we'll see.

[Undercover Brother]

I don't use SSRMs, BUT:

1: SSRMs REQUIRE A LOCK before they can even be fired

2: SSRMs have a short range, so as long as a target can stay outside of that range, SSRMs are useless.

3: SSRMs weigh much more than a Medium Laser, and require ammunition, therefore, a person can mount 4 MLasers for every 1 SSRM (therefore SSRMs are NOT O.P.)

4: The only people who complain about SSRMs cannot come to grips with any of the above points, which is why they keep getting killed, and therefore, THEY WHINE ABOUT IT.

[Tickdoff Tank]

Someone else mentioned this idea, but I don't remember who it was or which thread it was in:

Once you fire the SSRMs you lose lock and must re-acquire lock before firing again. I think the idea is interesting, especially if you increased the lock on time for streaks a bit. You could still get off a solid hit but it would reduce the ROF of the weapon unless you are able to get lock again quickly. Additionally, if you tried to chian fire the SSRMs you would lose lock after the first shot, so you would need to link all of them together and 1 big burst of streaks causes less screen shake than the chin firing does.

I am not totally convinced that this is the solution, but it does offer some interesting possibilities.

[Smokem Jags]

Why not just use the proper canon solutions.
Their damage is spread across more of the Mech and AMS is an effective counter measure to missile boats, both LRM and SRM, especially when chain fired.

[Destoroyah]

You should add a reduction to screen shake option as that's the one that streak cats are uniquely suited to exploit.

[Tickdoff Tank]

T Decker, on 25 November 2012 - 12:04 PM, said:

I don't use SSRMs, BUT:

3: SSRMs weigh much more than a Medium Laser, and require ammunition, therefore, a person can mount 4 MLasers for every 1 SSRM (therefore SSRMs are NOT O.P.)

1 SSRM2 weighs 1.5 tons. 1 ton of ammo +weapon system= 2.5 tons and generates 2 heat, does 5 damage that never misses. Cooldown 3.5 seconds

1 Medium laser weighs 1 ton. no ammo. 4 heat. 5 damage. Must hold on the target for full damage. Cooldown 3 seconds.

You can NOT mount 4 medium lasers for 1 streak.

And even if you could, no mech could mount 24 medium lasers. Which, by your reasoning, is what the Catapult A1 is equal to.

Edit: I don't think SSRMs are OP either, but they are close. I do think that they could use a little downward adjustment.

Edited by Tickdoff Tank, 25 November 2012 - 12:15 PM.

[Sevaradan]

they're streaks they cant miss so option 1 is automatically out.

[Tickdoff Tank]

Sevaradan, on 25 November 2012 - 12:13 PM, said:

they're streaks they cant miss so option 1 is automatically out.

Agreed. SSRMs should never miss once you have lock. In TT you had to roll to hit and if you rolled a miss then the SSRMs would not fire. That roll to hit was equivalent to us obtaining lock in MWO. But, in TT, you did have to roll to hit each time you wanted to fire them, which is one reason that I find it a intriguing idea to make the SSRMs lose lock after each shot.

[superteds]

Just knock down the shake + smoke a bit. They're only really dangerous when boated (A1), and that is essentially using a heavy mechs DPS potential purely to deal with lights. Actual DPS isn't great at all, and i'd argue they're only really common because of how much of a pain in the arse lights are with the current lag-shield/ballistic convergence mechanics/no knockdown issues.

[J4ckInthebox]

Quote

How Do You Think Streaks Should Be Nerfed?

[Machinae Mortis]

Destoroyah, on 25 November 2012 - 12:09 PM, said:

You should add a reduction to screen shake option as that's the one that streak cats are uniquely suited to exploit.

So people don't miss it I went back and bolded the part that said "Impact concussion (screen shake) is probably going to be lowered independent of the nerf."

Sevaradan, on 25 November 2012 - 12:13 PM, said:

they're streaks they cant miss so option 1 is automatically out.

Canon makes all options impossible. Thus we're working outside the box. Also, accuracy can be influenced by lock-on times and lock loss sensitivity. Lock loss can get rid of 90 degree firing just as well as hit/miss ratios can.

Edited by Jlad, 25 November 2012 - 12:28 PM.

[Lefty Lucy]

In damage/heat ratio, SSRM are close to ballistics, however in DPS/Ton ratio they are close to energy weapons. Right now they kind of have the best of both worlds *and* automatically hit with very little skill required.

I like the idea of breaking lock after every firing cycle, but barring that they need a straight-up DPS reduction, probably best achieved by having a longer recycle time.

[Felicitatem Parco]

They are now getting around to damage-proportionate screen shake with the proposed upcoming AC/20 impact buff. And I believe some prior Mech Warrior games usually assigned the guided or upgraded versions of weapons a longer cool-down or a higher heat than their lower-tech brethren.

I'm hoping they'll be able to make a full sweep of the Weapons Table and tune the items individually within the next 2 or 3 months, but it can be hard to experiment with multiple, simultaneous dynamic variables.

Edited by Prosperity Park, 25 November 2012 - 12:27 PM.

[Flying Blind]

Losing lock is interesting, I think I like it. I liked how streaks tracked before the nerf. If target was still they would always hit but a very fast target could lose them.

If we don't do the lock loss, then revert traking to old level but not seeking center torso and maybe reduce damage a bit.
I play a steak cat and it feels stronger than ever.

[Codejack]

Write-in: They should not be nerfed.

[mike29tw]

How about lower the missiles speed so AMS can actually intercept them ?

[Jman5]

The shake reduction is going to be crucial. My screen turns into a giant clusterf*ck when the streaks start flying at me. Also, I think the weapon damage spread should include arms and head.

[Machinae Mortis]

Codejack, on 25 November 2012 - 12:39 PM, said:

Write-in: They should not be nerfed.

Check the link. It's happening, so this isn't a valid option. It's basically an "abstain."

[Cid]

option 4: spread hits to sidetorsos as well

option 5: improve AMS efficiency vs SRMs