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[Poll] Ecm On All Mechs?


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Poll: ECM on all mechs (296 member(s) have cast votes)

Should ECM be available to all mechs?

  1. Yes (44 votes [14.86%])

    Percentage of vote: 14.86%

  2. No (252 votes [85.14%])

    Percentage of vote: 85.14%

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#1 Fate 6

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 10:41 PM

I've heard some people saying they think ECM should be made available to all mechs, so I wanted to know what the general feeling was on the forum.

Personally, I think the mechs that have the option are the right choices (although I think the Cicada variant chosen should have been the 5 energy variant, and all Ravens should have it). That being said, I don't think any of the other mechs should have it. The ones that have it are enough, especially given the current strength of the system.

Edited by Fate 6, 29 November 2012 - 10:42 PM.


#2 p00k

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 10:46 PM

when they fix the netcode and put collisions back in (months away judging from latest dev posts), i'll be more open to the idea. as it stands, o god no

#3 Obadiah333

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 10:46 PM

Posted about this many, many times already. ECM for everyone. I have YET to hear a valid reason why some mechs should get it and others shouldn't. If it's because ECM is OP, why should only some mechs get OP equipment and not all of them? Does that make any sense whatsoever? NO, NO IT DOES NOT. Well, maybe it's only the weak mechs that need it for a "buff'? Adding OP equipment might fix the weak mech, but it breaks the game. NOT AN OPTION. ECM for everyone!!! The revolution starts NOW!!

#4 Broceratops

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 10:48 PM

too powerful to put on all mechs. its a support type item and should be only given to support type mechs. if everyone could carry it then you're not going down the path where we have roles, you're going down the path where everything is min/max regardless of chassis

#5 SirLANsalot

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 10:52 PM

View PostObadiah333, on 29 November 2012 - 10:46 PM, said:

Posted about this many, many times already. ECM for everyone. I have YET to hear a valid reason why some mechs should get it and others shouldn't. If it's because ECM is OP, why should only some mechs get OP equipment and not all of them? Does that make any sense whatsoever? NO, NO IT DOES NOT. Well, maybe it's only the weak mechs that need it for a "buff'? Adding OP equipment might fix the weak mech, but it breaks the game. NOT AN OPTION. ECM for everyone!!! The revolution starts NOW!!



You must be on some meds or sommin. ECM is made for certain mechs only as those mechs were build with ECM in mind. As such most light mechs can use it and a very few meds and even fewer heavier mechs then that can. Its because it is quite a powerful system and even more so when IFF jammers come in. Which again only a few mechs can use IFF and one that will really make people mad (IFF makes it so that enemy mech looks like a friendly until is comes within 300m of a true friendly).

#6 Fate 6

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 10:53 PM

View PostBroceratops, on 29 November 2012 - 10:48 PM, said:

too powerful to put on all mechs. its a support type item and should be only given to support type mechs. if everyone could carry it then you're not going down the path where we have roles, you're going down the path where everything is min/max regardless of chassis

This was my thought was well. We want roles, not Swiss army knife mechs.

#7 Obadiah333

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 10:56 PM

View PostSirLANsalot, on 29 November 2012 - 10:52 PM, said:



You must be on some meds or sommin. ECM is made for certain mechs only as those mechs were build with ECM in mind. As such most light mechs can use it and a very few meds and even fewer heavier mechs then that can. Its because it is quite a powerful system and even more so when IFF jammers come in. Which again only a few mechs can use IFF and one that will really make people mad (IFF makes it so that enemy mech looks like a friendly until is comes within 300m of a true friendly).


Funny, because I thought AMS was "only for some mechs," yet every mech has it. One even has TWO of them! I cite precedence here (AMS) - some mechs no, all mechs yes. If it's that powerful, please explain to me why certain mechs having OP equipment won't break the game. Your explanation so far tells me that only some mechs should have it, but not WHY. The OP equipment argument isn't valid, unless you think that OP equipment for only certain mechs is fine. In which case I think it's YOU that are on meds.

#8 Miken

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 10:57 PM

At least ECM must be available to different type of same mechs, if one raven have ECM, then why all other ravens have not? It is the same platform!!!

Edited by Miken, 29 November 2012 - 11:05 PM.


#9 Voidsinger

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 10:58 PM

Here is the problem with picking and choosing mechs.

It means ECM has become a major tactics changer, and hands over power to those who run in those mechs. Nice for the Raven fanboys. Too bad if you have issues with the mechs they chose, you can't mount it.

It is forcing role by chassis upon people, which mostly affects the medium mechs (getting increasingly marginalised), and lights, which had load issues which limited them anyway.

For ECM to be effective, it will require training with the same people to keep pace with the ECM mechs, and remain within the bubble. This further advantages premades over pugs, and makes rollovers much more likely, even with premade half-teams.

Look at the mechs they chose initially. Mostly fast strikers. ECM means they're either offensive ECM, in which case the team has no defensive, or defensive, which takes a scout/striker off the line. Mkaes pug implementation close to impossible.The Atlas DC is the only mech that does what it likes, unaffected except the tonnage and criticals.

#10 Deadoon

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 11:03 PM

Are you guys afraid of the ecm that much? Not having it on all mechs is not going to change the fact that it is going to be used by every atlas, every cicada, every raven and every commando that can mount it.

Now the difficult question for all of you.
WHY is it impossible to mount on other chassis?

#11 Voidsinger

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 11:08 PM

View PostSirLANsalot, on 29 November 2012 - 10:52 PM, said:



You must be on some meds or sommin. ECM is made for certain mechs only as those mechs were build with ECM in mind. As such most light mechs can use it and a very few meds and even fewer heavier mechs then that can. Its because it is quite a powerful system and even more so when IFF jammers come in. Which again only a few mechs can use IFF and one that will really make people mad (IFF makes it so that enemy mech looks like a friendly until is comes within 300m of a true friendly).


You are totally incorrect on this.

Yes, Guardian ECM needs integration, any equipment does. However, it has often been retrofitted into other chasses. You need look no further than the SLDF's royal units and their special mechs.

The systems that would require the system to be designed in from the start would be the null signature system, and the Chameleon Light Polarisation.

Guardian integrated into the communications sytems on mechs, BAP into Targetting and tracking.

You shoot your entire argument in the foot though. The Raven was designed for a completely different form of ECM system. Yet was retrofitted with BAP and GECM as soon as they became available. Now the experience of integrating the initial ECM on the Raven may have helped make it a first cab off the rank, but there was zero about the raven that made it special for GECM or BAP. Software familiarity may have helped.

The initial 3050 description spent a few lines describing how BAP integrated well with the Apple Churchill T&T system, nothing about the comms system or GECM.

Interesting to note that the communications system on the Raven 3L is the Ceres Metal Series 666 with Guardian ECM.

The Raven is truly *****'s mech.

#12 Wizard Steve

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 11:15 PM

I feel it's important to have niche mechs to prevent them being marginalised so no.

#13 Deadoon

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 11:18 PM

View PostWizard Steve, on 29 November 2012 - 11:15 PM, said:

I feel it's important to have niche mechs to prevent them being marginalised so no.

Problem is by buffing these mechs with such a powerful EW suite which the only true hard counter to is itself you cause stagnation in mech choice.

#14 General Taskeen

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Posted 30 November 2012 - 12:26 AM

The only reason to mount ECM on specific Mech's is to provide variety. Otherwise, there is no reason to have variants of Mech's. It has nothing to do with any fluff rule. There are some Mech's in BT that have variants with ECM and some that don't, so it kind of goes hand-in-hand with MWO's way of making a Mech variant unique in what it can equip.

People really need to calm down on this issue, considering that very few Mech's are in-game and many future Mech's have variants with ECM. There will be very few to play with early on, but later on that list is going to expand.

In my opinion, the current list of ECM equip-able Mechs should be changed. However, some of these will probably even change, based on what the Dev comment in the ECM Command Chair thread said, "As we add new Mechs into the game, some of them will be ECM capable, and we may even go back and reconsider existing Mechs deserving of the capability.":

From this
  • Commando COM-2D
  • Raven RVN-3L
  • Cicada CDA-3M
  • Atlas AS7-D-DC
To be reconsidered for change in future when additional ECM Mech's arrive:
  • Commando COM-2D - None ever used on Commando variants (Plus I don't see why the best Commando needs ECM, why not one of the 'weaker' variants to make it more viable?)
  • Raven RVN-3L - Factory equipped (and other variants, 4L for instance)
  • Cicada CDA-3M - None ever used on Cicada variants
  • Atlas AS7-D-DC - Possibly keep since Atlas gets a future variant the AS7-S2 (so until that arrives, this might be a good choice), or remove based on the current canon variants that have ECM below
Additions to the basic starting list:
  • Assault Stalker STK-3F - Why? The STK-3Fb sub-variant mounts an ECM (The Stalker has a tentative release schedule of December 18th)
  • Medium Hunchback HBK-4P (or some current HBK variant) - Why? The HBK-5P appearing later on gets ECM
  • Heavy Cataphract CTF-3D ( or some other current CTF variant, could change to CTF-3L when MASC is added) - Why? The CTF-4L appearing 3060s get ECM
(with this new list, it would cover all weight classes with current mechs making everyone happier perhaps)







For consideration of other Mechs that appear later:
  • Light Flea FLE-17 - Why? The FLE-20 appearing in 3071 gets ECM
  • Light Spider SDR-5V - Why? The SPD-7K, sub-variant 7Kr, is fitted with experimental Angel ECM in 3067-74
  • Heavy JagerMech JM7-DD - Why? The JM7-F (uniquely upgrades JagerMech to 70 tons) gets ECM in 3062
  • Assault Awesome AWS-9M - Why? The AWS-9Q, an upgrade package for the 8Q/9M series, gets ECM in 3057 (I didn't add this to the basic starting list since that would give 3 Assault's starting out with ECM)

Edited by General Taskeen, 30 November 2012 - 12:39 AM.


#15 Deadoon

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Posted 30 November 2012 - 12:35 AM

View PostGeneral Taskeen, on 30 November 2012 - 12:26 AM, said:


What is preventing us, as we are already doing something out of the norm, actually customizing our mechs, not being able to mount something that is star league era technology. Word of god. That is all, nothing else, just the devs said only specific things WE want you to have you can have. In a game which has pretty much been dictated by customization already this is a bad precedent.

By limiting it to certain chassis you prevent people, not just from customizing their mechs as they like, but remove entire chassis as being viable choices. such as the atlas D and rs models, the raven model 2x, the commando models as a whole almosst except for the 1b and the other cicada models as a whole almost.

Edited by Deadoon, 30 November 2012 - 12:37 AM.


#16 Voidsinger

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Posted 30 November 2012 - 12:38 AM

Interesting idea. Let's expand upon it.

All mechs have been given C3i capability built in. We have no choice in the matter.

This means Draconis Combine mechs are cheated of having an extremely powerful tool at their disposal. This tool is available in 3050.

So, add to this list any mech that has C3 Master/Slave capability should be able to get ECM as compensation (yes, they were robbed).

Then you have the whole issue of NARC and SRMs. No NARC for SRMs, and no special ammunition needed for LRMs.

Then there is targetting computers. What will people gain if their mech gets one, given the cursor already does this.

They gave AMS to everybody, yet made Streaks so fast, AMS cannot intercept. So any mech that needs to face Streaks should get the capability. This forces Streak mechs to operate in ECCM mode to use Streaks, and thus they have no targetting defence against LRMs.

#17 Armorpiercer M82

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Posted 30 November 2012 - 12:44 AM

definetly no.

#18 Deadoon

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Posted 30 November 2012 - 12:47 AM

View PostArmorpiercer M82, on 30 November 2012 - 12:44 AM, said:

definetly no.

Why not, seriously make a viable argument that isn't just word of god.

#19 Wizard Steve

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Posted 30 November 2012 - 12:48 AM

View PostDeadoon, on 29 November 2012 - 11:18 PM, said:

Problem is by buffing these mechs with such a powerful EW suite which the only true hard counter to is itself you cause stagnation in mech choice.

We have that already but further balancing efforts will improve the situation. The ECM suite as it's currently laid out will get balanced too. I see no reason for people to be getting their knickers in a twist.

#20 Znail

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Posted 30 November 2012 - 12:49 AM

The entire issue with ECM is that it's too strong, not that it's limited to a few mechs.





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