80 replies to this topic

[Multitallented]

This thread is irrelevant because skill had nothing to do with the tournament, only number of games played.

[Gaan Cathal]

One Medic Army, on 25 February 2013 - 01:36 PM, said:

Seems fairly close.
A bit less piecemeal, but confirms that if you're aiming at the nose your shots are going to be spread between CT and RT/LT. Aim for the groin/legs I suppose.

Based on my experience of people shooting at my nosecone...

If your gun is higher than the Raven and you want to go for the CT, shoot the top of the nose, drag upwards as they bank.

If your gun is lower than the Raven, you don't want to go for the CT. If you decide to anyway, go for the bit where the legs join, if you can, but really you should be trying for a leg.

[Ninthshadow]

I got to where I did with a Com-2D, Com-3A and Com-1D in that order of preference. I did run with a ECM on the 2D but the fact is the Streak/ECM combo was devestating. It was the closest thing to a counter I could find.

I built for hit and run on larger mechs, tearing up rear armor with SRMs.What I'd call 'light hunters' tore me apart with very little I could do about it besides stopping their lock-on for the most part. If they had ECM, it brought me a second while they switched to countering mine but usually it simply delayed the inevitable.

The best pilots just brought tag along so even ECM meant I was toast under those circumstances. Either I have major flaws in my (limited) skill and my Mech design or there isn't a reliable way to counter that. If there is, I could not find it for love or money.

That said I feel the Commando pulled its weight. Despite what the light class is typically meant to be about Coms are definately more about sticking with the pack unless you drastically change their armaments. If you think Role warfare is all about the weight, so 'all lights must be scouts', then of course the commando is going to score pretty low. As a brawler however, it is not so bad.

It is hard not to feel like a few types of Mech got a really raw deal. I won't even pretend to know about how 'balanced' any of this is though.

Edit: Fixed up my english a little bit and a few more thoughts.

Edited by Ninthshadow, 25 February 2013 - 02:23 PM.

[JohnoBurr]

Relevant.



This was from yesterday. Not only does this highlight the issue of the 3L, but it also shows how terrible of a job elo is doing to make a decent match. I mean come on, 6 lights on one team against nearly all heavies and assaults? How is that supposed to work?

Edited by JohnoBurr, 25 February 2013 - 02:23 PM.

[Flapdrol]

^^^
that's one helluva tonnage diff.

[Pihb]

I predict bad things coming to the raven after this tournament. Lrm's as well.

[Tennex]

Flapdrol, on 25 February 2013 - 02:23 PM, said:

^^^
that's one helluva tonnage diff.

they probably still did fine cuz they had all those 3Ls lol

[JohnoBurr]

Tennex, on 25 February 2013 - 02:28 PM, said:

they probably still did fine cuz they had all those 3Ls lol

No, they lost horribly.

[Sean von Steinike]

Mister Blastman, on 25 February 2013 - 11:10 AM, said:

The _only_ reason the 3L is the "best" light is ECM. No other reason.

So, Cicada is the best medium then right?

[One Medic Army]

Sean von Steinike, on 25 February 2013 - 02:47 PM, said:

So, Cicada is the best medium then right?

Cicada fills a different roll from the other mediums, hence it's classification as honorary light mech or, more colloquially: "Fat Jenner"

Edited by One Medic Army, 25 February 2013 - 02:50 PM.

[Flapdrol]

Sean von Steinike, on 25 February 2013 - 02:47 PM, said:

So, Cicada is the best medium then right?

no magic missiles

[Sean von Steinike]

Flapdrol, on 25 February 2013 - 03:01 PM, said:

no magic missiles

Only thing that mattered to the person I quoted was ECM.

[Gremlich Johns]

with no knockdown implemented, this event really says nothing about light pilot skills other than they chose the proper mechs and equipment to participate with.

Edited by Gremlich Johns, 25 February 2013 - 03:15 PM.

[Soulscour]

hammerreborn, on 25 February 2013 - 11:15 AM, said:

Exactly. No one cares about an ECM raven with an srm6, it's the perfect storm that's the issue.

ECM makes it stronger than average against LRMs
ECM then makes streaks more effective against other streaks
Streaks make lights cry

Mediums+ laugh at streaks
Mediums+ can't hit ravens due to hitbox/netcode issues
Mediums+ cry



So Spiders < Ravens because Ravens have streaks
But Cicadas < Cents/Hunch because Cicada's low weight
Cents/Hunchs (with ECM) > cicadas because of high weight? (no, because they'd use streaks).

ECM + Streaks are the horriblest combination of items in the game. Nerfing one won't fix the other, which is why all the remove ECM threads are bad. The combination of ECM + Streaks is what's breaking the game balance wise on the most part, and needs to be shattered (basically, like the suggestions that if you have ECM you can't use streaks).

Your perception of medium class is just wrong and seems to be shared among most light pilots to thier detriment.
3SRM6 + aiming > ecm raven(or any other light mech)
It only takes 2 solid hits. A large amount of my kills this week were ecm commandos and ravens trying to cap rush. The only time I couldnt hit was ravens with over 200ping which is rare.

[Lavrenti]

Nicholas Carlyle, on 25 February 2013 - 11:09 AM, said:

Can you imagine of a Cent or Huchie had ECM?

Oh God, please give my Hunchbacks ECM. I will never pilot anything else...

[Sug]

JohnoBurr, on 25 February 2013 - 02:21 PM, said:

I mean come on, 6 lights on one team against nearly all heavies and assaults? How is that supposed to work?

I can't believe those lights lost.

Nicholas Carlyle, on 25 February 2013 - 11:11 AM, said:

Well it's a combination of 3 things really. ECM, Streaks and Hit Box. But ECM is the biggest factor for sure.

Agreed.

I could deal with 3Ls if i could hit them, but I can't hit them so I need to use streaks, but I can't since they have ECM, so i'll just use a PPC that knocks out their ECM when I hit them, but i can't them...

[JohnoBurr]

Sug, on 25 February 2013 - 05:04 PM, said:

I can't believe those lights lost.

Thankfully I'm a good shot.

[Sug]

Soulscour, on 25 February 2013 - 03:23 PM, said:

3SRM6 + aiming > ecm raven(or any other light mech)
It only takes 2 solid hits.

I have enough trouble hitting them with freaking lases much less something that has a travel time. My ping is usually around 25 and I'll still need to lead a circling Raven by about an inch no matter what their ping is.

[One Medic Army]

Soulscour, on 25 February 2013 - 03:23 PM, said:

Your perception of medium class is just wrong and seems to be shared among most light pilots to thier detriment.
3SRM6 + aiming > ecm raven(or any other light mech)
It only takes 2 solid hits. A large amount of my kills this week were ecm commandos and ravens trying to cap rush. The only time I couldnt hit was ravens with over 200ping which is rare.

Their hitboxes seem to give me issues getting those hits to register.
Example: fighting a 3L and a Jenner in a 2v1 match, in one of my Trebuchets (4xML+2SRM6).
Pounding at the raven for a good 30 seconds, SRMs shown as impacting but never deal damage, lasers turn his armor yellow but no more.
Fire once at the Jenner and he explodes (he had already lost CT armor).
Continue to ineffectually fire at the 3L, I think I got some of his armor to orange by the time he finishes killing me.
Ask Eboli if you want verification, he was the Jenner.

[Gaan Cathal]

hammerreborn, on 25 February 2013 - 11:15 AM, said:

Exactly. No one cares about an ECM raven with an srm6, it's the perfect storm that's the issue.

Oh believe me, if I have a good match I tend to attract all the rage. Amusingly, most of it is about my 'ECM/Streak/3 lamerness'. This is irrespective of the fact that I run SRMs in all my Raven missile slots, and more than once I've had the StreakECMRavenNoob rant in my -2X.

People just see the beaky profile and flip out. I have perfectly capable (based on a couple second observation, granted) pilots flip out and just spray and pray in my general direction, laser-boating mediums completely ignore me (guys, it's your job to kill me if I'm in the brawl) and all sorts of nonsense.



Edited for spelling derp

Edited by Gaan Cathal, 25 February 2013 - 05:11 PM.