419 replies to this topic

[MaddMaxx]

Ngamok, on 26 February 2013 - 07:39 AM, said:

No worries. Even if they are firing out of NARC tubes, it's still funny to watch 6 waves or 6 missles going off. But it would make hitting all of them harder to land.

Yea, bad part is only dumb splatcat drivers will be out in the open waiting to have their ears stripped. The others will be behind a hill where their team is sniping till someone gets close then BLAM.

And you blame the Cat drivers for that? Wowzers. No wonder so many die to them so foolishly...

[Lightfoot]

The A1 and K2 are why I never started piloting a Catapult. I did at first in June of the Closed Beta, I remember posting here, "Are you sure you want the A1 to have 6 missile hardpoints?", because I made a SSRM2 and a SRM6 X6 versions right away and was laughing at being able to take out an Atlas in two shots to the CT with the SRM6 version. I trashed them and never bought another A1, but I thought the Devs would do a Hardpoint revamp to maintain sort of a RP game balance.

Anyway, they also taught me to read the loadouts before engaging mechs. Like Sunday I was being stalked by a K2 2x AC20, a devastating mech, if you let it get too close. I was faster so I lured him out on the flat of River City. He followed and I took him down with ERPPCs and SSRMs. That's the weakness of both these mechs, they need to be close or firing on a stationary target.

[Sug]

Lightfoot, on 26 February 2013 - 08:58 AM, said:

I was faster so I lured him out on the flat of River City. He followed and I took him down with ERPPCs and SSRMs. That's the weakness of both these mechs, they need to be close or firing on a stationary target.

Sounds like the weakness of that particular cat was its pilot.

[Elandyll]

I think that the problem with the splatcat is not just one thing, but the sum of its advantages:

- A relatively fast build (74kph or above w/ XL engine)
- Decent Armor (Heavy & No need to strip a lot of armor like on a 2xAC20, this last one also not being able to use XL engines)
- Decent amount of Ammo (again, sometimes not the case for dual AC20)
- Relatively Heat safe
- Jump Jets on top
- Has an enormous Alpha at 90dmg, even if limited to close range (under 270m, preferably under 180 - ideally at 90m and under for spread)

So in the end, and with all the cover available (with the possible exception for Alpine, and even then not that much), a decent pilot will manage to get close to you in some way.
Result: Unless you are surrounded by your friends who could fire focus him down (or are a fast light able to get out of dodge), you have exactly 5 seconds before being blown to bits (cooldown at 3.75, leaving some room for aiming adjustment). The First Alpha will likely remove a nice chunk from you, and the second one, even possibly for an Atlas, will probably be the last one needed.
5 seconds is all you have to decide between Flee or Fight (obviously an Assault won't have as much choice), knowing that your entire core armor (generally around 90 for an Atlas) was probably removed by that first shot unless you were lucky (if you were shot in the back, you are probably dead already anyway).

Besides a headshot that requires either/ or luck or skill, I do not know anything that can bring down anything (including an Atlas) so fast, and leaving so little time for fighting back.

In those 5 seconds, you probably have the time for 1 shot back (UAC5s and AC2s will try to rock the opponent's aim, which may sometimes work - until the 3rd salvo that is). The best bet is for as big as an Alpha as you can muster directly to the cockpit and hope to do a headshot. Ears? Leave that for when you have some distance. 40pts armor + internals means that the 'Pult will get at least 2-3 shot at you before you even take down 1 ear.

I think in the end what annoys most people with the admitedly poorly designed A1 (a pure LRM boat in design), is that even a bad player is likely to score at least 1 kill before he is taken down.
A good player? He can probably carry his team to victory, unless focus fired early.

Some will say that this is true of many builds in the game, when played well. Yes, that is true.
Off the top of my head the Raven 3L, Cicada 3M, Gausspult, Many Phracts builds (including the new FOTM 3D poptart), LRM/SRM or PPC boat Stalker and the DDC can be played to very effective effects.
But I happen to think that none of those builds pack as many advantages as the A1 (a great blend of speed, armor and damage). The one exception could possibly be the Raven 3L which blends incredible speed with ECM and Streaks.

Again, in the end, what gives the (correct or not) impression of being "OP" I believe, is not the -1- main advantage (6xSRM6 for A1, ECM for Raven) but the cumulation of many in one deadly package.

[Ghogiel]

Lightfoot, on 26 February 2013 - 08:58 AM, said:

because I made a SSRM2 and a SRM6 X6 versions right away and was laughing at being able to take out an Atlas in two shots to the CT with the SRM6 version. I trashed them

The splat cat in closed beta was pretty much crap because no DHS.

[Kludger]

As an Atlas and Hunchie driver who has fallen victim to splatcats the last couple of days and gotten frustrated, I wanted to mention this thread has helped me deal with the frustration.

I don't support a nerf but I think they are cheese and the pilots who use them are lame cheese, especially when they brag about their kill count.

But I also now realize I have some things I need to do better myself in my play style to increase my chances against them, mainly I need to be on specific lookout for them more so than assault mechs and I need to be ready to text chat their location and hope my PUG teammates are smart enough to focus on them instead of the Atlas/Stalker.

So kudos to the thread, even though the QQ is useless and those defending the Splatcat cheese overlook the advantage they have, the dialogue has helped get the word out on how to counter it, let's hope more PUGs are better informed now and prioritize it.

[Penance]

Fros7bite, on 26 February 2013 - 09:23 AM, said:

The EQRG does specific drills to teach people how to get away from short range 'Mechs.

Talk about ****-retentive. You guys must've been toilet trained at gunpoint...

Drills..for a game..LOL!

Edited by Penance, 26 February 2013 - 09:25 AM.

[Sug]

Fros7bite, on 26 February 2013 - 09:23 AM, said:

. The EQRG does specific drills to teach people how to get away from short range 'Mechs.

I'd love to know how they teach people to get away from cheesecats.

[Yokaiko]

Sug, on 26 February 2013 - 09:26 AM, said:

I'd love to know how they teach people to get away from cheesecats.

Get out of the Atlas, I tear apart many splatcats in my Dragons, once in the tunnel on the ice map (abnormal, I though I was ****** too)

[Alto]

Cairbre, on 25 February 2013 - 11:32 AM, said:

This too, is Battletech. Believe it or not, the Splatcat is not the worst case scenario- behold!

http://www.sarna.net/wiki/SRM_Carrier

60 SRMs, in a tiny little truck. It could hide behind have a building, or in a small trench, and disintegrate its target.

And at 1,932,800 c-bills an absolute snip...

[Alvor]

To curb suicidal xgamer style alpha dumping players there needs to be a penalty for losing a mech, repairs, & reloads.

This is a problem with most FPS/Sims is that there usually is little consequence for reckless actions and tactics.

In the MechWarrior universe it was common for mechs to retreat from the mission if it was too damaged.

To summarize if using Canon BT/MW:
Enforce the Dispossessed status/penalty & repair/reload costs.

All this information was taken from http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Main_Page which is one of the best resources for Battletech information.

http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Dispossessed

Dispossessed describes the state of having lost or otherwise not having a BattleMech at one's disposal in the BattleTech universe. It is typically used to contrast against the status of an active MechWarrior (pilot). The word carries a strong stigma. In the feudal societies that had formed after the fall of the Star League, especially in the lostech-ridden final years of the Third Succession War at the beginning of the 31st century, a BattleMech virtually guaranteed its owner wealth and status. In many respects it was the equivalent to a medieval knighthood, and at the same time the actual arms and armor of the MechWarrior. Serving as a MechWarrior could result in a noble title, land grants and fiefs. Often, families or whole fiefs were dependant on the income of a single MechWarrior.
Conversely, losing the 'Mech in battle or to a technical breakdown meant a sudden and drastic fall in social status, causing great grief. Many Dispossessed join conventional military branches (especially infantry or armor units), hoping that one day they can acquire a BattleMech through salvage.
Although typically meant in a permanent sense, the term can also be used to describe a temporary separation of a MechWarrior from his 'Mech, for example because a superior Lord denies the right to pilot a 'Mech (as it happened to Minobu Tetsuhara) or because the 'Mech and its pilot are shipped separately (the reason why Kai Allard-Liao piloted a borrowed 'Mech on Twycross).
The term has also been used to describe aerospace pilots who had lost their fighters.

[Alvor]

Yokaiko, on 26 February 2013 - 07:51 AM, said:

I one shotted a splatcat that way, dude had ammo in his ears, I hit him once with a pair of gauss rounds and he when nuclear...I had a chuckle.

Its up there with Guass+XL engined atlases on the mechlab failure scale.

How is a "Guass+XL engine Atlas" a "mechlab failure scale"?

This combo has worked great for me for over 1k in kills and who knows how many assists.

Especially now with Alpine Peaks that combo is even better.

[Royalewithcheese]

Alvor, on 26 February 2013 - 09:53 AM, said:

How is a "Guass+XL engine Atlas" a "mechlab failure scale"?

One of the first things people usually focus down on a DDC is the RT because of the big gun(s). A gauss and XL engine in there = DDC gets blowed up real good real quick in a brawl. However, if the combo works for you it works for you, of course

Edited by Royalewithcheese, 26 February 2013 - 10:23 AM.

[Yokaiko]

Alvor, on 26 February 2013 - 09:53 AM, said:

How is a "Guass+XL engine Atlas" a "mechlab failure scale"?

This combo has worked great for me for over 1k in kills and who knows how many assists.

Especially now with Alpine Peaks that combo is even better.

To narrow in application, I look for atlases with gausses (I have one too) and blow off that gauss, 9/10 times its the end of that mech.

...my gauss Atlas has a standard engine.

Edited by Yokaiko, 26 February 2013 - 10:30 AM.

[Sug]

Yokaiko, on 26 February 2013 - 09:30 AM, said:

Get out of the Atlas, I tear apart many splatcats in my Dragons, once in the tunnel on the ice map (abnormal, I though I was ****** too)

Yeah never actually been in an Atlas.

[Sheraf]

well, we need more big maps. That will solve the problem

[SpartanFiredog317]

Its not the 'splat' .... its the 'cat'. ...If catapults didn't have a damn near 360 arc of fire and rival the speed of most heavy weapon medium builds there would be no issue.

[Zeh]

Alvor, on 26 February 2013 - 09:53 AM, said:

How is a "Guass+XL engine Atlas" a "mechlab failure scale"?

This combo has worked great for me for over 1k in kills and who knows how many assists.

Especially now with Alpine Peaks that combo is even better.

It's probably only a problem when you get in the upper levels of ELO. People will see an Atlas with a gauss and focus your RT immediately. I know I will in my PPC stalker. One crit to that gauss and you just died. Seems like a pretty big liability to me.

Edited by Zeh, 26 February 2013 - 10:34 AM.

[Yokaiko]

Sug, on 26 February 2013 - 10:30 AM, said:

Yeah never actually been in an Atlas.

Have three variants master moduled actually. I most certainly have been in an Atlas, in fact I won 7-8 8 mans the other night in my D-DC.

[DrxAbstract]

Since this weekend gave me an extra 40mill CBills to play around with, i decided to fill in the Elite and Master skills of my Founders CPLT-C1, which meant buying two other variants; I chose the A1 and K2. The K2 was pretty underwhelming, although i ran the Dual UAC5 and it was fun, it didnt seem to have much in the way of debilitating power. The games went by quickly and i had the Basic skills filled in with enough to Elite it after working on the A1's Basics...

Now we come to the A1... I've run Missileboats before in a variety of configs - 6x LRM5s, LRM20s+LRM15s, 6x LRM10s, etc. Ive done that all before, so i equipped 6x SRM6s against my better judgement, loaded up 700 rounds of ammo and hit Launch. It was slower, bulkier and ran pretty warm compared to my other mechs and the fact i had to get within 150m of my targets, considering where some of them were, wsant all that appealing... but let me tell you, nothing i've driven before has sent people to the scrap pile or fleeing into the hills faster than this thing did. I killed 3 Atlas, a fellow SRM A1 and 1 Raven 3L that game for the majority by myself... Dropped back into the Mech Lab, switched two SRM6s out for two SRM4s, added another heat sink, 1 more ton of ammo and reduced the engine size by 1 ton to add Jumpjets... Next game: 2 Ravens, 1 Jenner, 2 Atlas dead, again, mostly alone.

I will admit the SRM A1 is tons of fun, but now that i have the Basic and 1 more Elite skill to go, i cant in good conscience keep driving the thing after that point - the damn thing is such an unruly monster the few people that tried to range or avoid me were manipulated into conflict anyway because of Cap Points or the Base Cap... Fun, yes... A complete faith ravager, certainly. Not my cup of tea... i'll stick to my Jenner.