20 replies to this topic

[Oni Ralas]

Let me first say that I have railed on the 3L for a while now given it's current imbalance issues. I had vowed not to roll one until they resolve it, but I'm running out of stuff to pilot

So after purchasing and outfitting with pretty close to the std fit (only had an XL250 sitting around to use) I will say that yes - this chassis, as it stands, is overpowered. I really think it comes down to the hitbox. Fully armored up and running at ~115kph, I shrugged off a massive amount of laser fire (it did hit, but did little) but kinetic weapons always did the correct damage. This is inline with what we've already shown in testing. The chassis itself is much fun to play, the sense of speed is excellent and I ran it is a proper scout and opportunistic striker, rather than trying to be some superhero mech.


The ECM thing? Yeah that is the icing on the cake that is really pushing it over the edge. I get the concept, and I did my job jamming out other ECM boats in the area (in doing so, left my self open often) but right now it's just too much. The chassis can't go down fast enough to make that much potential firepower, speed and armor justifiable, especially with a "stealth" mod on it. I love the concept of EWAR, but the current implementation (to me anyway) isn't quite there yet on the chassis it can exist on.


With all that being said - I had a blast running with another 3L (new pilot just like me) and we'll be running them for a while to elite. Just can't do it too much... don't want that high Elo score putting me up with the good players :|

[Tennex]

pesky light mechs got you down? no problem buy a 3L.

they will never be able to nerf the 3Lchasss though, nor should they. iit comes standard with the missile hrad points and ECM.

Edited by Tennex, 26 February 2013 - 10:08 AM.

[Arkmaus]

Tennex makes a good point.

The Raven 3L uses what it has. THe only way to really "nerf" it would be to remove/change aspects of the chassis that would essentially make it...well, not a 3L.

[Bilbo]

Oni Ralas, on 26 February 2013 - 05:43 AM, said:

Let me first say that I have railed on the 3L for a while now given it's current imbalance issues. I had vowed not to roll one until they resolve it, but I'm running out of stuff to pilot

So after purchasing and outfitting with pretty close to the std fit (only had an XL250 sitting around to use) I will say that yes - this chassis, as it stands, is overpowered. I really think it comes down to the hitbox. Fully armored up and running at ~115kph, I shrugged off a massive amount of laser fire (it did hit, but did little) but kinetic weapons always did the correct damage. This is inline with what we've already shown in testing. The chassis itself is much fun to play, the sense of speed is excellent and I ran it is a proper scout and opportunistic striker, rather than trying to be some superhero mech.


The ECM thing? Yeah that is the icing on the cake that is really pushing it over the edge. I get the concept, and I did my job jamming out other ECM boats in the area (in doing so, left my self open often) but right now it's just too much. The chassis can't go down fast enough to make that much potential firepower, speed and armor justifiable, especially with a "stealth" mod on it. I love the concept of EWAR, but the current implementation (to me anyway) isn't quite there yet on the chassis it can exist on.


With all that being said - I had a blast running with another 3L (new pilot just like me) and we'll be running them for a while to elite. Just can't do it too much... don't want that high Elo score putting me up with the good players :|

You aren't shrugging off the laser fire. They aren't keeping it on target for several reasons, netcode being most notable. There is still a lagshield. it just isn't as noticable. It becomes much more noticable on all the fast ecm mechs.

[BGrey]

Why not switch its engine max size with one of the useless varients, tone it down and actually make another varient work playing.

[TroglodyteJB]

It's a shame. I would love to play a fast ECM Raven without feeling like I'm cheesing, but the firepower and survivability of the 3L is just craziness, even in my slow build (subbed out the XL engine because ~70% of my deaths were from L/R torso destruction after missile barrages).

I think the 3L will be less rough when they resolve some of the hit concerns and IF they resolve some of the ridiculous power of ECM, but right now I can't play my favorite mech without feeling like I'm cheesing. I want to be an EWAR light without being overpowered!

[EmeraldSongbird]

I don't know you, but being a Steiner with a 3L I'm sure you can figure out we wouldn't get along too well.

Respect Level -1

[EvilCow]

There is no need to nerf the 3L, they need to work on the ECM and Streaks, it is that combo that is insane.

Probably few more months of data analysis will reveal that...

[verybad]

EvilCow, on 26 February 2013 - 10:25 AM, said:

There is no need to nerf the 3L, they need to work on the ECM and Streaks, it is that combo that is insane.

Probably few more months of data analysis will reveal that...

Well lets not make hasty decisions here...

[TroglodyteJB]

EvilCow, on 26 February 2013 - 10:25 AM, said:

There is no need to nerf the 3L, they need to work on the ECM and Streaks, it is that combo that is insane.

Probably few more months of data analysis will reveal that...

I don't think we really need data analysis to know that ECM is, if not outright overpowered, uncomfortably high on the power level scale.

As for Streaks, I'd like to see them tuned AFTER ECM is tuned down a bit. I'm actually more concerned about SRM-6 burst than SSRM-2s since the only problem I have with streaks is the interaction between SSRM-2 and ECM on the 3L.

[Voridan Atreides]

I'm not that kind of guy. I will stand up and fight 3Ls all day...and die a lot but I will never buy one! Be a man and pilot a real mech!

[One Medic Army]

If lasers worked as well vs Ravens as they do against other light mechs, it would be enough for me at the moment.

I do think ECM needs to be looked at (mainly for how it monopolizes rather than reduces Streak usage, and how it blocks friendly positions).

[Voridan Atreides]

Doobles, on 26 February 2013 - 10:24 AM, said:

I don't know you, but being a Steiner with a 3L I'm sure you can figure out we wouldn't get along too well.

Respect Level -1

Lol as soon as I saw he was a Steiner I knew what the real problem was.

[Mawai]

TroglodyteJB, on 26 February 2013 - 10:29 AM, said:

I don't think we really need data analysis to know that ECM is, if not outright overpowered, uncomfortably high on the power level scale.

As for Streaks, I'd like to see them tuned AFTER ECM is tuned down a bit. I'm actually more concerned about SRM-6 burst than SSRM-2s since the only problem I have with streaks is the interaction between SSRM-2 and ECM on the 3L.

Hmmm .... don't you recall the Streakcat days pre-ECM? The streaks haven't changed ... Streakcats would be just as brutal now if they could reliably apply their damage. Splatcats were an option in the Streakcat days but not that popular since they require a lot more tonnage and the mech moves slower.

Both SSRM and LRM need tuning ... ECM has hidden that fact for now. Unfortunately, all of these need to be addressed at the same time.

[Livewyr]

Wanna even out the 3L? Take away the Angel ECM and Stealth Armor aspects from Guardian ECM.

The the 3L will be just as vulnerable to Jenners and Commandos. (Spiders would still be hosed against other lights due to lack of missile hard points.)

[Shadowsword8]

Tennex, on 26 February 2013 - 10:06 AM, said:

pesky light mechs got you down? no problem buy a 3L.

they will never be able to nerf the 3Lchasss though, nor should they. iit comes standard with the missile hrad points and ECM.

Or they could, as an example, remove the Null-Signature System from ECM (completely separate in TT, take 7 critical slots and generate as much heat as a permanently active PPC).

The 3L was never supposed to have that for free, and that's a big part of what make it overpowered.

[Todesgeliebter]

Shadowsword8, on 26 February 2013 - 10:43 AM, said:

Or they could, as an example, remove the Null-Signature System from ECM (completely separate in TT, take 7 critical slots and generate as much heat as a permanently active PPC).

The 3L was never supposed to have that for free, and that's a big part of what make it overpowered.

Ding ding ding ding! We have a winner!

-todes

[Gauss Master]

Honestly, the only danger a RVN-3L pilot faces from laser fire comes from organized 4/8 man groups. In typical solo drops, the average puggle is severely retically challenged.

One thing I've noticed happening in pug drops is, any ecm equipped mech is one that, more often than not, doesn't even get fired at until it gets close enough that the full red box can appear. I realize that folks are worried about taking a hit for a tk, but I'm not sure what they seem to be so scared of.

Here's a hint: You have to be able to hit the mech, for it to count if you happen to kill it.

[Oni Ralas]

Bilbo, on 26 February 2013 - 10:11 AM, said:

You aren't shrugging off the laser fire. They aren't keeping it on target for several reasons, netcode being most notable. There is still a lagshield. it just isn't as noticable. It becomes much more noticable on all the fast ecm mechs.

Thats what I'm saying -- the hits are scorring (they are makign contact) but there is still a disconnect on the score talley due to speed and other factors. Some folks still scream that it's bad pilots and that lagshields don't exist -- but they most certainly do.

Doobles, on 26 February 2013 - 10:24 AM, said:

I don't know you, but being a Steiner with a 3L I'm sure you can figure out we wouldn't get along too well.

Respect Level -1

Like I said, it was for science!

[VitusFitzWoven]

same old discussion in another thread,
so i turn off the light and go to bed...


P.S.: i like the little naggers - they are fun and i play my 3l even if it gets nerfed some day